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Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists

Mar 20, 2011 08:35 AM
by M. Sufilight

Dear Cass and friends

My views are:

When you throw an email or similar - you are offering an experience. If what you offer are designed so that it will have an impact on the reader - which leads to compassion - you are as far as I understand it teacing the individual.
But maybe we are dealing with semantics here.

Cass wrote:
"What you are suggesting is the same as the christian concept of forgiveness and kindness towards others. They have been talking about it for millenia but I still see very little of it in their action and the actions of their followers."

M. Sufilight says:
That is your interpretation, not mine.
What I am offering is that people meditate on what I write, and not that they merely blindly believe what I am offering.

Cass wrote:
"Karma is cause and effect - there is no moral issue attached to it. Karma acts indiscriminantly bringing about a reaction from an action but this does not mean that as a human I cannot have compassion for those who are suffering from karmic action."

M. Sufilight says:
And that compassion is a learner for other human beings. And when one offer such compassion, one also teach, as far as I understand the term.

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----
From: Cass Silva
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2011 2:30 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists

No,no,no we cannot teach altruism - it is not a science or a humanities subject. We cannot teach compassion, we cannot teach understanding. They are all learned through experiencing suffering by once being selfish, non compassionate and misunderstanding.

What you are suggesting is the same as the christian concept of forgiveness and kindness towards others. They have been talking about it for millenia but I still see very little of it in their action and the actions of their followers.

Karma is cause and effect - there is no moral issue attached to it. Karma acts indiscriminantly bringing about a reaction from an action but this does not mean that as a human I cannot have compassion for those who are suffering from karmic action.

Cass

--- On Fri, 18/3/11, M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid>
Subject: Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Received: Friday, 18 March, 2011, 5:20 AM

And the Law of Karma is then unacceptable?
And we cannot teach altruism?

----- Original Message -----
From: Cass Silva
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2011 1:02 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists

Yes, but there is no comfort in knowing that thousands are dying in the most horrific circumstances.

Cass

--- On Thu, 17/3/11, M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

Yes, I agree very much on that.

----- Original Message -----
From: Cass Silva
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 16, 2011 4:51 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists

The world is now paying off our karmic debts stemming from Atlantis. The Atlantean souls that chose to use technology for their own selfish desires are now paying the price. The inundation prevented them from furthering along on that path, which god alone, knows what damage it could have done. As you say the Guardians of the Earth, take care that the few will not destroy the planet for the many.

Cass

--- On Wed, 16/3/11, M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

Dear Cass and friends

My views are:

Try to read my previous e-mail about Orlog and Skuld.
Have you seen the Masters prevent what happened in the past?
And did the past disappearence of Atlantis happen due to karma?

From time to time, not even the Masters can interfer.
Fast reforms in human nature does not occur in certain time periods.

So are the decree of Orlog and Skuld.
We can of course only do our best to seek to promote a non-secterian search after the meaning of life and its truth. Non-secterian and therefore not secterian.

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----
From: Cass Silva
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2011 1:49 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists

What we are witnessing at the moment is collective and national karma. I have not read one word of compassion from theos talk who have not been effected by recent events in the world, who are more concerned with concepts rather than reality.

We are witnessing Noahic floods and devastation and all one can discuss is theosophical literature and conceptual ideas on what it means to be altruistic. The irony is that if the destruction continues, and I believe it will, accessing E-books will be the last thing on peoples minds.

Cass

--- On Tue, 15/3/11, M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

Dear Cass and friends

My views are:

I will say, that those who are concerned about the Law of Karma and Reincarnation - are concerned with the karmic need of the individual and humanity as a whole, and its various groups.

I would rather say that people need help for their psychological requirements!
Theosophy is as we know the exact science on psychology. Altruism is the core, which I am concerned with as a theosophical Seeker, and not primarily physical events.

And no, the soul will not just like that take care of it self. Sorry, but I disagree.
The soul understood as Kama-Manas will not for obvious reasons take care of it self. The soul understood as Atma-Buddhi-Manas will neither. Teaching and compassion are even important here according to my knowledge. But, these are just my views.

