Theos-Talk Archives (April 2002 Message tt00235)

Saturday, April 20, 2002

Re: "core Ideas" and the freedom to study.


Dear Friends:

What I am saying is NOT that mere reading of ancient texts,
Theosophical or otherwise confers wisdom.

Relying on "fundamentals" does not mean a retreat from the modern
or even the "post-modern." It means that there is a value in the
basic ideas of any system.

Whatever one desires to KNOW has to be adequately studied.

In the matter of Theosophy, I find that many who sympathize and
contribute to our discussions seem to need to refer with greater
familiarity to the basic (the core) concepts -- as presented by
H P B in the KEY TO THEOSOPHY . If we do not all of us have a
familiarity with the few basic tenets, then our discussions will
be lost in the controversies of cross-purpose opinions. If we,
on the other hand, have a common knowledge of what theosophy
teaches or deals with, our opinions will be all the sharper and
more valuable.

Understanding of the way in which the Universe works does that.
But where are we to secure some reliable facts abut the origin
and development of our Universe and our Earth, and how has man as
an INTELLIGENCE actually matured?

Theosophy as originally recorded and taught is derived directly
from the Mahatmas -- the Masers of Wisdom -- Immortal Men who
have been the witnesses of History since it first dawned. H P B
says that they have the libraries and the books but better still
as reincarnating immortals (and so are we all) with the actual
faculty of recalling actual events of the past, their reports are
far superior to the speculative hypotheses offered to us as
pupils in our educational institutions. In the past 60 years I
have watched these theories and hypotheses change. They are
opinions and speculative and not FACTS. I have learned to
mistrust anything I cannot prove for myself. I want to test it
for accuracy of observation and logic of derivation and also,
even more important, for coherence with other disciplines and
known facts.

In the west where immortality is not well understood, this
appears ridiculous. What: Immortal Men?

The reason why I emphasize the study of original Theosophy is
because all the information and logic needed to understand the
operations and cooperation of Nature are there. We have as
proximate evidence three great sources: ISIS UNVEILED, The
SECRET DOCTRINE and the MAHATMA LETTERS .

But the Theosophical doctrines and teachings cannot be enforced,
and no one can teach any one anything unless they are willing to
try and penetrate beneath words and descriptions to the MEANINGS.

Lets put this in another perspective. How old are the
FUNDAMENTALS of mathematics? Is antiquity any demeaning of those
basics? Or are they true and useful today as first expressed
historically by Galen, Democritus, Euclid Pythagoras or Hermes ?
They are taken for granted and proved at the beginning of our
education so they remain embedded in our minds as the basic LAWS
of all calculation. Do parallel lines ever meet? How many
squares have 5 sides? or 3 sides?

So why not some basic facts concerning the existence, tenure and
evolution of our Kosmos, Earth and Man ?

Our general problem is that in regard to our way of living we
desire to be free to do anything without consequences pursuing
us. Now why is that ? If we hurt or pain others by deprivation
or torture, why should we escape the consequences just because we
hid our participation from others under say, the statutory law of
our land ? Does that make us any less cowards? Dos it make us
more trustworthy that we successfully hide our depredations from
public view?

Theosophy is not a "religion." it is a discourse on Laws in
Nature that any one can discover and verify.

Why do I recommend the "Original teachings?" It is because man
2nd and 3rd level writers have added their opinions into their
discourses on Theosophy. I prefer to "point the way" which has
proved of benefit to myself -- and translate this in terms of
experience. We can open doors and windows for others, but we
cannot force them to look or trust the doctrines and tenets of
the Theosophical information that we, . ourselves, may have
acquired. We may prove certain facts for ourselves, but not so
for others. No blind faith, no beliefs are to be trusted. At
best, statements can be treated as opinions to be checked out
independently.

But why trust me? If you go to H P B's articles, or The SECRET
DOCTRINE and to ISIS UNVEILED, one is likely to find confirmation
of certain facts and laws. But even then H P B has taken the
precaution of telling us that we have to prove them for
ourselves. No blind faith, no belief is demanded by Theosophy,
and especially not be any organization calling itself
Theosophical.

