Theos-Talk Archives (October 2003 Message tt00123)

Hi Leon and all of you,

My views are just views and nothing else:

1.
Allright according to you - I must be seriously mistaken - because I won't
keep the book The Secret Doctrine as my Bible !
I disagree !
What I am talking about is the inadequacy of the books presented as the main
books on the ULT website !

The front page must be a mistake if any. It exclaims the following purpose:

"To spread broadcast the teachings of
Theosophy as recorded in the writings of
H.P. Blavatsky and William Q. Judge"

This is NOT Theosophy proper, - Leon !
I have to disagree with you.
What ULT do - in their chambers - thursday or saturday afternoon - might be
good and sweet.
But the badly presented website sticks like glue.
Blavatsky would never agree on such an - idolatry - presentation.
Remember - this was just one example.

The declaration - It calls Theosophy a movement doesn't it ?
Blavatsky said it wasn't a movement - didn't she ?

What I am against is, that most Theosophical groups or offshoot-branches
together with TS manages to
present Theosophy - in a manner - where the readers are not made Properly
aware of the limitations of idolatry,
the physical structure of the particular group, the wrong doing in keeping
The Secret Doctrine or any other collection of books as a pet-Bible.
Shouldn't this be avoided - so much more in these days and times - of the
information-age ?
Isn't it more important than ever - because of the existence of the
Internet - and the new evolution-stage of mankind since 1875 ?

2.
Sorry about that Leon.
I guess the wall looks pretty bad now, - my mistake.

But, I was referring to the lectures at ULT - which appearntly are
emphasizing - what ULT calls the main teachings (i.e. Blavatsky and Judge).
Because of this appearnt emphasis - there is no free Theosophy - at ULT. The
intentions may be good and true - but the facts are facts. (Now, I am not an
expert on ULT, so please tell me if I am mistaken.)

I have a clairifying question:
Do ULT ever make lectures devoted only to Alice A. Bailey and her
teachings, - extracting something of value from the Bailey books ?

Else I agree with you - the members are very free at ULT, and that is
perhaps why I will become an associate to ULT.


3.
Small favours you say. I think you don't know what you have in your hand
while agreeing with me on this.
All what falls from the sky is holy - right ?
...And I will reveal, that it is not money, - but rather some feathery
fartilizer deliverances. (smile...)

4. ULT whispers in the wind
a)
It has a website ! - So it tells a tale, doesn't it ?
b)
I have read it. At least I thnk it was the right one.
But, I think other parts of their ULT-website are somewhat in conflict with
the anicent Wisdom teachings - and what we call the
Militant-Blavatskian-Theosophy. One does not spread any particular books.
One culls the good one find in each !
c)
Suppose I get my information about ULT from various source - not all of them
are to be revealed - because that could be spiritually unhealthy, what will
that mean to you ?
d)
Who are those Militant Theossophists ? I would like to know more about them.
Theosophy militant - has to me more to do with - changing the no ongiong
"business as ususal" and "head under the arm" Theosophy - and making - a
true Blavatskyan opposition to the Alice A. bailey groups, who Needs it.
This is one part of what I will call Theosophy militant. There should be no
corrupt-political issues involved here.
e)
The directing/marketing members of ULT are not in a great majority beloning
to such a group. If they were - the ULT would look different. The website
would be one place, that would look different.
f)
Agreed. Some of the "stirs" in the world could actually come from - a ULT
member or associate. But I was talking about ULT in general and its Public
Relation activities.
g)
You wrote:
"None of us ever talk about
> our association or hang a Theosophical symbol around our necks and pinned
on our
> jackets, or carry a card listing our memberships in anything. :-) "
My answer:
This is exactly why you or ULT are not Theosophical. But, it is also why you
or ULT are Theosophical.
You see, the necklace is trouble - yes.
But not talking about it is bad. You should talk about when it is
spiritually proper.
Blavatsky did NOT act like that. She was Theosophy through and through.
h)
Leon - Can you explain how ULT manages to escape being an organization ?
If ULT is not an organization - then it should delete its sentence on its
front page - where it exclaimes the following purpose:
"To spread broadcast the teachings of
Theosophy as recorded in the writings of
H.P. Blavatsky and William Q. Judge"

This is a limitation of theosophy - the wisdom tradition - as it is and has
been through the ages.
But I agree that the ULT are better than most theosophicals around the
globe - in avoiding being an organization. (smile...)
i)
When the facts will Penetrate my head ?
You ask ME be to be your sweet and dandy fortune-teller ???
No Leon - I know what you are up to - you are about to trick me into asking
you to give me money
so that I can tell you the future, right ? (smile...)
It won't work Leon. I won't tell you - and certainly not you - when this
will penetrate my head.
(...a huge smile - morphs the Sufilight - head...)

5.
Membership.
Great Leon !

I am much more happy now, when I know how to become a member, and
how free ULT is compared with most of the other theosophical groups !

What do the readers from Theosophical Society (Adyar) or Pasadena have to
say about that ?
Arn't ULT just great ?
Or are they missing the Externalization of the Hierarchy at the United
Nations ?


