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Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven Strategy

Aug 11, 2010 11:34 AM
by M. Sufilight


Dear Cass and friends

My views are:

I do not think I have expressed any issue with the moderators of this forum except - asking the question about whether it seeks to be governed by the Original Programe as it was given by HPB and others in 1875-1891 - and whether they seek to deviate from it - and if so in what manner, and why?

If you are seeking to involve the forum and the Original Programe with politics - please state your reasons why this can be said to be in accordance with the Original Programe as it was given in 1875-1891 by HPB and others?



M. Sufilight


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Cass Silva 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2010 2:53 AM
  Subject: Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven Strategy


    
  Morten,

  I am referring to the politics of global inhumanity to man.  That you and others 
  have issue with the administrators, particularly on content, censorship and/or 
  advocacy of individual past theosophists continues to ignite the politics which 
  you say should not be part of the theosophical agenda.  

  >
  >Can you answer what your real core issue is?  What is your agenda?  If TS Adyar 
  >opposes your personal principles, you should know, that any attempt to bring it 
  >into line with your thinking is futile.  One cannot change a hyena into a 
  >leopard.  To expect those that see value in the teachings of Besant, Leadbeater, 
  >Bailey, Krishnamurti to abandon them because they do not adhere to Blavatsky's 
  >teachings is naive.  Theosophy, like it or not, built upon the acceptance of 
  >their works, rightly or wrongly, even with its christian bent, and to now expect 
  >an admission of error in teaching would for them mean to admit the infallibility 
  >of theosophy and its administrators.  To place Blavatsky as the one and only 
  >true advocate of Theosophy would require gargantuan moral courage to do so, 
  >and my personal belief is that there are no gargantuan personalities with this 
  >strength of character, nor is there any desire to change the status quo.
  >
  >I am hoping that Theos Talk was not established as the David to overthrow the 
  >Goliath Theosophy but as a forum for anyone interested in discussing the 
  >teachings of Blavatsky, Besant, Leadbeater, Krishnamurti, Bailey, etc etc, pro 
  >or against.  It is the individual that must decide which teacher they wish to 
  >follow. Yes, it irks me, that Blavatsky has been given secondary status at 
  >Adyar, but she herself, walked away, without any attempt to discredit those she 
  >left behind.   We have the same choice.  That Adyar is the flagship for 
  >Theosophy but not for Blavatsky is not our concern.  
  >
  >
  >Blavatsky stated that all theosophists should rid themselves of its priests can 
  >only be accomplished by individuals that see priests in the belfry.  If they do 
  >not, then kicking the horse will only result in the kicker living with a 
  >very sore leg!
  >
  >Cass     
  >
  >   
  >
  >From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@zaChB4UCv7Z7_PRPzmz9IbBIm02KAOaeO5AJ1xtg7GD4zJCVWIMx37I2zB1bCCY1g9DXgGV6xA6E_NIz6imFfRcO.yahoo.invalid>
  >To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
  >Sent: Wed, 11 August, 2010 2:40:55 AM
  >Subject: Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven 
  >Strategy
  >
  >  
  >Ordinary lawmaking politics was as you know not a part of the Original Programe 
  >in the TS in 1875-1891.
  >Even later I believe Jinarjadasa had to stop political articles in the 
  >theosophical Magazine. But about that time, Annie Besant and others had already 
  >begun to get the TS hopelessly entangled with the political party the Indian 
  >National Congress - virtually a deathblow to the theopshical doctrines and the 
  >frame of the Original Programe given in 1875-1891 in the Constitution and Rules.
  >
  >So I will have to ask you, why you insist on putting emphasis on lies and decit 
  >- instead of seeking to end the strifes of the world religions - and - the study 
  >of the INNER man as the original programe aimed at?
  >Altruism is central to the original programe of the TS, should this now be 
  >exchanged with something else - and the original TS be called a political 
  >organisation?
  >
  >M. Sufilight
  >
  >----- Original Message ----- 
  >From: Cass Silva 
  >To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2010 3:21 AM
  >Subject: Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven 
  >Strategy
  >
  >Hi Morten,
  >I'm over all the internal politics - but I believe we should be addressing 
  >global politics from a TS perspective.
  >
  >Cass
  >
  >>
  >>From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@zaChB4UCv7Z7_PRPzmz9IbBIm02KAOaeO5AJ1xtg7GD4zJCVWIMx37I2zB1bCCY1g9DXgGV6xA6E_NIz6imFfRcO.yahoo.invalid>
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
  >>Sent: Tue, 10 August, 2010 3:46:01 AM
  >>Subject: Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven 
  >>Strategy
  >>
  >> 
  >>Are theosophists of late being concerned with politics?
  >>In the old days the Original Programe was against it. Why this deviation today 

