Theos-Talk Archives (November 1998 Message tt00509)

Nov 28th

> From: Jerry Schueler
> Sent:	Saturday, November 28, 1998 9:29 AM
> Subject: Re: Re: Re: More on Karma

>Extrapolating from the Book of Dzyan, the SD commentaries, and
the three
>fundamental propositions or principles, we can infer that not
only does the
>Absolute consist of "abstract motion" -- which can only be
imagined as
>infinite spins around a point of zero attributes -- but,
further, these
spins must be the resolution of and contain all the information
(in the form of
>holographic interference patterns) experienced by the previous
universe,
>holistically, prior to its maha pralaya.

Well, I for one, can't make such an inference. Motion is an
expression,
together with Space, of the Absolute. The Absolute is outside of
space-time, while Motion (purusha, subjectivity) and Space
(prakriti,
objectivity) are inside.

DALLAS :
I THINK THIS IS CORRECT == HPB AND THE SD STATE THAT WE CANNOT
MAKE ANY COMPARISON BASED ON OUR SET OF LIMITED PERCEPTIONS WITH
THE ABSOLUTE.

IN "TRANSACTIONS" (P. 94-5 , ULT Edition vi, COMMENTS ON Stanza
3 - 1 "The last vibrations of the seventh eternity...- etc."  HPB
MAKES CLEAR WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN "EMANATION" AND
"RADIATION."  AN ASPECT OF THE ABSOLUTENESS RADIATES PERIODICALLY
UNDER KARMA (WHICH IS ITSELF) THE MANIFESTED - WHICH IS BASED ON
THE PERVIOUS "MANIFESTATION."


>This would. of course, also include
>the spiritualized memories of each individual ego, as it
traveled through
its myriads of incarnated existences during this prior period.


DALLAS :
HPB CORROBORATES THIS IN "ISIS UNVEILED AND THE VISISHTADWAITA"
which I quoted a few days ago.  I ALSO POSTED SEVERAL PAGE
REFERENCES IN S.D. WHICH ENDORSE THIS VIEW.
(EXAMPLE:  SD I 371, 380)


I do not believe for a second that such memories exist,
nor are they needed.


Dallas:  I DON'T GET YOUR LOGIC IN THIS.  OF COURSE IF YOU
BELIEVE THAT ALL IS NON-ESSED AT THE END OF A MAHA-KALPA THEN YOU
ARE RIGHT, BUT THAT WOULD NOT BE ECONOMICAL NOR WOULD THERE BE A
"SEED" FOR THE NEXT MAHA MANVANTARA.   I SUPPOSE WE CAN OPPOSE
OPINIONS FOREVER !


>  Since these
>primal spins ("seven robes of the eternal mother") also
represent the
>different planes extending from the past, present and future
spiritual
worlds to the material worlds--when the "mother" awakens and
enters into its new
maha manvantara, all these spins emanate, (or radiatively
"inflate" as
post-modern science expresses it) and step down through the
vibratory fields of the
three logos until, at the "big bang".



The Big Bang theory has recently come under a lot of fire. It has
to be
tweeked a lot in order to force it to fit the world we see today
(which
is NOT homogenous or linear at all). I prefer S Hawkings'
no-boundary
model which is slowly gaining ground in physics.

DALLAS:
SO DO I, AND I THINK WE WILL ALWAYS HAVE SOME DIFFICULTY IF WE
TRY TO PROJECT IN OUR MINDS, CONCERNING THE ABSOLUTE, ANY OF THE
MATERIAL CONCEPTS WE HAVE DEVELOPED.  SUFFICE IT TO SAY THAT
THERE ARE CENTERS OF FORCE AND ENERGY WHICH ARE ETERNAL IN THE
ULTIMATE SENSE - AND I WOULD CALL THAT LOGICAL.  NO MATTER HOW
EXTENSIVE THE TIME, DISTANCE OR MOVEMENT, IF WE TRY TO APPLY
THESE TO "MEASURE" OR "DEFINE" THE ABSOLUTE WE WILL FAIL.  SD I P
27 "Book of Dzyan, Stanza I, verse 8 :  SPEAKS OF THE
"UNCONSCIOUS PULSATION OF Life" in "Universal Space" - and it
also states that this is "SENSED BY THE OPEN EYE OF THE DANGMA."
Implying, I believe that there was a type of CONSCIOUSNESS which
was not "asleep," or non-essed" in the Maha-Kalpic-Pralaya.



>Understanding that all these rays from spirit through mind to
matter
emanate from the one source may give us the inner "picture" that
answers all of the
>above questions. . .  And, whose answer could only be?  (1)
Because it was
>always there, (2) it always had it, (3) the fundamental laws of
spin or
cycles guide it, and (4) its ultimate goal is for us to find out
who and what we
>really are, where we are going, and how we get there.
>>

This sounds like good answers.


>>Of what value is the concept of Karma or the equipoise of all
>>Nature ?
>
>Its value to us is only in understanding it, and placing our
individual
>nature's in harmony with the nature of the Universe by working
with its
>fundamental LAW. of Karma, or harmonious cyclic action (based
solely on
>original s(p)in:-)--and, thereby, realizing who we are, where we
came from,
>why we made the trip, and how we will be able to
return--immensely, if not
>infinitely wiser than when we started this cycle of our
existence.
>

Well, I agreed with you right up to the last business of being
"infinitely wiser than when we started" which implies a spiral
rather than a circle. I have a lot of trouble with spirals, which
have to start and end somewhere. Circles are neater because
they have no beginning or end points. A circle takes us right
back to where we started, sort of like assuming our Original
Face.


DALLAS :

How about a spiral which is part of the original carry over - if
we are dealing with true eternity and true immortality we cannot
determine a "beginning."  The only thing we think we are
determining is the proximate area of the "present" as the future
passes on back into the "past" each millisecond.

A circle may be neater because they are non-limited, but they are
also stagnant, as the "inane beatitude of pure Spirit" might be;
but, fortunately that is not so and progress of some kind is
always noticeable.

Dal.



Jerry S.