Theos-Talk Archives (May 1998 Message tt00391)

May 21st -- my how time flies

Dear Annette:

Glad to hear from you again -- lurk all you want.  Fact is that
it is quite "ok" if one thinks about what one reads and seeks to
draw from it that which is reasonable.  Questions help keep the
rest of us going.

HPB it is said, was, late in life approached by a sincere
student.  He interrupted her at work.  She looked up.  Saw he
needed something and composed herself to answer.  "What is it?"
she said.  "HPB what is the most important thing in Theosophy ?

"A sense of humor." she replied, somewhat to his discomfiture.

He continued, "Then, what is the second ?"  "Common sense," was
her answer, and she turned back to her work.  "But," he
importuned, "HPB, what is the third ?"  "More COMMON SENSE ," she
roared gesturing him to go, as she this time turned back to what
she still had to work on.

All we need to do is to work with what we already have got.  If
we wish to be competent students ( not dilettantes) in this study
of life in general and our lives in particular, we need to
organize what we already know, and what we are sure of, and also,
of that which we want to know about.

Once that is done we can heave a sigh of relief and start
seriously looking up meanings.  -- and determining what to do
with the information we have.

Theosophy, like every other science, has a vocabulary.  what is
daunting to many is the fact that it covers such an enormously
range -- in time, as history, and in religio-philosophies,  as
the belief-systems of many races and nations, some current and
others extinct -- because the current ones grew out of the older
ones.

It is interesting to do the following:   let's start with our
present Christianity.  Protestantism (and its 360 sects +) grew
out of abuses that became prevalent in Roman Catholicism.  Roman
Catholicism grew out of differences in interpretations with the
Old Orthodox Primitive Christianity, the remnants of which are in
Greece and Russia, etc...  Christianity grew out of Gnosticism,
Neo-Platonism and the reforms of Jesus--who came to reform his
people (but unto the lost sheep of Israel -- and it the
"Gentiles" who made a religion out of his work !), the Jews.
Judaism is of two basic levels -- that of the ancient Kabalists,
and that of the more popular faiths -- and these, of several
kinds show variations due to contact with Egypt, Babylon/Chaldea
which practiced Zoroastrianism, and other points of origin (which
can be traced back to India some 5 to 7,000 years ago).  The
Mysteries of Greece grew out of those from Egypt, and they in
turn grew out of the ancient Mysteries of India.  The Jews and
other Semites are said to have emigrated in several waves, as
groups (the Yadus) from Western India.  The further that we trace
back the origins of religions the more we find that they center
in three distinct groups, that of the Zoroastrians, the Hindus
and the Chinese.  This is only a brief survey, and many gaps
should be filled.

What is truly valuable is that Theosophy unifies all these and
shows that the religions are all sisters.

So maybe this is of some value to you to consider.

Best wishes,        Dallas

> Date: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 9:13 PM
> From: "Annette Rivington" <libidium@globalserve.net>
> Subject: Re: Theosophical Doctrines (HPB)

>Pam Giese wrote:
>>
>> > From: "Dallas TenBroeck" <dalval@nwc.net>
>> ---------<<<snip>>-
>> > What does it matter ?  HPB was initiated and there is a
Grand
>> > Lodge that has survived the aeons since "Man was Man."  And
>> > through Theosophy we have an opportunity of making a closer
>> > contact with the wisdom that the Brothers preserve.  Are we
going
>> > to waste time on the details of temporality when we have a
grand
>> > philosophy to work with and use ?  Are we seriously working
with
>> > that philosophy to prove or not prove to ourselves its value
?
>>
>> I am glad to see this paragraph.
>
>Same here, and same for yours and the postings that followed.
>I'd respectfully say to Dallas:  millions of us are seriously
working
>with "that philosophy" to understand it and us and the havoc we
do, not
>to prove or disprove its value :)
>
>> I would
>> also think this would mean taking a real cross-cultural
approach to
>> interperating this knowledge and experience.
>
>I think it's simply a case of semantics as far as sharing
experiences
>and interpretations.  (Interesting discussion with a Seik once
who saw
>me as an Anglo Dog, until he exclaimed, "that's much like what
we
>believe in".  Big smile).  Whether one believes that this truth
resides
>elsewhere to be sought and held, or resides within to be
released and
>shared, or resides in an infinite mixture of the two, simply
determines
>the path, not the beginning or end.  What the people have done
with the
>knowlege and/or forgetting of, is a whole different matter, as
written
>history constantly reminds us.
>
>> Maybe I'm off-base here. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
I've only been
>> on the list a few months and officially with the TSA a little
over a year.
>> Maybe the whole thrust is just an exercise in the archeology
of Victorian
>> occultism.
>
>I'm just a lurker and only feel the effects of the TSA when my
husband
>tries to live it and impacts me whether he likes to think he
does or
>not, but I'm well aware of this occultism hang up through TSA
and its
>readings (philosophical and historical), and the other side
through
>Spiritualist friends and visit to Lily Dale, and can only say
honestly
>now: get past it TSA, pleeeeease.  IMHO, it makes you more
vulnerable to
>deny it.
>
>>  As I've been staring at my TSA renewal notice, I've been
asking myself if
>> the TS is still a vital organization where new thought and the
energy is
>> being pumped through its veins.  I'm not sure.  Do the Masters
talk to
>> through the TS more than to Bill Gates or members on this
list?  I don't
>> know.
>
>An organization is simply the people who make it up and when all
people
>in concert, much more?
>Do the Masters not talk through you, through this list, through
stones
>and trees, in the whisperings of the wind?
>
>> What is this real work?  Is it service?  Investigation?  Let's
open for
>> ideas.
>
>Perhaps to take the fragments of the whole truth, us, and put us
back
>together, whole in truth.
>
>> Libidia and Alan had some banter about doing coffee 15,000
years ago.
>> (Okay, maybe I'm clueless and you two have recent history
together, but..)
>> I do believe that we all have had some connection before,
whether is was
>> coffee with Libidia or trailing after Avicenna as he fled
princedom to
>> princedom, we have shared history.
>
>You bet we have.  Whether you call truth God and say you are
"made" as a
>physical representation "in his image", identical but only part
of, or
>you say spirit resides in all, or you choose to think in any
permutation
>of the colours of the rainbow spanning each end, after walking
the
>circle or climbing the pyramid or flying the spiral, you meet
yourself
>again where space has no boundaries and time folds in on itself
and the
>physical body appears as a fantastic tool for treading the path.
>
>However, we can't use this knowlege if we have fear, doubt, and
need.
>
>As for service, investigation ?.........
>I have experienced the creation in whole and in part (and have
done a
>bit of procreating myself) and have decided that when each part
>manifests perfection in itself and simply does and is it, the
truth will
>be achieved.  I think HPB is a good example of this.  She went
for it
>for herself and the brotherhood of man was a natural
progression.
>Selflessness through self development (or releasing, depending
on
>whether you're comfortable with either Holy Grail scenario or
Acendance
>method).
>
>As for Alan and I .... Alan was the first cyber Theosophist in
my
>current life to hold out his hand to me and pass on some spirit.
He was
>quickly followed by many more.  I recognised him first as a
Puritan and
>second as a Druid.  He's part of the teaching of me, (whether he
>realizes it or not,) to be in spirit without the standing stones
and
>rolling hills.
>Cheers Pam
>Annette