Theos-Talk Archives (May 2005 Message tt00666)

May 26 2005

Dear Krishtar and friends:

This is such a deep subject:  

Can we say ?

RE: PATH TO SPIRITUAL PERFECTION and CHAKRAS
 
For some reason in HPB’s presentation of THEOSOPHY the mention of the
“chakras” is either omitted, or reduced to GENERALITIES and universalities –
taking it out of the region of personality and the physical man, where many
so-called "gurus” seem to love to start.
 
Now why is this?
 
Is it that there is some obstacle there? 

Does it emphasize too much the desire (kama) nature?  

Does a study of these chakras imply the student may be involved is securing
psychic powers with first purifying his moral nature? And without making
virtue in all things his first objective?
 
I am sure that occult physiology is taught at some stage. But why put it up
so prominently when HPB and the Masters of wisdom seem to have minimized it
? Am I right in this?  
 
Are we being curious about matters better left alone for the time being?

 
I can well understand our use of the word “chakra” as our “horizon of
interest or environment.” But Karma works both near and far.  
 
Making such a set of divisions merely (to me) gives emphasis to specified
areas of personal attention, whereas in THEOSOPHY all have to be considered
? Right ?  
 
The various associations you speak of – are they expanders or limiters? Why
choose physiological centers when the real centers of the Chakras, as of any
force, are out of any relation to the physical body?  

What moves the physical body? Is it not will moved by desire and planned by
mind ? Those are behind or within the physical. So there is a very wide
area to consider.

The explanations given are they essential? Is this not a kind of tantra
approach? 
 
I don’t know but am trying to figure out this matter.
 
Best wishes, 
 
Dallas



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

Let me move to another related subject:  

"Vice has been called an exaggerated Virtue !"


As to the concept that every "vice" is an exaggerated "virtue."

What is the cause of Evolution?

Consider for a moment how KAMA (desire, emotion, passion) works.
Originally as KAMADEVA (see T. Glos. p. 170-1) it is that aspect
of the DIVINE KARMA that serves to move the Universe back into
manifestation. The verse "Desire first arose in it that was the
primal germ of mind...." is also to be found in S.D. II 176 and
II 578-9 with explanations.  

I would conclude that there is a close connection with the 3 LOGOI :
unmanifested, manifesting and manifested and with MAHAT -- the Universal
Mind when the Universe is in it's manifesting stage -- awake and active on
its
various planes and peopled widely with self-conscious humanity
all over the vast sphere.


Our SUN and the Central spiritual SUN ?


[ Have you ever thought in view of the tremendous depth of visual
and electro-magnetic vibratory perception given to us recently by
the Hubble, and other telescopes that we seem to be suspended in
the midst of a vast SUN -- perhaps this is a visual and valid
proof of the concept of the CENTRAL SPIRITUAL SUN of which H.P.B.
speaks so guardedly in the S.D. and elsewhere? She also in
describing our Sun states it is not HOT but a series of
electro-magnetic Knots and Foci. We interpret them in terms of
fire, heat, and flares -- the exact nature and purpose of which
we do not yet know beyond noticing that our atmosphere, and
instruments connected with electricity and magnetism are
affected. In S.D. I 143-5, H.P.B. speaks of the "crucible" that
surrounds and protects the Earth -- indicating that actual extra
System phenomena are apparently translated into phenomena that we
can understand, using our own limited experience and perceptive
senses. ]  

But let's get back to the answers:  

Can we consider LOVE as Virtue and Vice


It seems to me these are key aspects of Love.

But, in manifestation, is Love not (within the realm / plane of
body and forms: -- Kamic, Pranic, Astral and Physical) IMPERSONAL
AND UNIVERSAL -- for the uncountable components of our Universe
any longer. But, when it is more narrowly focused by us it
becomes "Love with an object."

Each such object is the remnant of unfinished business or Karma
(good and bad) for each Monad. (I write this in general terms,
and must state this is largely my own speculations based on what
I have studied in Theosophy.) And under this aspect of LAW,
(Karma) it places each one in the exact place where its Karma
and that of others will meet and begin operating. In other words
it manages the intersection of all the Karmic cycles that
intersect in the actual force/power focus of every individual.
If we can visualize this on the enormous scale (with 7 or 10
planes, not merely the physical and astral) represented by the
Universe one begins to realize why and how the Universe needs
"agents" -- which, like itself are impartial, generous, kind,
charitable, exact, immutable an d merciful. It is really a
dreadful burden.


CHOICES AND MOTIVES


Now if we will agree to carry this concept so as to look at us
(mankind, as a whole and each of us in particular) -- every being
is at the center of "their own Universe." To each and from each
radiate the powerful impressions that their MOTIVES (for any act,
thought, feeling) as CHOICES start into their life and with that
impact they affect the rest of "creation" whether those beings
like it or not.