  >>year 2010?
  >>
  >>----- Original Message ----- 
  >>From: Govert Schuller 
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >>Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 6:27 PM
  >>Subject: Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven 
  >>Strategy
  >>
  >>Dear John,
  >>
  >>Yes, the Schuman/Bezemov material is very revealing. His interview with Edward 

  >>Griffin is also available on youtube and google videos. 
  >>
  >>
  >>The fact that he worked as a KGB agent in India might be of interest to 
  >>Theosophists. 
  >>
  >>
  >>http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2307456730142665916#
  >>
  >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_xdBnFPqOI&feature=PlayList&p=4CDAB99FAB5980BA&index=0
  >>
  >>
  >>
  >>BTW, Griffin started recently Project Red Pill: 
  >>http://www.realityzone.com/prp.html
  >>
  >>Govert
  >>
  >>----- Original Message ----- 
  >>From: Augoeides-222@xOcyizGB890vtkJMob7QHT2-iFjj3no8NvATB4jMceBqU4meKa7SNcllTjJYQreL5DMWkn-khG5g9EBvRGXEH58WPg.yahoo.invalid 
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >>Sent: Monday, August 09, 2010 12:10 AM
  >>Subject: Re: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven 
  >>Strategy
  >>
  >>Govert, 
  >>Thanks much for the important posts from you and your links to your articles. I 
  >
  >>have bookmarked alomost every single link in them and will be reading for 
  >>months! I especially liked the New Zealand Researcher Interview about the 
  >>history of the Chicago Communists party and ilk, I was born and raised there (on 
  >>
  >>the South side) so i can really relate to it all. I did notice that he made no 

  >>mention of that mentor Saul David Lewinsky and the book "Rule for Radicals- A 
  >>Pragmatic Primary for Practical Radicals". Some of the things mentioned have 
  >>taken place and become fact. Also I skimmed the titles about the G20 and a new 

  >>Intl. Currency, the Admin. has in it's new Statute created a new Dept. named the 
  >>
  >>"Office of the Currency" which will monitor and regulate the new social order 
  >>"Transformation. Also mention was made of certain "code words" that have been 
  >>used. The acceptance speech was made and over his shoulder was the Greek "Temple 
  >>
  >>of Apollo" a serect display especially created for the "Apollo Alliance" 
  >>benefit. 
  >>
  >>
  >>Anatoliy Galitsyn isn't the only worthy former KGB there is another thta has 
  >>extremely important instructive Video's online "Thomas Schumann" alias "Yuri 
  >>Bezmenov" an expatriate has 10 video's online that instruct about the cardinal 

  >>Stages and Elements used for the conquest and revoluntionary objectives. Google 
  >
  >>or Yahoo video search "Thomas Schuman - "Secrets of Communism" and in watching 

