Theos-Talk Archives (October 2001 Message tt00224)

<<<<[Dallas:] Dear Friends:
I am of the opinion that one can find a number of references as
to what theosophy is. The question is to find those that are
fundamental. One could try UNIVERSAL BROTHERHOOD...
It does not matter that Theosophists give a variety of versions
as to what they think THEOSOPHY is. They have their own
opinions. THEOSOPHY is a definite statement concerning the operations of
nature, its history and the place and work of Mankind (here and
now) on and in and through it.>>>>>>>>>>>

Dallas, it seems strange to me that you can claim that Theosophy is "fact"
and that it is "a definite statement" and at the same time admit that each
of us "have their own opinions." You don't seem to realize the illogic in
your statements.

If I see a tree, and you see a tree, and 100 other people see a tree, does
that "prove" that a tree exists? Are the physical senses "proof" that
something exists? If so, then maybe materialists are right to only accept
material reality? But perhaps mutual agreement in our observations only
proves that we share similar interpretations of reality?

Universal Brotherhood does not equal Theosophy. Virtually all of the great
world's religions teach that we are all "God's children" and so they too
teach universal brotherhood. We can probably agree that universal
brotherhood is one of those root teachings shared by all religions, but I
think Theosophy itself is more than that.



<<<The practice of celibacy is felt to the individual to adopt,
depending on his perception of some necessity embodied in that
discipline. Theosophy does not rise or fall or change because of
it.>>>>>>>

I was using the "need" for celibacy as an example to demonstrate the fact
that Blavatsky's "core teachings" are not all universal. Some of her
teachings are universal, and some are specific to her linage. When you talk
about ancient "Sages" teaching Theosophy and so on, please remember that
there were always numerous linages throughout history. THERE HAS NEVER BEEN
ONE AND ONLY ONE THEOSOPHICAL SCHOOL. When Blavatsky talks about the
"Esoteric Tradition" and so on, she is talking about many small schools or
linages throughout the world all more or less teaching similar messages but
all differing in many particulars.


<<<The main question here is : are nature's laws reasonable?
should we obey them?>>>>>>>

Dallas, my friend, please think about this: NATURE'S LAWS CANNOT BE
DISOBEYED. Do you know a single person who can defy gravity and fly like
superman? Do you know anyone who can live without breathing air? This whole
notion of "obey" and "disobey" is pure manas, and has no reality at all - we
can consciously obey or disobey our own man-made laws, but we have no choice
but to obey Nature's laws. But Nature's laws are often not what we think
they are (some are esoteric) and they do allow for our free will.


<<<<But the real effort was to redirect everyone's attention to such
concepts as:
1.	the immortality of the Human EGO, the SPIRITUAL IMMORTAL SELF,>>>>


I do not subscribe to any such "immortality." I believe that you got this
idea (and many others) by taking Blavatky's words out of context. I do not
think that your continual promotion of this immortality business is doing
anyone any good.


<<<<<<2.	the UNIVERSAL PLANE OF CAUSES, (from the ATOM to the
INFINITE),>>>>>>>

I do not subscribe to any such "universal plane of causes." The teaching of
planes of causes and planes of effects is esoteric and very relative, and to
jump to the conclusion that such planes exist as such in reality is a wrong
interpretation. If such a plane actually existed, then manifestation, an
effect, would not be maya, it would be reality.


<<<<3.	the LAWS, RULES and Regulations of Kosmos, Earth and Man,>>>>

These are are agreed to by us when we start out. These rules are fixed and
firm so long as we remain here. There is no such thing as "obey and
"disobey" - we are not given this choice. Life is like a great game, and
one either plays by the rules or one quits, but one cannot cheat. And part
of the game itself is discovering what these rules are.


<<<<<<4.	the UNIVERSAL URGE to progress and the EVOLUTION of all
beings,>>>>>>>>>

This "urge" is our basic "thirst" or "desire" for life. It is our inherent
desire to play the game of life.


<<<<<<<<<<5.	the sameness of all basic teachings common at the root of all
Religions,>>>>>>>>

Except for love and the spiritual relationship between all living beings, I
don't see a great deal of common ground between religions (God of some kind,
life of some kind after death, and so on perhaps). Religions traditionally
stand or fall on their differences, not on their similarities, and Theosophy
is not supposed to be a religion anyway.


<<<<<6.	The possibility of reaching SUPREME PERFECTION for Man,>>>>>>

Not for "man" no. Such a thought is impossible. The teaching of perfection
and enlightenment is all about transcending our human condition now
(esoteric - a Path we can tread today), not evolving later from humanity
into gods (exoteric - a manas-oriented belief that waits for the future).


<<<<7.	the fact of the existence of an undying Race of Wise SAGES who
preserve the knowledge and wisdom of our world and universe.>>>>>

Not a race as such, but many different and separate small groups or linages
all over the world passing down their teachings through the generations to
those who are ready to understand them.

Jerry S.