I say:
First the promotion of altruism - and reform in human nature.
After that materialism will become less imoprtant.
Without reform in human nature - I find business-related charity and the wellmeaning rebuilding of a materialistic society is a less promising agenda. - Yet, of course one aught to help those who are in need. That implies not necessarily that one help them with what they think they need, but what they are in spiritual need of, so a reform in human nature might take place.

But, these are just my views.

M. Sufilight

----- Original Message -----
From: Cass Silva
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2011 1:57 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists

We are in a different world to that which Blavatsky spoke of. People who have experienced catastrophes and lived through them need help for their physical requirements - the soul will take care of itself.

Why is that the Roman church keeps silent during these times. Because they couldn't give a rats arse about the victims. ;let alone putting financial support behind them.

Cass

--- On Mon, 14/3/11, M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@ei-nuAD4qPNCd1izaC2_-8cgZejT8mWyVhyZBvlqG9k8FVWJE7ftPvzYoUJ4y3atV9CwtNkokJzZ0SsiejkeXsIPwOwsXA.yahoo.invalid>
Subject: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Received: Monday, 14 March, 2011, 2:40 AM

Dear friends

My views are:

Now most of us have just seen the problems in Japan - which are given huge media coverage.
People because of that, seem to forget the sufferings in other regions on the globe, and especially the poor in Africa.

H. P. Blavatsky something quite special about Charity:
"ENQUIRER. But surely every one knows that millions and millions are spent annually on private and public charities?

THEOSOPHIST. Oh, yes; half of which sticks to the hands it passes through before getting to the needy; while a good portion or remainder gets into the hands of professional beggars, those who are too lazy to work, thus doing no good whatever to those who are really in misery and suffering. Haven't you heard that the first result of the great outflow of charity towards the East-end of London was to raise the rents in Whitechapel by some 20 per cent.?

ENQUIRER. What would you do, then?

THEOSOPHIST. Act individually and not collectively; follow the Northern Buddhist precepts: "Never put food into the mouth of the hungry by the hand of another"; "Never let the shadow of thy neighbour (a third person) come between thyself and the object of thy bounty"; "Never give to the Sun time to dry a tear before thou hast wiped it." Again "Never give money to the needy, or food to the priest, who begs at thy door, through thy servants, lest thy money should diminish gratitude, and thy food turn to gall."

ENQUIRER. But how can this be applied practically?

THEOSOPHIST. The Theosophical ideas of charity mean personal exertion for others; personal mercy and kindness; personal interest in the welfare of those who suffer; personal sympathy, forethought and assistance in their troubles or needs. We Theosophists do not believe in giving money (N. B., if we had it) through other people's hands or organizations. We believe in giving to the money a thousandfold greater power and effectiveness by our personal contact and sympathy with those who need it. We believe in relieving the starvation of the soul, as much if not more than the emptiness of the stomach; for gratitude does more good to the man who feels it, than to him for whom it is felt. Where's the gratitude which your "millions of pounds" should have called forth, or the good feelings provoked by them? Is it shown in the hatred of the East-End poor for the rich? in the growth of the party of anarchy and disorder? or by those thousands of unfortunate working
girls, victims to the "sweating" system, driven daily to eke out a living by going on the streets? Do your helpless old men and women thank you for the workhouses; or your poor for the poisonously unhealthy dwellings in which they are allowed to breed new generations of diseased, scrofulous and rickety children, only to put money into the pockets of the insatiable Shylocks who own houses? Therefore it is that every sovereign of all those "millions," contributed by good and would-be charitable people, falls like a burning curse instead of a blessing on the poor whom it should relieve. We call this generating national Karma, and terrible will be its results on the day of reckoning. "
http://www.phx-ult-lodge.org/aKEY.htm

And I agree with Blavatsky very much even today.
Despite this, we witness many a so-called theosophist even among leaders of various groups - promote - another view. Namely that Charity is something good - and - saying that one just have to find the "right" organisation to support. We see such views expressed among people on various theospohical forums these days.

But these are of course my views on Charity - and - how to tackle altruism.

M. Sufilight

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Follow-Ups:
- Re: theos-talk Charity among the theosophists
  - From: Cass Silva <silva_cass@QKbHb9gDzOJgCLCjXXnfujUgUXVr4k31aS1pQf7U68qWFWZSVr3FGyg2vFsjPDGlysmw09FaELsTCdk.yahoo.invalid>

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