  >>relate to the current actions of the now and the last several decades. 
  >>
  >>
  >>In Schuman's videos describe Four Critical Stages of Revoluntrionary Change that 
  >>
  >>are required to successfully Communize a Nation: 
  >>
  >>
  >>Thomas Schumann KGB Propaganda Expert described four stages that must be 
  >>accomplished 
  >>
  >>
  >>Stages of Subversion: 
  >>
  >>1.Demoralization 15-25 years maturation period 
  >>2.Destabilization 
  >>3.Crisis 
  >>4. Normalization( the 1948 Czech process) 
  >>
  >>A. The "Elements " utilized to progress the goal are: 
  >>
  >>Activism using: 
  >>1. Religion - The Christian - Marxist Projectas one example 
  >>2.Education 
  >>3. Social Life 
  >>4.Power Structure 
  >>5. Labor Relations - Unions 
  >>6.Law and Order 
  >>
  >>Yuri Bezmenov - 
  >>>>>http://www.4shared.com/file/79865078/dbf057bs/World_Thought_Police_Yuri_Bezmenov.html<<<
  >>>>>
  >> 
  >>
  >>>>>Muckity.org<<< is a fantastic tool for discovering interactive relational 
  >>>>>mapping between persons: 
  >>>>>
  >>
  >>2008 Obama Presidential Campaign 
  >>
  >>>>>http://www.muckety.com/2008-Barack-Obama-presidential-campaign/5004664.muckety<<<
  >>>>>
  >>>>> 
  >>
  >>@008 & 2004 Senate Campaigns 
  >>
  >>>>>http://www.muckety.com/Query?name=Obama+Campaign&prev=Obama+Campaign&SearchResult=5029144&SearchResult=5004664&graph=MucketyMap<<<
  >>>>>
  >>>>> 
  >>
  >>George Soros 
  >>
  >>>>>http://www.muckety.com/George-Soros/4166.muckety<<< 
  >>
  >>The Truth about George Soros 
  >>
  >>>>>http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=the+truth+about+george+soros&btnG=Search+Images&gbv=2&aq=f&oq=&aqi=<<<
  >>>>>
  >>>>> 
  >>
  >>John 
  >>
  >>----- Original Message -----s ,emtion have taken place and become From: "Govert 
  >
  >>Schuller" <schuller@-beUx5ZTtUiIxld5l5LQtCxOxtQD56GZQDCUJfXa6YhIfBJDMosGiVKPYkHNEHYJfqoKiISQw-Bjm4et.yahoo.invalid> 
  >>
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >>Sent: Sunday, August 8, 2010 10:13:29 AM 
  >>Subject: theos-talk The Angleton-Golytsin Thesis and the Cloward-Piven Strategy 
  >
  >
  >>
  >>Dear John, 
  >>
  >>Very glad to see a fellow referring to the Golytsin thesis. I always thought it 
  >
  >>was a most reasonable and fruitfull framework to evaluate world politics and 
  >>economics. 
  >>
  >>
  >>It basically states that the Russians and Chinese have been strategically linked 
  >>
  >>since the Chinese communist takeover in 1949 and have been deceiving the West 
  >>ever since. Glasnost, Perestroika and the liberalization of East Europe were 
  >>just theatrics in service of a larger plan. 
  >>
  >>
  >>But this deception could only have been pulled off by a fifth column in the West 
  >>
  >>of fellow travellers, hidden agents and especially think tanks like the Council 
  >
  >>on Foreign Relations. 
  >>
  >>
  >>Within this framework it also makes sense to evaluate Obama's policies as 
  >>implementing the so-called Cloward-Piven Strategy of intensifying crises to 
  >>justify the change of society into a more socialist mold. 
  >>
  >>
  >>As I've stated before, all those in the Krishnamurti, Theosophical and Ascended 
  >
  >>Master movements should take this very serious. 
  >>
  >>
  >>But, don't take my word and do your homework. I have assembled throughout the 
  >>years relevant articles and sources and introduced them with my own 
  >>understanding of the many complex issues involved. 
  >>
  >>
  >>The Abiding Communist Threat in its Open and Hidden Manifestations 
  >>http://www.alpheus.org/html/articles/parapolitics/commiethreat.htm 
  >>
  >>The Abiding Threat: The Ongoing Validity of the Angleton-Golytsin Thesis 
  >>http://www.alpheus.org/html/articles/parapolitics/AbidingThreat2009.htm 
  >>
  >>Sliding into VGGD (Very Great Global Depression) 
  >>http://www.alpheus.org/html/Economy/SlidingIntoVGGD.htm 
  >>
  >>----- Original Message ----- 
  >>From: Augoeides-222@xOcyizGB890vtkJMob7QHT2-iFjj3no8NvATB4jMceBqU4meKa7SNcllTjJYQreL5DMWkn-khG5g9EBvRGXEH58WPg.yahoo.invalid 
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >>Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2010 12:17 AM 
  >>Subject: Re: theos-talk Re: Action needed 
  >>
  >>Chuck, 
  >>Well, there are many views about why things happen. Nelson Mandela was a 
  >>communist revoluntionary who organized and promoted the overthrow of the 
  >>establishment 
  >>
  >>government and was jailed for it, later, due to activism he won his release and 
  >
  >>got a Nobel "Peace" Prize. Ghandi was primarily successful in terms of the 
  >>British due the the fact that they possessed integrity, character, and strong 
  >>moral and ethical tenets which disarmed them from using the tactics that Jengis 
  >
  >>Khan applied , Stalin applied, Mao applied or Hitler applied. In some case 
  >>virtue is a deficit that insures defeat when facing an unprincipled enemy. As 
  >>for good old Gorby, it ain't what is seemed to be. Why in the world did the US 

