Theos-Talk Archives (February 2001 Message tt00207)

Dal,

I don't have the actual page numbers only the month and year. It seems that
there are a number of charts concerning the planes in the Dec. issue of THE
THEOSOPHIST of 1899 and there is a chart in the Jan. issue of 1900
concerning the same. Those are my two leads so far. I would be happy to
xerox my charts and send them to those who don't have access to them. I do
not have the issues of the above issues of THE THEOSOPHIST. I got the
article from Wheaton Library, the Dec, 1889 issue, and it was excellent. I
have looked for my copy but am unable to find it at this time. Next I'll
look for charts in her collective writings but that will take more time.

Gene


----- Original Message -----
From: <dalval14@earthlink.net>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, February 26, 2001 6:31 AM
Subject: RE: Theos-World Emotional growth


> Thank you Gene,
>
> Could you possibly help me by giving me the actual page for your
> table (I seem to have mislaid mine) references so I can look them
> up.
>
> Thanks
>
> Dallas
>
>
> ============================
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eugene Carpenter [mailto:Ecarpent@co.la.ca.us]
> Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 9:52 AM
> To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: Theos-World Emotional growth
>
> Dear Dallas,
>
> The planes as given seem to me the standard seven planes used in
> old and new
> theosophical literature including HPB's work and in The
> Theosophist. They
> are the major key to communication. For example please see: The
> Theosophist for December, 1899, Chart XII, entitled, Parabrahm,
> for the
> magnificent Bird's Eye View. The seven cosmic planes are
> depicted. The
> seventh cosmic plane is the cosmic physical plane and it's
> subplanes are our
> systemic planes, our metaphysical planes:
>
> Logoic
> Monadic
> Atmic
> Buddhic
> Manasic
> Astral(Kamic)
> Etheric/physical(astral, in the old literature)
>
>
> The reference you have given on page 181 is indeed a bit
> perplexing until
> one can see that she is refering to the seven planes in their
> three major
> divisions that correspond to the three major aspects of the ONE:
>
> Monadic planes
>
> Logoic
> Monadic
> Higher Atmic
>
> Intellectual Planes
>
> Lower Atmic
> Buddhic
> Higher Manasic
>
> Physical planes
>
> Lower Manasic
> Astral(kamic)
> Higher physical(etheric physical)
>
> The gross physical is the basis for appearance to us of the
> etheric
> physical(the body of habits or human behavior)(i.e. ethics) which
> is the
> real, yet invisible to most, basis for the expression of all the
> higher
> planes, or states of consciousness.
>
>
> So. Assuming that the chart from "The Theosophist" is correct,
> let's
> understand it. It will be the basis for a quantum leap into
> greater
> understanding.
>
> For those who don't have access to this chart, try "Treatise on
> Cosmic Fire"
> Page 1230 and while you are at it look at chart V as well, in the
> same book.
> The charts are from the old theosophical periodicals and probably
> clearly
> acceptable to HPB however I can't judge that as I don't know
> enough. Ignore
> Cosmic Fire, but, the Charts, at least, seem intensely
> informative and
> valuable.
>
>
> The Monadic planes, the Intellectual Planes, and the Physical
> Planes
> correspond well to the same division ideas in transpersonal
> psychology and
> are refered to as the Transcendental States of Consciousness, The
> Transpersonal States of Consciousness, the Personal States of
> Consciousness.
>
> Please question everything I state as I am often wrong.
>
> Your friend and companion, indeed, truely,
>
> Eugene
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <dalval14@earthlink.net>
> To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 5:24 PM
> Subject: RE: Theos-World Emotional growth
>
>
> > February 23, 2001
> >
> >
> > Dear Friend:
> >
> > In S.D. I 181-2 H.P.B. offers an explanation of the "planes" in
> > which the ONE CONSCIOUSNESS can live, work, operate. They do
> not
> > agree with those you list below. In fact neither are they to
> be
> > found so identified in THE KEY TO THEOSOPHY where H.P.B. has
> > carefully provided us with explanations concerning the states
> of
> > consciousness.
> >
> > Consciousness for each individual MONAD is ONE. It is the
> > Perceiver. It draws on memories recorded in many planes (its
> > several vehicles).
> >
> > This tends to simplify our study and not to make it confusing.
> > For instance, take your listing, how will you be able to
> > determine what is CONSCIOUS and what is the subjects of
> > INVESTIGATION ?
> >
> > Consciousness is unitary and stable and looks on events,
> > thoughts, feelings and words and deeds, does it not ?
> >
> > Do help; me to understand what you are trying to say.
> >
> > What is the value of "emotional growth?" How does it arise?
> Who
> > uses it, and for what ?
> >
> > Best wishes,
> >
> > Dallas
> >
> > =============================
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Eugene Carpenter [mailto:Ecarpent@co.la.ca.us]
> > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 9:27 AM
> > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: Re: Theos-World Emotional growth
> >
> > Sorry, I just sent a blank reply.
> >
> > Let me try again.
> >
> > This(below) is such an important and lovely and enriching
> letter.
> > Thankyou
> > very very much. This is very encouraging and I'll have to
> > remember the
> > wonderful effects of emotional growth. Love to St. Francis.
> >
> >
> > It can be helpful to list the planes or states of consciousness
> > most
> > pertinent to the thinker:
> >
> > 1. Logoic
> > 2. Monadic
> > 3. Atmic
> > 4. Buddhic
> > 5. Manasic
> > 6. Astral
> > 7. Physical
> >
> > When HPB wrote, the term "astral" referred to the etheric plane
> > as it seems
> > so starlike to the clairvoyent. It is important also not to
