Theos-Talk Archives (February 2002 Message tt00184)

Dear Jerry:

Answers and comment below:



Dallas

-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Schueler [mailto:gschueler@earthlink.net]
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 10:32 AM
To: Theosophy Study List
Subject: Re to Dallas

<<<I think the pages of ISIS UNVEILED and the MODERN PANARION
show that H.P.Blavatsky was well acquainted with all the various
systems of religious philosophy from her most early New York
days. If I recall correctly Col. Olcott in OLD DAILY LEAVES,
Vol. 1 attests to this also. H P B attributes this to the
assistance that various Masters gave to her when she had to deal
with these matters either verbally or in writing. (I am
summarizing from memory and without references at hand.)>>>

Der Dallas, I agree, but "well acquainted" doesn't mean that she
is right about everything. She does, in fact, have a few errors
and we are all going to have to accept that fact.

=======================

DTB NO ARGUMENTS. SHE SAY THAT OF HER WORKS TOO. But I do
not known enough to presume to tell when and how she may have
erred. Others have done exactly that and they have presumed.

=========================


<<<From a study of ISIS UNVEILED, The SECRET DOCTRINE and
numerous of her articles, it is plain to me that THEOSOPHY is NOT
a pastiche culled by an expert mind from hundreds of manuscripts,
some unavailable except from special libraries, and in many
languages.>>>

But Dallas, she herself tells us that her SD is but a "nosegay"
culled from a variety of sources. Here is my take: She begins
with the assumption or premise that all religions are in
agreement on a handful of key doctrines, that they all pretty
much came from the same source, and then she sets out in her
writings to show this. One of the best ways to do this is to
quote other writers, and that's why she quoted so much and needed
a library.

==========================

DTB i do not disagree with what you say. I simply say that
she could not have done her work without making those comparisons
and adducing those quotations. Her job as I see it, was to unify
and make sense of a mélange that was (and still is from the
purely materialistic point of view very CHAOTIC.) Every
religion, philosophy or science starts with a basis. If that
basis is common (as she claims) then the similarities are to be
expected.

I would be very happy if eventually, I can develop the ability to
find, or create, a "string" such as she did, to bind those
flowers. So to me there is as base the "flowers of similitude,"
the string of laws and development that binds them, and finally
the bouquet is made presentable for all to use and feel inspired
from.

======================================



<<<What emerges to this student, is a masterly ability to record
evidence of the existence of a prototypal single WISDOM, from
which all religious philosophies were derived, one after the
other. In addition there is evidence of that kind of scientific
OBSERVATION which is not a theoretical reconstruct in retrospect
concerning the formation of the Universe, our System and our
World, also of the evolution of intelligence on our world.>>>

Wisdom is ineffable, and when put into words it becomes
knowledge, right? The wisdom of Chockmah becomes the knowledge of
Daath. In the same way, the wisdom of atma-buddhi is filtered to
us through manas. Her writings are therefore knowledge, which
points to the ineffable wisdom behind it, but it is up to us not
to confuse the knowledge (letter) with the inner wisdom (spirit).
I have discovered a "Theosophical current" behind her written
material, and have been trying to put my own words to it, with
limited success perhaps.

----------------------------

DTB Excellent and understood. I have, and am trying to do
the same. All the time the effort is to attend carefully and
cautiously to what is being said, and always test it with
impersonality, universality and common sense.



==================================



<<<I would have enjoyed meeting H P B and speaking with her -- I
have not yet met in all these years any one with such a range of
knowledge and vision -- as depicted in her writings. I have seen
no comparable literature being issued, nor have I seen any
systematic refutation, or attack on the metaphysics and logic of
her presentation.>>>

The closest literature that I have seen is probably G de
Purucker, but on the whole I agree with you.

=======================

DTB From the writings of G de P I see his has deeply imbibed from
Theosophy, The SECRET DOCTRINE etc... but his presentation is for
me marred when at times he speaks down to people telling them
that he is "advanced" or that "they" wont understand.

I fault hi for this as the same UNIVERSAL SPIRIT is common to
each of us and is in fact our HIGHER SELF. Everyone ought to be
encouraged to rise to their highest potential. No one ought to
be discouraged.

========================================




<<<To verify what is currently being written against H P B and
discussing Theosophy with her. One has to be well acquainted
with the full range of the writings pro and con that have related
to Theosophy and its presentation down the years. It forms a
great volume of material. Much of our important scientific
advances have corroborated statements made by her on behalf of
Theosophy .>>>

I think that we are all pretty familiar, Dallas. While science
has corroborated much, it has also introduced the world to chaos
theory and quantum theory, which have not yet been adopted into
the Theosophical community, but will have to be if the TM is to
continue. Like it or not, our world is founded on probability and
our sense of order is based on a foundation of chaos. This has
been well established by modern science, and is also in agreement
with esoteric teachings. These esoteric teachings need to be
incorporated into the Theosophical milieu and soon.