  >>Gov. host good old Gorby and provide free offices at the Military base named the 
  >>
  >>Presidio here in California? He created his American Fondation that hooked up 
  >>with a multitude of activists groups here. Read "New Lies for Old" and "The 
  >>Peretroika Deception" by Anatoliy Galitsyn, former KBG and Head of soviet 
  >>Espionage for an eye opener on the real game.Remeber that Newsweek issue with 
  >>the cover that proclaimed "We are All Socialists Now!"??? Lol 
  >>
  >>
  >>John 
  >>
  >>---- Original Message ----- 
  >>From: "charles cosimano" < Drpsionic@eImoDIZXdGucGVBkSHIM_AR9c_QujyccFe9ynqj5zi-EC5Lo22KcrGF1Sr-9waYjUtTatpFM136h.yahoo.invalid > 
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >>Sent: Saturday, August 7, 2010 5:55:06 PM 
  >>Subject: Re: theos-talk Re: Action needed 
  >>
  >>But those were actually the result of weakness on the part of the other side. 
  >>The South Africans did not kill Nelson Mandela out of hand. The British did not 
  >
  >>simply shoot Ghandi. And the Berlin Wall fell because the Soviet Empire could 
  >>not survive and Gorbachev lost his nerve. 
  >>
  >>
  >>Chuck the Heretic 
  >>
  >>http://www.charlescosimano.com 
  >>
  >>-----Original Message----- 
  >>From: nhcareyta < nhcareyta@15OO-GJkEUImao1m2O8iOym70zLFzoM7eANGoDZQm384j5Mn9tXUrm6GJQysgnI-GPgxqWapPQbtnP79zS8.yahoo.invalid > 
  >>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  >>Sent: Sat, Aug 7, 2010 10:39 am 
  >>Subject: theos-talk Re: Action needed 
  >>
  >>"Never" is a long time. Many extraordinary and inconceivable changes have 
  >>occurred just in our lifetime. 
  >>
  >>
  >>The ending of apartheid in South Africa; bringing down the Berlin wall; the 
  >>British leaving India. 
  >>
  >>
  >>For whatever the impetus, these were monumental changes, thought impossible up 