Best wishes,


Have I dispelled the boogey of "fundamentalism" as an epithet of
sneering deprecation? I doubt it. But I have suggested some
actual study and work for those WHO WANT TO KNOW.

Best wishes,

Dallas



-----Original Message-----
From: g s
Sent: Friday, April 19, 2002 2:41 PM
To: T
Subject: Manas, Manas, and More Manas


<<<It seems to me that the only way we can assure ourselves of
the value and usefulness of Theosophical doctrines and tenets
lies in
careful., study so that we know what Theosophy teaches. All
along the way we need to keep our attention sharp and query every
proposition for accuracy and its coherence with other tenets and
statements.>>>

The above words are from Dallas, but I think that they are
representative of the current Theosophical mind set -- all we
need to do is to read and study the "original" core teachings,
and we will "know what Theosophy teaches."

Who does this reading and study? Manas, right? The assumption
here is that "truth" and "esotericism" and yes even "wisdom" can
be found by intellectual study of those "original" "core
teachings" left to us by "Adepts" and "Masters." The fact that
all religions are saying pretty much the exact same thing doesn't
matter here because Theosophy is "right" and all the others are
"wrong." Correct me if I am off base, but I believe that this is
exactly the mind set of the vast majority of Theosophists today.
This is what we find in most Theosophical literature, and certain
on theos-world and BN and heavens knows where else.

If we agree with the initial assumption that certain
compassionate Masters/Adepts gave out to the world a written set
of "core teachings" that are absolutely true and correct, a
"history" and an "occult science" of our universe, having "seven
keys" for the mind to play with, then the conclusion that
reading/studying them will get us "gnosis" or "enlightenment" or
something (?) seems logically correct. The premise that we are
ignorant leads to a logical fallout that we need certain "occult
knowledge" and all will be well.

But when we take a look at some of the things that those very
core teachings say, one has to wonder at the naivety of the
initial assumptions themselves that so many Theosophists seem to
have adopted out-of-hand.

For one, we learn from our reading that wisdom cannot be obtained
from a book or from words. The core teachings tell us that as
soon as an "esoteric" idea is put into words it becomes
"exoteric" - which logically means that the entire set of core
teachings themselves are exoteric and any belief system based
upon their literal interpretation is some kind of Exoteric
Theosophy.

So, we buy a set of core teaching books and read them and study
them for many years, and we still can't even walk on water yet,
or even raise the dead. Is the fault in the books? Well, it could
be if they are not "original" editions. But even then it may be
still difficult to read minds and predict futures. Does anyone
know an omniscient Theosophist? The answer suggested by most is
that we have to wait for future lives. If we can't get
enlightenment from those core teachings this time around, then
the reading and study is enough to assure a future life when such
wonderful things will surely be obtained.

Well, personally folks, I don't agree with the assumptions, and
so I can't agree with the conclusions, and so I will not wait
around for "future lives." This kind of stuck-in-manas "logic"
will kill the TM, and probably rightly so (it has stifled several
countries in their development).

"Truth" is right here, not off in some hard-to-get-to place.
Truth is a living experience, not thought processes developed
from books. Ignorance is NOT eliminated by the addition of new
knowledge, because knowledge is infinite and no one will ever be
able to obtain it all. If you are alive and have a physical body,
then YOU ARE EXPERIENCING ALL SEVEN COSMIC PLANES RIGHT NOW AS
YOU READ THIS. The "planes" are NOT mysterious and scary places
"out there" somewhere as those exoteric diagrams suggest.

You can "query every proposition" (and "preposition" for that
matter) all you want, and it will get you a better and sharper
manas, if that is your goal. Theosophy has to be lived. It has to
be experiences. The 7 planes are not meant for intellectual
analyses, they are meant to be experienced. And we do, every day,
but sadly, most of us aren't even conscious of it. Manas focuses
on the mental plane and only on the mental plane. And furthermore
...

Enough for now. I will go quietly...

Jerry S.