> > confuse the
> > seven planes with the so-called seven principles and the seven
> > rays. These
> > are all intimately related and correspond in some fashion but
> > need to be
> > kept clear for communications sake. So "astral" refers
> sometimes
> > to the
> > etheric and sometimes to kama. And of course the etheric
> > manifests the
> > emotional as it does for the four manifested planes from Buddhi
> > downward.
> >
> > One other item of importance. Mulaprakriti is best associated
> > with the
> > Monadic plane it seems to me. It manifests through the Buddhic
> > plane. This
> > can be confusing and one can keep in mind that there always is
> > the noumenon
> > and then the phenomenon. If one can actually contact
> > mulaprakriti(or it's
> > equivalent to us) that contact manifests in one's heart as the
> > most
> > incredible Beauty. Small wonder that Parabrahmam is hopelessly
> > in love and
> > Parabrahmam/Mulaprakriti can be thought of as two aspects but
> are
> > in fact
> > the causeless cause, at the Cosmic Monadic Plane, of the cosmic
> > sacred
> > marriage that is in cosmic heaven(at the Cosmic Buddhic Plane,
> > the first
> > manifested plane, the fourth plane from the top) A more
> familiar
> > way of
> > listing the planes for HPB-ites might be:
> >
> > Mahaparanirvana
> > Paranirvana
> > Nirvana(Cosmic Atmic)
> > Cosmic Buddhi
> > Cosmic Manas
> > Cosmic Kama
> > Cosmic Physical
> >
> > These are the Macrocosmic planes. The first list corresponds
> but
> > are the
> > seven subplanes of the Cosmic Physical
> >
> > Cosmic Physical
> >
> > Logoic
> > Monadic
> > Atmic
> > Buddhic
> > Manasic
> > Astral
> > Physical
> >
> >
> > This is the map-like bread and butter of metaphysical
> > communication form my
> > limited perspective and a very good area in which students
> might
> > reach a
> > consensus.
> >
> > Love,
> > Gene
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <sanctius@mail.com>
> > To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>;
> > <valaistumattomat@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 7:41 PM
> > Subject: Theos-World Emotional growth
> >
> >
> > > Of astral bodybuilding and emotional growth:
> > >
> > > Once upon the time my threefold personality contained astral,
> > or the
> > > feeling body, that had a little problem. It was like a
> > bottleneck
> > > between my etheric/physical and mental bodies. Yes it was a
> > fine, nice
> > > and quite functioning little astral body, but it was missing
> > mass and
> > > depth. It was just feeling too little.
> > >
> > > So I began "a project" in order to correct that faculty of
> > mine, that
> > > was handicapping the bodies next to it, the physical and the
> > mental
> > > bodies. It's neighboroughs couldn't communicate each other
> too
> > well
> > > because every flow of energy went through that puny astral
> > body. It
> > > was also a risk to increase the capacity of the mental or
> > etheric
> > > bodies, because that would put too much stress into the
> astral
> > body.
> > > That kind of stress could easily rip astral body apart and
> > cause
> > > severe mental disorders. In order to expand my overall
> > personality and
> > > to make it more functional vehicle in the earth service, I
> > decided to
> > > grow my feeling point of experience, that would in turn
> remove
> > the
> > > friction with it's neighboroughs and perhaps making them work
> > as one,
> > > harmonized whole.
> > >
> > > How was it done? Simply. Crying, fearing, raging and loving.
> > Much of
> > > this emotional work was done while my body was sleeping, and
> > the rest
> > > of course when the body was awake. In the nighttime, very
> vivid
> > dreams
> > > began to appear. I ran, I hide, I feared, I screamed, I
> raged,
> > I
> > > crushed, I pounded, I devastated, I conquered, I died, I
> cried,
> > I
> > > talked, I studied, I travelled, I played, I laughed, I loved,
> I
> > > helped, I comforted, I healed. As I went through negative
> > feelings, I
> > > could feel more positive feelings too.
> > >
> > > Every time I climbed into sunny hills, there was a vale of
> > sorrow
> > > waiting for me. And every time i went through the darkest
> hell
> > of
> > > human experience, the positive feedback was almost immediate.
> I
> > pushed
> > > and extended my feeling body both upwards and downwards. I
> > rejoiced
> > > with angels, I battled with devils. I went thru the chaotic
> > black
> > > madness and thru the halls of silent perfect order. Calmed, I
> > was
> > > still in the middle, now extended. Thru hell I conquered
> > heaven.
> > >
> > > As I went through these experiences, I was adding lot of
> astral
> > mass
> > > into my astral body. I tamed those wild emotions of love,
> hate,
> > fear
> > > and sorrow. I brought them under my will and direction. It
> > might be
> > > sayed, that those emotional elementals are now "mine" and I
> > have
> > > responsibility over them, as I have reponsibility over my
> self.
> > They
> > > are me as I am them.
> > >
> > > Where did that astral matter come? Surely not out of nowhere?
> > From
> > > this very planet it came. Our Planetary Man is suffering of
> > those
> > > untamed emotions, and we have been called to cleanse and
> > stabilize His
> > > emotional body. The Earth is not yet a sacred planet, but
> > someday He
> > > shall be, as we shall be. Our responsibility is to carry as
> > much our
> > > planet's karma we can carry. This carry might be of emotional
> > kind,
> > > and as we make it under our combined will, the Planetary Man
> > shall be
> > > free and that sets us free too.
> > >
> > > Every day I cry, I dry the sea of sorrow. O:´)
> > >
> > > --
> > > http://www.kolumbus.fi/sanctius/myself.html
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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> >
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