  >>until the time they occurred. 
  >>
  >>
  >>And in any event, what's the alternative? Do nothing, say nothing? 
  >>
  >>I think not, but granted the action must be as wise as we can determine. 
  >>
  >>Never surrender to tyrany...never. 
  >>
  >>--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com , Drpsionic@... wrote: 
  >>> 
  >>> And they still may never give a damn. How do you get past the mute button? 
  >>> 
  >>> Chuck the Heretic 
  >>> 
  >>> _www.charlescosimano.com 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> In a message dated 8/6/2010 10:22:50 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
  >>> nhcareyta@... writes: 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> We wait a little longer, try a little harder...and never give up. 
  >>> 
  >>> --- In 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> _ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >>> (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) , Drpsionic@ wrote: 
  >>> > 
  >>> > And if the local constituents really don't give a damn? 
  >>> > 
  >>> > Chuck the Heretic 
  >>> > 
  >>> > www.charlescosimano.com 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > In a message dated 8/5/2010 6:20:33 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
  >>> > nhcareyta@ writes: 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > Dear John, Erica and All 
  >>> > 
  >>> > Thank you for your responses and actions. 
  >>> > 
  >>> > Thanks to the internet and its popularity these issues are now being 
  >>> aired 
  >>> > throughout the broader community. 
  >>> > Similarly, migration and asylum seeking are bringing certain cultural 
  >>> > differences to the attention of powerful western forces through 
  >>> community 
  >>> > outrage and protest. 
  >>> > Already there are broad based, community discussions on highly sensitive 
  >>> > cultural and religious practices. From female circumcision to the 
  >>> wearing of 
  >>> > the burka in all its forms, and from certain kinds of torture to 
  >>> stonings, 
  >>> > all these matters are now being discussed internationally with many 
  >>> human 
  >>> > rights groups increasing the task of community education and action. 
  >>> > Community act_ion equates to votes and it will eventually take a 
  >>> foolhardy 
  >>> > western politician to ignore the voices of their local constituents. 
  >>> > The west can then_ bring greater pressure to bear on recalcitrant 
  >>> regimes. 
  >>> > 
  >>> > Of course politics and economics are powerful forces and yes, these are 
  >>> > very early steps, but with the use of the internet and its opportunities 
  >>> to 
  >>> > act I can see the early signs of a broad based, international shift in 
  >>> > consciousness, such as we have never seen before. 
  >>> > 
  >>> > Kind regards 
  >>> > Nigel 
  >>> > 
  >>> > --- In 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ 
  >
  >
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) _ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 