You can relate this email to the other email to Leon mailed at Theos-Talk
shortly before this.
I am just doing my little stunt on creating a "stir" in the world just like
Blavatsky did.
I am against business as ususal as we watch in the different theosophical
groups -
or socalled non-organizational groupings.


Keep up the good work.



from
M. Sufilight with peace and love...






----- Original Message ----- 
From: <leonmaurer@aol.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2003 1:08 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World Theosophy, brotherhood, prayer and political
action.


>
> In a message dated 10/07/03 5:19:37 PM, global-theosophy@adslhome.dk
writes:
>
> <<Hi Leon and all of you,
> W. Q. Judge said, that crystallization of the teaching should be avoided.
I
> agree.
>
> Now if this is what ULT are doing when they teach Theosophy - then
allright.
>
> But I have my view - and it is that the Teachers at ULT doesn't- because
>
> they can't, the reason being, that they stick - too much - to a limited
>
> number of books as valid wisdom teaching.>>
>
> What ever gave you that idea? Haven't you read any of the discussions in
> recent months about the ULT and its non-organization and lack of any
agenda that
> limits what students can study or talk about? If you don't think the SD,
as
> originally written, is the fundamental basis of all valid theosophical
wisdom,
> then you are seriously lacking in your understanding of the real meaning
and
> purpose of the theosophical movement in the world today. What makes you
believe
> the associates of ULT are "limited to any (particular) number of books"?
>
>
> <<There is an audience - there are teachers. The audience has a spiritual
need
>
> for a certain spiritual teaching - and they won't get it at ULT for
certain
>
> obvious reasons.>>
>
> What are those "obvious reasons"? Or, are you just blowing wind about
things
> you apparently know nothing about? Have you ever been in the Library of a
> theosophical Lodge? Have you ever seen the books that are on sale in
their book
> stores? Have you ever heard any ULT associate tell another that he can't
> read any book he chooses to supplement his understand of the fundamental
ideas
> presented in the SD and other writings of HPB or William Q. Judge? What
kind of
> nonsense are you talking about? Where does those off-the-wall opinions of
> yours come from?
>
> <<The audience also have a Want for teaching. What they Want is not always
>
> what they spiritually Need to be taught.>>
>
> What has that got to do with anything?
>
>
> <<What the students can get from ULT is - reading the original works (at
least
>
> to a certain degree). And thanks so very much for that.
>
> This is important ! And here we can agree.>>
>
> Thanks for small favors. :-)
>
>
> <<Blavatsky made a - stir in the world, in fact world wide. This is
>
> Theosophy - proper and even Militant !
>
> ULT - only wishpers in the wind !>>
>
> How can ULT whisper in the wind -- since it never has anything to say,
except
> in its Declaration? Have you ever read it? If, so, where do you get the
> information you have about ULT? I know a quite a few of theosophists who
are
> associates of ULT that are as militant as HPB -- and maybe even more so.
How do
> you know which theosophical militants out there (if you know of any) are
> members of ULT or not? And, how do you know that some "stirs in this
world" are
> not the result of someone who is a member of ULT. None of us ever talk
about
> our association or hang a Theosophical symbol around our necks and pinned
on our
> jackets, or carry a card listing our memberships in anything. :-) Only
people
> in the TS, Masonic societies or members of religious organizations do
that.
> And ULT is no organization. When will that fact penetrate your head, so
you
> stop making such outlandish statements?
>
>
> <<The members of Theos-talk was offered to be members of ULT in an email
here
> at Theos-Talk some days back.
>
> I offered to become a member in an email.
>
> I havnt received an answer yet.
>
> This is not allright with me.
>
> All you have to do to become an associate is to read the Declaration,
obtain
> or print out a copy of the Membership card -- which you can find at
> www.ult.org or at any ULT Lodge... And sign and mail it to the parent
Lodge in Los
> Angeles, or you can go to any Lodge, anyplace in the world, and sign one
there.
> It's as easy as that, since the associate card says the following:
>
> "Being in sympathy with the purposes of this Lodge, as set forth in its
> "Declaration," I hereby record my desire to be enrolled as an Associate,
it being
> understood that such association calls for no obligation on my part, other
than
> that which I, myself, determine."
>
> (Notice, it doesn't say anything about what the Lodge expects from you
other
> than what it says in the Declaration. Of course if you are not in
sympathy
> with that, don't sign it.)
>
> Or, you can bypass that altogether, believe in your heart that you are an
> associate, and then go to any Lodge to study and use whatever facilities
it has
> to assist ANY student, signed up associate or not, who walks in the
door -- 
> without any questions or discrimination as to who you are and what you are
doing
> there. I've never been asked at any Lodge I ever visited, and even
lectured
> at, whether or not I was a signed up member. Why would ULT associates
ever
> think of that? And, even when I don't attend any Lodge meetings (which I
haven't
> for the past ten years or so) I still am an associate. BTW, in case you
don't
> understand the card, there are no dues or anything else required to be or
> maintain your association. All that only depends on, is what's in your own
mind.
>
> Have you gotten it yet?
>
> Best wishes on your search for enlightenment though whatever means you
choose.
>
> Leon
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>