Theos-Talk Archives (November 2001 Message tt00061)

See MAHATMA LETTERS last 2 lines on p. 42.

DTB

========================

-----Original Message-----
From: Blavatsky Archives [mailto:blavatskyarchives@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2001 7:51 AM
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Theos-World Brigitte Muehlegger on Henry Olcott and the
Theosophical Masters: Part I

(1) In an Oct 7th posting to Universal Seekers [a Yahoo! Group],
Bill
Meredith wrote:

"KH and M are presented as individual entities to whom HPB
prostrated
herself in an almost worshipful adoration."

The above quoted from
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1961

(2) To Bill's statement, Brigitte Muehlegger wrote:

"Where are there as much as eyewittnes reports of instances where
they
saw HPB ever prostrating herself to any individuals going by the
name
of KH and M ?"

"The ONLY reporting known is of people prostrating themselves in
the
pressence of HPB." caps added

The above quoted from
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1972

(3) To Brigitte's question, Marina Sisson replied:

"There is a report in a letter from Master KH to Sinnett (ML-54
or
MLcron-92) referring to HPB prostrating herself to them."

The above quoted from
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1979

(4) Bill then replied to Marina's posting:

"Thanks Marina. I recall another instance [of HPB prostrating
herself
to the Masters] which I think is referenced in the exchanges
between
KPJ and Daniel Caldwell that are posted on Daniel's site.
Something
about when one of the Master's summoned her telepathically and
she
came a running. I don't have time right now to go searching so
I
could be wrong. At any rate your cite seems to answer the mail
to
Brigitte."

The above quoted from
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1980

(5) Marina replied to Bill:

"Hi Bill, I think the passage you are mentioning is the one
[below]:

"This same Brother once visited me in the flesh at Bombay, coming
in
full day light, and on horseback. He had me called by a servant
into
the front room of H.P.B.'s bungalow (she being at the time in the
other bungalow talking with those who were there). He [Morya]
came to
scold me roundly for something I had done in T.S. matters, and as
H.P.B. was also to blame, he telegraphed to her to come, that is
to
say, he turned his face and extended his finger in the direction
of
the place she was in. She came over at once with a rush, and
seeing
him dropped to her knees and paid him reverence. My voice and his
had
been heard by those in the other bungalow, but only H.P.B. and I,
and
the servant saw him." (Extract from a letter written by Colonel
Olcott
to A.O. Hume on Sept. 30, 1881. Quoted in Hints On Esoteric
Theosophy,
No. 1, 1882, p. 80.)"

The above quoted from:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1982

(6) Brigitte then wrote the following:

"In refference to the statement . . . [by Olcott about the
Brother on
horseback]send by Marina. . . I think one has to study the whole,
including the circumstances in india that time. In my opinion the
most
logical conclussian from the situation is that it was someone
associated with the Singh Sabha."

The above quoted from
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1990

I would like to make several comments here on what Brigitte
Muehlegger
has written above.

I find it strange that Brigitte does NOT make any direct comment
on
Olcott's specific statement which reads:

"She [HPB] came over at once with a rush, and seeing him [Master
Morya] dropped to her knees and paid him reverence."

Please keep in mind that the subject under discussion in the
above
Items (1) through (5) was on this specific topic YET BRIGITTE IS
SILENT ON THE VERY POINT UNDER DISCUSSION.

For reasons best known to her, Brigitte chooses to IGNORE the
"HPB
prostrating to the Masters" issue and instead writes:

"In my opinion the most logical conclussian from the situation is
that
it was someone associated with the Singh Sabha."

What does Brigitte mean by this statement? I will address this
later
in another posting.

But back to the "HPB prostrating to the Masters" issue.

Looking through all the relevant postings (dated October 7
through Oct
20, 2001)in the archives of Universal Seekers, I cannot find
where
Brigitte Muehlegger DIRECTLY deals with Olcott's statement that:

"She [HPB] came over at once with a rush, and seeing him [Master
Morya]dropped to her knees and paid him reverence."

The fact of the matter is that Marina Sisson produced Olcott's
account
which showed that there was at least one instance of an
eyewitness
report of HPB prostrating herself. See item (2) at the beginning
of
this posting.

If Brigitte doubted Olcott's 1879 account (or parts of it), why
did
she not come right out directly and say so in plain and simple
English? Why did she not frankly explain to Marina her reasoning
as a
good scholar would do? [For additional comments, see footnote at
bottom of posting.]

(7) On Oct 21, Brigitte wrote a new posting that included the
following exerpts:

". . . I added as a third aspect in one of my previous mails:
Reg.:'KH and M are presented as individual entities to whom HPB
prostrated herself in an almost worshipful adoration.'"

"Where are there as much as eyewittnes reports of instances where
they
saw HPB ever prostrating herself to any individuals going by the
name
of KH and M ?"

"The only reporting known is of people prostrating themselves in
the
presence of HPB. . . . "

". . . Marina responded with showing a 'Master letter' where it
is
'written' that reverence is shown by HPB to the Masters, however
that
is just a letter and not anybody seeing it; 'Where are there as
much
as eyewittnes reports of instances where they saw HPB ever
prostrating
herself to any individuals going by the name of KH and M?' "

The above quoted from
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/2141

At this point in Brigitte's text, you would have thought that
Brigitte
would deal directly with the other piece of evidence Marina ALSO
gave,
i.e., Olcott's testimony which reads in part:

"She [HPB] came over at once with a rush, and seeing him [Master
Morya] dropped to her knees and paid him reverence."

But no, Brigitte --- for reasons best known to her --- does NOT
mention the most relevant evidence. Not a word about it and
certainly
no explanation in this posting of Oct. 21st.

Continued in Part II

Daniel H. Caldwell
BLAVATSKY ARCHIVES
http://hpb.cc

----------------------------
FOOTNOTE TO ITEM 6:

It is true that when Marina on another matter quoted an
account by Olcott about "Hamlet, one of our Brothers" appearing
at
"Worlee Bridge," Bombay to HPB, Damodar and Olcott, Brigitte
wrote:

"In the new example you [Marina] give we are only shown that HPB
indeed knew 'people' in India. With the interest she had in
religion
and the mysterious east it is not surprising that she attempted
to
make contacts with pandits (those who have knowledge of the
religious
scriptures ) and others. . . . And so now we have these dubious
but
not entirely untrue, reportings. But why give suppernatural
explanations to events that can be explained in a normal way ?"

The above quoted from:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/UniversalSeekers/message/1997

Possibly Brigitte will say these comments just quoted apply ALSO
to
the "HPB prostrating to a Master" account by Olcott. If these
remarks
do apply to the account under consideration, Brigitte again does
NOT
explain explicitly what is dubious or supernatural about this
account.

The fact remains that Brigitte did not deal DIRECTLY with the
"HPB
prostrating to a Master" account by Olcott when Marina first
quoted
Olcott's testimony.
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