Theos-Talk Archives (December 2004 Message tt00084)

Hallo Krishtar and all,

My views are given using *** in the below.

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "krishtar" <krishtar_a@brturbo.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2004 7:04 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho -Morten



Hello, thanks for replying!

" Re-asking":about Idries Shah

You said that it is not for everyone.
Did you mean that not everybody is prepared to understand Idries.?
***
Yes. That is one of the views.
***

If it is so, it has to do a bit with one of the aforisms of KarmaYoga, which 
(if I can remember the right or aproximate words)says that Karma also 
determines how far or how deep the seeker can realise certain truths or 
studies in a lifetime.
What is your opinion?
***
It could be true. But another use of words could also be relevant.
Such as the right time, place, people and circumstances when reading Idries 
Shah's book or considering his offers.
***

There are lots of people who read and read, study and study, jump from one 
esoteric movement to another, but at the end they seem not to understand 
even the basis from the path´s rudiments.
***
Yes. I remember something about Annie Besant was putting a great emphasis on 
that theosophical members should read much and truely absorb the 
theosophical teaching on not only a superficial level. Blavatsky did just 
about the same, but she talked much more about avoiding the use of the 
dead-letter while reading and teaching - and gave however less importance to 
the value of reading. Well so far my views on the matter.
***


While others, as fast as he can get a book and read it , it instantly gets 
absorbed and understood.
And the most interesting is that they change interiorly.
***
Sometimes they change so much, that they only write quality emails when the 
write at all.
> :-)
M. Sufilight with peace and love...
***

Speculatively, Karma through the skandas can also determine whence you can 
go on the next time the thread of conscience ( the " spirit" )begins the 
learning...

Krishtar

----- Original Message ----- 
From: M. Sufilight
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2004 3:36 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho -Morten



Hallo Krishtar and all,

My views are:

Krishtar asked:
"Please, what did you mean with the expression " 1. First. I am not saying
that books under the name Idries Shah are for
everyone."?"

My answer:
What part of the expression do you not understand or are in doubt about?

I think some people are not aware of that Theosophy is the same as pure
esoteric Buddhism or esoteric Adwaita + the the teachings of the 
Upanishads
if the dead-letter is avoided.


from
M. Sufilight

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "krishtar" <krishtar_a@brturbo.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2004 10:53 AM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho -Morten



Hi Morten
Please, what did you mean with the expression " 1. First. I am not saying
that books under the name Idries Shah are for
everyone."?

_______________________________________
I am used to reading on the Adwaita philolosophy, such as Vivekananda´s,
some Patanjali´s sutras , some excerpts from the sage Ramana Maharshi,
Shankara...but no serious compromises of a real study.
There are, IMO, three instances in the path: to read for information only,
to read and understand and the other, the main task of the seeker, to
practise.
The practise of Adwaita is limited by our level of conscience ( or
ignorance...)
As far as we are still living on the mind realms, we are still just 
reading
about duality in books which preach non-duality.
It is relatively funny.
I gess there is a hat-size for each size of head...But this level of books
are for helping to get rid of ignorance.
If you meant this, it is not a book for any person, is for those who want 
to
incorporate elements for an higher inner seek.
When I was young I used to get satisfied by the explanations of church
books...then with spiritist books, now, things change and the search is
different.
Regards and many thanks for the help on Idries Shah books!
______________________________________


I agree with you and say with my own words what i understanding of what 
you
said:
It is possible to dicuss Osho from a Theosophical view, but analise his
controverses and defend prejudices produces no fruits.
I think he was a sage in many of his lectures and concentrates many
interesting views.
Who has ever told where wisdom is? It´s almost everywhere. We must look 
for
it with an open mind.
______________________________________________________________

Krishtar


Krishtar
----- Original Message ----- 
From: M. Sufilight
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 6:15 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho



Hallo Krishtar and all,

My views are:

1. First. I am not saying that books under the name Idries Shah are for
everyone.
2. Second. I could suggest the books a) first "The Sufis" and b) 
secondly
"The Way of the Sufi" as some of the first books to get aquainted with.

The Octagon Press who is behind the books has (as far as I know) a 
policy,
which has sought to make the books available in nearly every large 
library
(at least) in the western hemisphere.
So you could try one of the big libraries in your neighbourhood and see 
if
they have the books mentioned.