The impression made by any of our least CHOICES, is ineradicable
once generated. Hence the high degree of control over our own
natures that is demanded of the successful Perfectionist. The
work now facing us who come into contact with Theosophy is really
and fundamentally an attempt that will persist for many, many
lives to undo the ignorance and folly of some of our past
"actions" -- especially their motives.


LOVE and TYRANNY


But let us take "Love" as a virtue and the try to see if tyranny
is not the result of its exaggeration. Universal LOVE all agree
is essential to life. But then, it has to be fair and just and
friendly to ALL. If one centres one's Love on a person, a
family, one's children and relatives, or one's community, and
tribe or nation, one sets up automatically barriers between "the
object of affections" and the "rest." Once such a barrier is
erected, we then begin to treat the selected unit or group
differently from "the rest."

The concept of UNIVERSAL BROTHERHOOD is abridged, perhaps
insensibly by us at the beginning, but then with acceleration it
becomes nepotism and ultimately tyranny. In such a case, where
we, with our intellectual and Kamic power combined into LOWER
MANAS, seek to dominate the lives and destinies of others.

We rationalize and say as we presume to be wiser and know of a
better "way" than the average, we know what THEY should do.


TEACHER -- PUPIL relations and WISDOM


Here let me diverge and offer some examples which might make my
meaning clearer:

>From a "teacher," who gives each pupil their assignments, and
then stepping back, asks them (within certain common-sense and
altruistic, ethic parameters) to develop their own methods within
those parameters of impersonal and general LAW -- to which all
ought to give their understanding and agreement, and pledge heir
observation at all times -- we become a martinet with set rules
of encouragement and discipline and punishment. Thus the gentle
and all-embracing Love we had, has been turned (by our good
intentions restricted to one or a few individuals) into personal
discipline which we make ourselves the administrators of. We
become domineering, exacting, careless of the free-will of
others. We no longer give them the freedom to make their own
errors and to truly learn. -- and we have shifted from advisor to
GENERAL, or KING, or even EXECUTIONER. We have assumed the
position of AVENGING KARMA personified.


CHARITY, GENEROSITY, EQUANIMITY -- GREED


Take CHARITY as another instance, and imagine it being
personalized and expanded into a narrow view of ones' own
"security," and that security of "means" to be extended to our
family, employees, business, and perhaps also to our trade and
Nation -- and, let the "rest" of the World and their businesses
"fend for themselves." With some imagination we are describing
the economic situation of so-called "Free-trade" today. Our
focus is to establish a fund of "Wealth" -- not in abilities, but
rather in some solid and tangible representation of wealth and
power that our personal and family ease is set to last for a long
time "no matter what happens." Charity becomes GREED, and then
returns to the manipulation and exactions which we can IMPOSE on
others "like it or not."



VICE and VIRTUE Exemplified Today


If one follows the fare offered on TV involving the various
Detective Mysteries -- such as Hercule Poirot, Ironsides, Law and
Order, Agatha Christie detective stories, and the "Murder she
Wrote" stories, that star Angela Langsbury (?), etc... -- one
realizes after viewing some of these that they all represent a
study in the way individuals and families select certain
"virtues" (or a virtue) and then distort it / them (making them
personal) so as to serve to protect themselves or their loved
ones -- they think. The result of lying, misrepresentation,
hiding the truth, etc... are all vicious and expose the devious
reasoning of the human mind when dominated by personal DESIRE.
If one then follows the reasoning and search into valid clues by
the "detectives." If and when we come into the Court scenes, we
see the struggles of attorneys, judges and detectives to deal
with the personal vices -- advanced as personal reasons to
exaggerate or suppress truth. The Law of the land attempt to set
in clear and impartial terms the rights and privileges of all
concerned. Then one witnesses the action of Kama-Manas in trying
to emphasize, hide, exclude, certain facts and logical
conclusions. The judicial system limps along karmically because
ethical and moral concepts are difficult to put into language in
such a way as they will be applied with honest, sincere
impartiality, by ALL CONCERNED. An additional barrier is the
current dishonesty and lack of sincerity of many of those who are
portraying various parts -- but, the reason I mention these, is
because that particular arena does three things:

1. It demonstrates how a virtue personalized becomes a vice.
Vice has no limits.

2. It shows how the LOWER MIND, determined to shield itself
from KARMA, exaggerates certain falsities to "protect" itself
from the punishments that true JUSTICE (of the present legal
constitution) prescribes.

3. The concept of KARMA is one that always underlies these
dramas, but its continuity, exactitude and fairness are not fully
made visible because of the faults of our modern systems of
equity. Everyone recognizes it with INTUITION, but few have
mediated and brought the reason to bear on this faculty and
subject of a "level field" for all. Nor has the concept of the
"Human Family" thoroughly sunk in. The Lower Mind examines and
revels in "differences." The Higher Mind seeks equivalence,
universality, equity, compassion, and fairness for all.