  >>> __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ 
  >>> > (mailto:_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >
  >
  >>> (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) ) , Augoeides-222@ wrote: 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > Nigel, 
  >>> > > There are even video's of stoning online on Google and Yahoo video's. 
  >>> > There have been numerous articles in the last few years about retrograde 
  >>> 6th 
  >>> > century abominable punishments according the the conventions of Sharia 
  >>> Law 
  >>> > of Islamic faith . One was a young teenager who had relation with a boy 
  >>> and 
  >>> > they stoned her to death for the family "honor". There are Islamic 
  >>> > fundamentalist Personal Channels on Justin.tv ("Raah") and a few others 
  >>> that show 
  >>> > poor victum's having their fingers cut off while being tightly held by 
  >>> > several men, Men being led to a grassy area for decapitition and the 
  >>> head 
  >>> > proudly displayed sitting on the chest of the dead body. I posted a few 
  >>> of the 
  >>> > 'Family honor" murder articles on this forum a while back. I find these 
  >>> > idea's, concepts, rationalizations and practices abhorrent, abominable 
  >>> and 
  >>> > psychotic abberation in this modern world of today. The Taliban are 
  >>> perfect 
  >>> > example of terrorist suppressive_ degenerate religionism and the Wa habi 
  >>> of_ 
  >>> > Saudi Arabia was a mentor to them. In England they are requesting the 
  >>> right 
  >>> > to install Sharia Law parelell and eqeal to the British Justice 
  >>> Institute 
  >>> > itself. people never studied the History of conquest by "perfusion" and 
  >>> > "suffusion" and population displacement that is evidenced in History as 
  >>> a social 
  >>> > passive technique long established and practiced. A best present time is 
  >>> > China and Tibet where China is actively practising this historic method 
  >>> with 
  >>> > a vengeance. One morning in a future we may wake up to a dreadful 
  >>> reality 
  >>> > that slowly insidiously pervaded our social space and beingness, beware 
  >>> my 
  >>> > friends of greeks bearing gifts. 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > John 
  >>> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
  >>> > > From: "Erica L. Georgiades" <eletzerich@> 
  >>> > > To: _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) _ 
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: 
  >>>_theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ 
  >>>
  >>> > (mailto:_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >
  >
  >>> (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) _) _ 
  >>> > > Sent: Thursday, August 5, 2010 7:50:53 AM 
  >>> > > Subject: Re: theos-talk Action needed 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > Dear Nigel, 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > Death by stoning because of adultery also exists in Afghanistan and 
  >>> > Somalia. 
  >>> > > From time to time I am signing petitions against such barbarism, this 
  >>> is 
  >>> > not the 
  >>> > > first. I remember some years ago a similar case in Somalia, her name 
  >>> was 
  >>> > Aisho 
  >>> > > ...dont remember the surname. And now Sakineh... the poor women has a 
  >>> > son and 
  >>> > > a daughter and is only 42 years old. Also I just read that in Iran 
  >>> there 
  >>> > is 
  >>> > > also another 10 women waiting death-roll sentence, for the same 
  >>> reason. 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > Erica 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > ________________________________ 
  >>> > > From: nhcareyta < nhcareyta@ > 
  >>> > > To: _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) _ 
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: 
  >>>_theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ 
  >>>
  >>> > (mailto:_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >
  >
  >>> (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) _) _ 
  >>> > > Sent: Thu, August 5, 2010 5:21:19 PM 
  >>> > > Subject: Re: theos-talk Action needed 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > Dear Erica 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > In spite of the considerable political considerations you mention, all 
  >>> > of which 
  >>> > > are accurate, there have been some quite remarkable social and 
  >>> political 
  >>> > changes 
  >>> > > over recent times. Avaaz is one organisation making real headway in 
  >>> some 
  >>> > similar 
  >>> > > situations, so all may not be lost. 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > In any event, if we do nothing then certainly nothing will happen! So 
  >>> > thank you 
  >>> > > for contacting some of your fellow members. If everyone on t/talk does 
  >>> > the same 
  >>> > > a snowball reaction may occur. 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > Kind regards 
  >>> > > Nigel 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > --- In _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) _ 
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: 
  >>>_theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ 
  >>>
  >>> > (mailto:_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >
  >
  >>> (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) ) , "Erica" <eletzerich@> wrote: 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > Dear Nigel, 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > This is most barbarian thing, which is unacceptable. I think the 
  >>> > matter is in 
  >>> > > >fact an international matter and not only of influence of one country 
  >>> > or 
  >>> > > >another. 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > The United Nations could also interfere if they want. Such kind of 
  >>> law 
  >>> > should 
  >>> > > >be completely abolished. Today is Sakineh imprisoned and condemned to 
  >>> > death, 
  >>> > > >tomorrow will be another Sakineh and the thing will go on and on. 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > If there is not a strong international interference, I consider 
  >>> almost 
  >>> > > >impossible a diplomatic solution for this problem to be found. If 
  >>> Iran 
  >>> > opens one 
  >>> > > >exception, eventually they would need to change their law. And when 
  >>> one 
  >>> > has to 
  >>> > > >do with Islamic laws, is as if someone puts the hand in a "bag full 
  >>> of 