Idries Shah's teachings has in fact many similarities to esoteric 
Adwaita
and the Upanishad teachings as well as Esoteric Buddhism - if one cares 
to
read behind the veils of the dead-letter.


M. Sufilight



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "krishtar" <krishtar_a@brturbo.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 8:47 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho



Dear Morten
Sincerely, I never read a book by Idries, although I had seen one in a
bookstore months ago.
I am a total ignorant on Sufism...
Maybe you could help me giving the lightest books´ list for a
beginner...yep?
Waiting

Krishtar
_______________________________________
About Rajneesh:

I didn´t mean to discuss in that level Morten, I was just trying to 
find
someone here that could trade a few impressions on him, with open mind 
and
with no preconceived ideas. A theosophist as one said have to look for 
the
truth and answers to his question-marks with dilligence, wisdom, or I
wouldn´t take my time, sit and read and write with my poor eenglisch (
smile), I am an ignorant looking for answers and, as human I am, I get 
a
bit annoyed with the lack of empathy and compassion by many who even
occupied important positions inside TS and its branches. Not only over
here
but in many places.
We sometimes criticize many old theosophers from the beginning of the
movement but nowadays we see that these criticisms come from people who
seem
that daily they loose the rare oportunities to be gentle and warmhearted
when a single divergence arrises.
If the group or media did not permit a true and openminded freedom of
thought with respect and empathy there is no worth in discussing such
important matters.
It is just a sincere and though imprecise point of view.

K


----- Original Message ----- 
From: M. Sufilight
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 3:43 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho



Hallo friends and all,

My views are:

I think I have referred to the below words before.
But I will gladly state them again:

"The bitter truth is that before man can know his own inadequacy,
or the competence of another man or institution, he must first learn
something which will enable him to perceive both. Note well that his
perception itself is a product of right study; not of instinct or
emotional attraction to the individual, nor yet of desiring to 'go it
alone'. This is 'Learning How To Learn."

That is why it is better to seek Learning than to discuss Osho and
others
on
a level
which leads practically almost nowhere, but into the realms of 
emotional
and
intellectual stimulations.
As it was said: We shall know them on their fruits.
(I know what I think when I compare Blavatsky with either Krishnamurti
or
Osho. But Learning and Knowledge are both important and should not be
avoided and exchanged for mere emotionalism or intellecutal 
analysing. )
> :-)
Let us not just stimulate the emotions. Let us seek to learn and to
teach
the inner esoterical organ.
Well this was just a few views.

Now I have one single - and still unanswered question:
Was Idries Shah the teacher mentioned by Blavatsky, who possibly would
arrive after the years 1975 ?
http://www.sufis.org/shah.html



from
M. Sufilight

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bart Lidofsky" <bartl@sprynet.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 6:13 AM
Subject: Re: Theos-World compassion thoughts on osho


> krishtar wrote:
> > Damn it! So it was you who wrote! (smile) If you have never read 
what
> > he said, there is nothing I can say, but if you did you would not
> > believe in any " convictions", for we know the tree by its fruits.
> That's right. I judge Osho by his actions, and not just his 
writings.
> > If one wants to know who HPB was and take the Peter Washington´s 
"The
> > Mme. Blavatsky´s Baboon" or some excerpts from the SPR it is
> > similar...one will think she was a liar and a fraud.
> Except that Peter Washington's work was not made available for peer
> review. In fact, most of his accusations about H. P. Blavatsky 
really
> were taking the statements of Alice Bailey, and attributing them to
> Blavatsky.
>
> > government " of his "disciples" interests. The intoxication was 
real
> > Bart, but remember that he used to be somebody who always talked
> > openly the truth, whomever it might concern, no everybody 
appreciates
> > it, and at that time there was much concern in making him a
> > criminal.
> So, he didn't have sex with minors? They were all lying?
>
> > simplified version in mind, the choice is yours. He never practised
> > bioterrorism. Not him. That is what I believe and I had to say.
> Here's an interesting article from one who knew him, and considered
him
> to be a holy man:
>
> http://home.att.net/~meditation/Osho.html
>
> Bart
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links



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