I recognize that I am making generalities (and you ought to check
what I offer with your own experience, and what you know of
Theosophical principles) and that they are all probably faulty
since they depend on the biases. the intuitions and the attempts
to be fair and just by all the characters portrayed to be on the
side of "law and order." There are always great problems trying
with the imperfections of our own character (which our memory
taunts us with) to deal with the exposure to the LIGHT OF DAY and
of TRUTH of the failings of others. The principle of letting
Karma take care of adjustments, penalties and good fortune is for
each of us a good one. No one ought to speak ill of others --
or the dark specter of personal REVENGE, Anger, Tyranny, rear up
and manifest.

I found in Book 6 of THE LIGHT OF ASIA that Sir Edwin Arnold
gives a fair description of the final "temptations" by
personified VICES of the Buddha, the night before he achieved
"Enlightenment."

To return to the main thesis:


VICE, VIRTUE and ETHICS

There is really not too much more to offer, as each one looking
inward and outward will discover that the question of vice and
virtue, of morality and ethics, are areas we have not well dwelt
on or meditated about. Most times the results serve to show up
our errors in retrospect, and it takes bravery and fairness to
confront our past in most cases. The main difficulty if we
recognize the exactitude of KARMA is: How do we undo some of the
errors we have made?

Some we can do, and as for others, we will have to wait patiently
until Karma offers us the opportunity to undo a fractured past.


IMPACT OF ACTING AS THOUGH WE WERE IMMORTALS


In the meantime THEOSOPHY says THAT AT ALL TIMES ONE OUGHT TO ACT
AS A BROTHER IMMORTAL in our DEALING with other BROTHER IMMORTALS
and as we desire to be dealt with in all situations. At least we
will not be adding to our future burdens -- we will be creating
"Friends" and not enemies for the future.

We need to consider that past of an IMMORTAL is one which brought
us into close contact with others who now appear as 'strangers"
to us in this life. We do not know all the causes that bring
people together. But we do have control over our own thoughts,
feelings and acts. One of the strange comments made in Theosophy
is that one ought to bear happily the most distressing situations
of life -- realizing they would not be coming to us, unless we
had affinity with them; and, also, we ought to welcome them as
opportunities to improve our character as we work through them.

If one is able to adopt a contemplative attitude, even in the
midst of turmoil and "pressure," then It demands that its
(Karmic) affinity (as an aspect of the dynamic KAMIC) be
responded to. Since Karma as an aspect of KAMA operates in the
world of FORMS, it is creative. At the point of origin it is
like the Logoi: the words and Plan which assist in manifestation.


PRALAYA and DEVACHAN -- Analogy ?


When at the close of a Manvantara it acts protectively again, as
the gentle Mother that separates the impressions that are of
permanent value from those that are not (similar to Kama-Loka).
It puts those "on hold" as Karmic residue, to be resumed when "a
new Manvantara dawns.") It then puts all beings -- its many
children -- to "sleep / rest" -- and to dream again of all that
which they did that was valuable (in terms of Karmic excellence
and balance) in their many incarnations. (In this it acts like
the period of Devachan between intervening lives and incarnations
of decision making and karma reception.) .

It rules over Pralaya as a negative but living force [one of the
illustrations of this may be fund in S.D. Vol. I p. 27, Sloka 8,
where it speaks of the "opened Eye of the Dangma (WISE)." There
it causes the review of the impressions and lessons of a whole
Manvantara of experience for EVERY MONAD. On the reincarnation
of a Universe these life-atoms (the Monads) spring to conscious
awareness all over their field of life and renewed duty. (There
is no physical BIG BANG. We tend far to much to view our
situation only in terms of the material and physical.) The 1s
Vol. of the S.D. describes this process after a Maha-Pralaya.
H.P.B. speaks of this in her article ISIS UNVEILED and the
VISISHTADWAITA" [ Theosophist, January 1886, ULT-- H.P.B.
Articles III, p. 265; BCW Vol. 7, p. 50 ]

Much more might be said as the laws of analogy and correspondence
suggest.


Best wishes,

Dallas

========================================
 

-----Original Message-----
From: krishtar
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:07 AM
To: 
Subject: Re: Different explanations about chakras 


First of all, hello, Vladimir.

On your question:

" ...Which does not mean one should keep those physical vices even if one
is free from any thought-vices, does it?..."  

Well it´ll depend on the person´s conscience of taking good care of his
vehicle or not and thought -vices will also do harm to the body, won´t they?
All excesses are not desirable.
What I meant was that that people bother so much about a character´s vice
but forget to look at the mirror and see that he/she has got other form of
vices.

Plus I do not know who wrote ."...And about the questionable statement
"and the Adept Morya were all smokers" ..." 

Regards

Krishtar