  >>> > cats". 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > So such a hope regarding Brazil and Turkey to find a diplomatic 
  >>> > solution, are 
  >>> > > >vain in my opinion. In my opinion all the internati_onal community 
  >>> > should raise 
  >>> > > >their voice and interfere, als_o stating that such a law should be 
  >>> > abolished. 
  >>> > > >But unfortunately this wont happen, because there is no oil or money 
  >>> > involved. 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > See the case of Aung San Suu kyi, years imprisoned by the military 
  >>> > regime or 
  >>> > > >Burma. Nothing was done to help the people of Burma or to release 
  >>> her, 
  >>> > except 
  >>> > > >endless diplomatic talks which resulted probably in the fact that she 
  >>> 
  >>> > is still 
  >>> > > >alive. 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > Anyway I will send some e-mails to some members of the Brazilian 
  >>> > Section I 
  >>> > > >know. 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > Erica 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > --- In _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > _ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >>> (mailto: _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ (mailto:_ ( 
  >>>http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>>
  >>> _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) _) _ , 
  >>> "nhcareyta" <nhcareyta@> wrote: 
  >>> > > > > 
  >>> > > > > Dear Erica 
  >>> > > > > 
  >>> > > > > Yes, that is correct. That is why I asked whether there are some 
  >>> > wealthy 
  >>> > > >Adyar Society Brazilian members able to bring extra influence on 
  >>> their 
  >>> > > >President, perhaps to make another, more strident attempt. 
  >>> > > > > 
  >>> > > > > That would surely be Theosophy in action. 
  >>> > > > > 
  >>> > > > > Regards 
  >>> > > > > Nigel 
  >>> > > > > 
  >>> > > > > --- In _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > _ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >>> (mailto: _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ (mailto:_ ( 
  >>>http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>>
  >>> _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) _) _ , 
  >>> "Erica L. Georgiades" 
  >>> > <eletzerich@> 
  >>> > > wrote: 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Yesterday I read on Washington Post that, Lula the Brazilian 
  >>> > President, 
  >>> > > >already 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > requested to the President of Iran to release her and give her 
  >>> > asylum in 
  >>> > > >Brazil. 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > The request of the President of Brazil was denied. 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Erica 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > ________________________________ 
  >>> > > > > > From: nhcareyta <nhcareyta@> 
  >>> > > > > > To: _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > _ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) __theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ 
  >>> (mailto: _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) __ (mailto:_ ( 
  >>>http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>>
  >>> _theos-talk@yahoogroups.com _ (mailto: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ) ) 
  >>> > > > > > Sent: Thu, August 5, 2010 3:32:23 PM 
  >>> > > > > > Subject: theos-talk Action needed 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Dear All 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Perhaps some wealthy Adyar Society Brazilian members can bring 
  >>> > additional 
  >>> > > > > > pressure to bear on their President to address this outrageous 
  >>> > issue? 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > "Dear Friends, 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Global pressure on Iran has saved Sakineh from death by stoning, 
  >>> > but within 
  >>> > > >days 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > she could still be hanged. More pressure from leaders in Brazil 
  >>> > and Turkey, 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Iran's allies, are Sakineh's last hope. Donate below to fund an 
  >>> > emergency 
  >>> > > >ad 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > campaign in Brazil and Turkey in the next 72 hours: 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Sakineh Ashtiani could be executed for adultery in Iran in the 
  >>> > next few 
  >>> > > >days, 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > but two men could still save her -- the leaders of Brazil and 
  >>> > Turkey. 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > President Lula and Prime Minister Erdo&#287;an are powerful 
  >>> allies 
  >>> > and 
  >>> > > >mediators 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > with Iran w_ho enjoy great respect there, and both countries 
  >>> have 
  >>> > condemned 
  >>> > > >the 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > case. Now, we need to push them to deploy all their diplomatic 
  >>> > forces and 
  >>> > > > > > persuade Iran to free Sakineh and stop stoning forever. 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Avaaz is launching an emergency ad campaign in influential 
  >>> > newspapers in 
  >>> > > >Turkey 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > and Brazil urging them to press Iran for clemency and justice. 
  >>> The 
  >>> > ads will 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > deliver our half-million strong petition, reach political 
  >>> circles 
  >>> > and 
  >>> > > >directly 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > appeal to Lula's and Erdo&#287;an's leadership and moral 
  >>> > authority. If 
  >>> > > >5,000 of 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > us donate even a small amount in the next 72 hours, we'll make a 
  >>> > powerful 
  >>> > > > > > statement before it's too late. This may be Sakineh's last hope 
  >>> -- 
  >>> > click 
  >>> > > >here to 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > chip in: 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > _> _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > __ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl__ ( 
  >>>https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl_ ) _ (_ 
  >>>
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl_ ( 
  >>>https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl ) ) 
  >>>
