Theos-Talk Archives (January 1998 Message tt00103)

> John Catron wrote:
>
> Mark, I wonder if maya includes not only Manifestation but also the
> unmanifest?  Looking at it within a reference of time, Manifestation is
> NOW, unmanifest is FUTURE.  If manifestation = now is maya and
> unmanifestation = future manifestation, then it too is maya.  Thus maya
> becomes the All, the totality, the IS.  ISNESS then becomes
> manifestation of the IS in the present.  Future is the unmanifest
> ISNESS,  So Maya then would be the Unmanifest as well as the Manifest.

<snip>
> It is funny, I had decided to just lurk, but Mark's remark kicked my
> "cogitation button" and I droppped my thoughts.  Basically at this point
> I'm thinking: IS is all there IS.

John,

It's more like the Absolute includes both the Manifest and the
Unmanifest, BEING and NOT BEING as well as the idea of Maya and Not-Maya
within it.

The logic resulting from "looking at it within a reference to time" can
only be applied to the mental formations of Manas and such a discussion
stems from the perceptions of Manas. Likewise, my response to you can do
no better and just goes to show the utter futility of words to speak of
the unspeakable. All we have to refer to are abstractions and metaphors.

The Absolute is not limited by time. It neither begins nor ends. It does
not change. It is no future event, nor a future manifestation. It is as
NOW as NOW gets and yet it is NO (particular) THING, NO (particular)
BEING. It has NO (particular) LOCATION. There is no time or place that
it "goes to" while waiting for manifestation to end. When manifestation
ends, time and space cease, for there is no one there to contain or
perceive it. It is the boundless All, containing both the Manifest and
the Unmanifest, as well as every possible duality, yet bound by none. It
is upon the potential of the realization of the cessation of maya NOW
that liberation rests.

The only "ALL, TOTALITY, or IS" we can perceive is BEING; phenomenal
existence in manifestation (in time and space.) Any form this takes, any
force or entity that this differentiates into, any multiplicity of
appearances and any perceptions we may have of it are all properly Maya.
"MahaMaya," the BIG MAYA: Collective illusion from a purely metaphysical
standpoint.

Whew! Now my head is spinning! Time for me to crawl back under my rock!
PS. My rock is Maya too! ;-)

But to say this doesn't mean that things are not real or that they do
not exist, only that they absolutely ARE not. They are real while they
last, but the lasting is not eternal. That's, I think, what Jerry meant
when he stressed the Buddhist distinction between conventional and
absolute reality/truth.

Ouch! My brain hurts!
Mark (but not Absolutely Mark).

If anyone is interested in the topic further, look for G. de Purucker's
readable "Space, and the doctrine of Maya." (Point Loma Publications)
--------
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> Everything but the Absolute is maya. Forms, forces and beings of any
> kind, on any plane that manifest or appear during a manvantara are all
> products of maya. Manifestation = maya.