==============================

DTB The SECRET DOCTRINE starts with indeterminacy and chaos
theory in the materials to be used for a new manifestation.
Quantum theory comes into play when the immortal Egos and the
Divine Instructors, the Cosmocratores and the "Builders" enter
the scene to make sense out of that chaos. Those are said to be
human intelligences which have risen to th level of world and
universal perceptions to serve Nature (the Universe) as her
supervisors and assistants in the grand project of
reconstruction. Such reconstruction is devised for the education
and progress of all the milliards of component of Nature -- How
else to explain it ?

Intelligence innate to everything is then directed to the normal
condition and place where it is needed. Each "form" follows
those directives and the WHOLE is a harmony of diversities.

Indeterminacy is seen only if we consider the hosts of Monads of
lesser experience, who are still to develop self-consciousness
into a concentrating and focusing field for self-development.
Then determinacy with self-conscious concern and a care for
others arises as a determining factor. Pushing that still
further the study of the Universe becomes the program and
curriculum of every immortal Pilgrim.

Once that is achieved the laws of mass action, indeterminacy, and
quantum mechanics become a general observational position, It is
much like the man on the observation terrace of the Empire State
Building, looking down at people and vehicles, might wonder at
their seemingly intelligent stopping, starting and avoidances --
if he is not familiar with traffic systems and symbols, or fails
to see the patterns that a vast diversity of individuals accept,
and voluntarily impose on themselves, for the sake of communal
safety and progress.

Our Science, looking speculatively at the atoms, molecules and
cells -- as the building blocks of matter used in all beings, may
wonder at their degree of intelligence, but do not yet dare to
entirely credit them with consciousness and the ability to
voluntarily follow patterns of force which they perceive, each at
their own level, in cooperation with all the rest.

Theosophy draws our attention to the cooperative aspect of
nature. I think we need to trust it that far, or "evolution"
would have no real discernable meaning. Our presence here under
the materialistic concept is illogical -- but others may hold
other views which when put together will still not entirely meld.
In The SECRET DOCTRINE Vol. I p 181 we are given a brief view
of the three main evolutionary streams of forces that are forever
intertwined as the 3 snakes of the Caduceus are.

======================================


<<<I grow tired of reading the literature that attacks
H.P.Blavatsky (not the philosophy) is repetitive of slander an
innuendo much of it issued while she was alive, and some after
her death. Its "old hat." Further, I would say that it is
cowardly, since H P B is given no chance to refute these attacks.
What stature does
any one acquire who attacks the dead and the defenseless , and
especially one who only did good?>>>

I have never made any personal attacks against her, or anyone
else for that matter.

========================

DTB I know that. And my observation was just that -- a
personal statement.

=========================



<<<That which strikes me as most significant is the fact that
none of the correspondents seem able or willing to discuss or
attack the philosophical, historical and scientific statements
that H P
B has advanced, say, in The SECRET DOCTRINE .>>>

Oh, but they are. Briggite and Steve are attacking her teaching
as ancient and even as being oriental. They say, I think, that
she probably never went to Tibet and was never initiated, etc. In
short, they are challenging the integrity of her work, and we as
Theosophists should be responding with facts etc, and in a
brotherly and compassionate manner, to show that they are wrong,
if we can. So far, I seem to be somewhere in the middle, not
really feeling secure in each camp.

For example, it is a fact that her planetary ring of globes is a
circular version of the Qablistic Tree of Life. I said this years
ago, and have written in great detail about it. The question then
becomes, "where did she get this idea from?" It does not seem to
be oriental, and yet G de P has related each globe to a loka &
tala which are oriental.

===============================

DTB I mean specific and not general and vague attacks. Also
the "circular tree of Life" of Kabalah is placed in S D I 200
right opposite the Esoteric Version of the Globes, and Planes,
and further in S D I pp 242 to 246 she discusses this in
detail. Its been there all the time. It is discussed earlier in
ISIS UNVEILED.

I have set aside a study made on the Kabalah and Theosophy some
years ago, but do not know if the MS WORD will translate from
WordStar -- I'll have to find out. It's a pretty thick MSS.

In ISIS UNVEILED she repeatedly compares the Western Kabalah with
the Oriental and ANTIQUE QUABALA. It is easy to see how the
Western is derived from the Eastern -- but one has to b e
familiar with all those different systems and sets of terms. H P
B states in her articles that the Jewish Kabala has been
seriously impaired by interpolations made only a few centuries
ago when they were driven out of Spain. It has been
christianized and further clouded. ISIS UNVEILED makes a serous
effort to clear those clouds up. But one has to study and look
for those statements. I say this again. Each student has to
prove things for himself. There are no reliable authorities.
Theosophy as a system needs to be proved and demonstrated by each
student for themselves.

That H P B went to Tibet is not material to the age-old
Theosophical philosophy that emanates from the Trans-Himalayan
Adepts. They say she did. She says she did. Arguments are for
what reason ?

The current set of "attacks" are based on a rehash of already
settled accusations and slanders made while H P B was still
alive. They are second hand, and second or third level records.
They are not PRIMARY.

The only access we still have to the PRIMARY records is through
the "original writings." Each of us can have those books and
articles and copies of letters as originally written. We can,
each of us, can make our own study and come to our own
self-responsible conclusions.

Anyway, That is enough.

Best wishes to you as always,

Dal


Jerry S.
--



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