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Sakineh's sentence is a farcical travesty of justice. She was 
  >>> > sentenced to 
  >>> > > >death 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > by stoning for allegedly having relations with other men -- 
  >>> years 
  >>> > after her 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > husband had passed away, despite stoning having been outlawed in 
  >>> > Iran, and 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > > > > despite her not being able to speak the language of her trial. 
  >>> Her 
  >>> > two 
  >>> > > >children 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > launched a campaign to save her life, and generated a worldwide 
  >>> > uproar, 
  >>> > > > > > including over 554,000 Avaaz members. Feeling the pressure, the 
  >>> > Iranian 
  >>> > > > > > government revoked the stoning, but the execution sentence 
  >>> stands. 
  >>> > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Tension has been rising in Iran since the Sakineh case gained 
  >>> > attention -- 
  >>> > > >the 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > regime has threatened to arrest her children for speaking out 
  >>> and 
  >>> > has 
  >>> > > >issued an 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > arrest warrant against Sakineh's lawyer. He has now gone into 
  >>> > hiding and 
  >>> > > >his 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > family-members have been rounded-up. 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > But Lula and Erdo&#287;an have great respect in Iran and can 
  >>> > influence the 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > > > > regime. And they listen to us. Lula had said that he would not 
  >>> get 
  >>> > involved 
  >>> > > >in 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > this case. But after an aide brought his attention to the 
  >>> massive 
  >>> > online 
  >>> > > > > > campaign, he changed his mind, offering Sakineh asylum and 
  >>> > prompting 
  >>> > > >Iranian 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > authorities to announce that the case would be quickly 
  >>> resolved. 
  >>> > We know 
  >>> > > >Lula 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > listens to Avaaz campaigns -- in the last year, despite 
  >>> powerful 
  >>> > > >opposition, 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > members in Brazil have helped persuade Lula to sign off on a law 
  >>> 
  >>> > to protect 
  >>> > > >the 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Amazon and a bold anti-corruption law. 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > During the last two weeks, over 554,000 of us have signed the 
  >>> > petition to 
  >>> > > >Save 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Sakineh and end stoning in Iran. We only have days left to 
  >>> > persu_ade Lula 
  >>> > > >and 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Erdo&#287;an to act -- and it may be our last chance to save 
  >>> > Sakineh. Let's 
  >>> > > >each 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > pitch in a small amount and _make sure they hear our call to 
  >>> > leadership: 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > __ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl__ ( 
  >>>https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl_ ) _ (_ 
  >>>
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl_ ( 
  >>>https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl ) _) 
  >>>
  >>> > _ 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> 
  >>> > > > > > Sakineh's case has outraged the entire world by the sheer scale 
  >>> of 
  >>> > its 
  >>> > > >brutal, 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > nonsensical injustice. But in our fight for one woman we make a 
  >>> > powerful 
  >>> > > > > > statement about women, and people, everywhere. In standing up 
  >>> for 
  >>> > one 
  >>> > > >person, we 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > stand up for everyone's right to justice. 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Sakineh's children's have sent out a last plea: "Do not allow 
  >>> our 
  >>> > nightmare 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > become a reality, Today, when nearly all options have reached 
  >>> > dead-ends, we 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > resort to you. Please help our mother return home!" Click here 
  >>> to 
  >>> > answer 
  >>> > > >their 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > call, and get Erdo&#287;an and Lula to do the same: 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > __ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl__ ( 
  >>>https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl_ ) _ (_ 
  >>>
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl_ ( 
  >>>https://secure.avaaz.org/en/save_sakinehs_life/?vl ) _) 
  >>>
  >>> > _ 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > With hope and determination, 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > Alice, Pascal, Alice W, Ricken, David, and the Avaaz Team 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > SOURCES: 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > The Guardian, "Iran stoning woman offered asylum by Brazil's 
  >>> > President 
  >>> > > >Lula": 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > > > > _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > __ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> _ http://www.avaaz.org/guardian_sakineh_article__ ( 
  >>>http://www.avaaz.org/guardian_sakineh_article_ ) _ (_ 
  >>>
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _ 
  >>>http://www.avaaz.org/guardian_sakineh_article_ 
  >>>
  >>> ( http://www.avaaz.org/guardian_sakineh_article ) _) _ " 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 
  >>> > > > > > 
  >>> > > > > 
  >>> > > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 
  >>> > > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > _ (_ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _ http://www.charlescosimano.com/_ 
  >
  >
  >>> ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) _) 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > 
  >>> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 
  >>> > 
  >>> 
  >>> _ ( http://www.charlescosimano.com/ ) 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> 
  >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] 
  >>> 
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