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Re: theos-talk Alien life certain to exist on Earth-like planet, scientists say

Oct 02, 2010 06:55 AM
by John W

Here is a post of mine on other groups about this scientific announcement. John W.

Fw: Re: ** Gliese 581g 'Goldilocks' Planet Could Be Just Right For Life?
        	Friday, 1 October, 2010 10:51 PM
            From:"John W" <>
        	To: ,,,,,,,,,,,,, moreThis is a post of mine on another group. John W.

--- On Fri, 1/10/10, John W <> wrote:
From: John W <>
Subject: Re: ** Gliese 581g 'Goldilocks' Planet Could Be Just Right For Life?
Date: Friday, 1, October, 2010, 10:20 PM



to the fact that the luminosity and radiation output of main-sequence
stars vary as the 7/2 power of mass, that red-dwarf star is likely to
be too small for any otherwise habitable planet to avoid having
"captured rotation" through having to be so close to the star,
resulting in nearly all water precipitating as ice on the dark side,
and the sunlit side becoming a hot desert. However, the larger such a
planet is, the longer it would take for tidal friction to eventually
result in "captured rotation".

A suitable star must be at least
an main-sequence orange K2 type dwarf in size, about 0.7 of the Sun's
mass to avoid an otherwise habitable planet developing "captured
rotation" in its lifetime; but no larger than about a yellow-white F3
type, about 1.3 times the Sun's mass, or else it will not live long
enough (at least 3 billion years is required) to evolve an habitable
planet, on which complex life can evolve or which can be colonized by
advanced aliens from elsewhere. The Sun is of type G2, and stars with
habitable planets are likely to be predominantly yellow G-type. The
lifetime of a star on the "main sequence", before swelling and becoming
excessively luminous due to depletion of hydrogen in its core, is
inversely proportional to the 5/2 power of mass, resulting in an upper
size limit beyond which stars do not remain on the main sequence for
long enough. A "red dwarf" star would be M-class, smaller than aÂ
K-type orange dwarf, which is smaller again than a yellow G- or late
F-type star; and its radiation would be deficient in blue, violet, and
especially ultraviolet light, which have important physiological roles.

news item about the discovery of this planet also said that it is
estimated to have between 3 and 4 times the Earth's mass. AÂ planet
larger than about 2 Earth masses would run the risk of being completely
covered by water, due to retaining an excessive amount of water (and
smaller amounts of other frozen volatiles such as ammonia and methane)
from the bombardment by comets from the Kuiper Belt and Oort Cloud, in
its very early stage of evolution. Such a planet, if of similar average
density to Earth's, may also have an excessively high gravity, and
excessively dense atmosphere. These features would prevent land mammals
and birds and plants from ever evolving on such a planet, even if it
was large enough to resist the tidal friction that would eventually
cause "captured rotation".

"Habitable Planets For Man", by Stephen H. Dole (Rand - 1964 &
1970), which has been converted to a public-domain PDF ebook and can be
downloaded through either of these web-pages, approx. 12 Mb RAR archive:

John W.

--- On Fri, 1/10/10, <> wrote:
From: <>
Subject: ** Gliese 581g 'Goldilocks' Planet Could Be Just Right For Life?
Date: Friday, 1, October, 2010, 4:24 AM

Gliese 581g 'Goldilocks' Planet Could Be Just Right For Life?

By SETH BORENSTEIN | 09/29/10 09:23 PM

It's just right. Just like Earth.

"This really is the first Goldilocks planet," 

said co-discoverer R. Paul Butler of the Carnegie Institution of Washington.

The new planet sits smack in the middle of what 

astronomers refer to as the habitable zone, 

unlike any of the nearly 500 other planets 

astronomers have found outside our solar system. 

And it is in our galactic neighborhood, 

suggesting that plenty of Earth-like planets circle other stars.

Finding a planet that could potentially support 

life is a major step toward answering the timeless question: Are we alone?

Scientists have jumped the gun before on 

proclaiming that planets outside our solar system 

were habitable only to have them turn out to be 

not quite so conducive to life. But this one is 

so clearly in the right zone that five outside 

astronomers told The Associated Press it seems to be the real thing.

"This is the first one I'm truly excited about," 

said Penn State University's Jim Kasting. He said 

this planet is a "pretty prime candidate" for harboring life.

Life on other planets doesn't mean E.T. Even a 

simple single-cell bacteria or the equivalent of 

shower mold would shake perceptions about the uniqueness of life on Earth.

Story continues below


But there are still many unanswered questions 

about this strange planet. It is about three 

times the mass of Earth, slightly larger in width 

and much closer to its star â 14 million miles 

away versus 93 million. It's so close to its 

version of the sun that it orbits every 37 days. 

And it doesn't rotate much, so one side is almost 

always bright, the other dark.

Temperatures can be as hot as 160 degrees or as 

frigid as 25 degrees below zero, but in between â 

in the land of constant sunrise â it would be 

"shirt-sleeve weather," said co-discoverer Steven 

Vogt of the University of California at Santa Cruz.

It's unknown whether water actually exists on the 

planet, and what kind of atmosphere it has. But 

because conditions are ideal for liquid water, 

and because there always seems to be life on 

Earth where there is water, Vogt believes "that 

chances for life on this planet are 100 percent."

The astronomers' findings are being published in 

Astrophysical Journal and were announced by the 

National Science Foundation on Wednesday.

The planet circles a star called Gliese 581. It's 

about 120 trillion miles away, so it would take 

several generations for a spaceship to get there. 

It may seem like a long distance, but in the 

scheme of the vast universe, this planet is "like 

right in our face, right next door to us," Vogt said in an interview.

That close proximity and the way it was found so 

early in astronomers' search for habitable 

planets hints to scientists that planets like Earth are probably not that rare.

Vogt and Butler ran some calculations, with giant 

fudge factors built in, and figured that as much 

as one out of five to 10 stars in the universe 

have planets that are Earth-sized and in the habitable zone.

With an estimated 200 billion stars in the 

universe, that means maybe 40 billion planets 

that have the potential for life, Vogt said. 

However, Ohio State University's Scott Gaudi 

cautioned that is too speculative about how common these planets are.

Vogt and Butler used ground-based telescopes to 

track the star's precise movements over 11 years 

and watch for wobbles that indicate planets are 

circling it. The newly discovered planet is 

actually the sixth found circling Gliese 581. Two 

looked promising for habitability for a while, 

another turned out to be too hot and the fifth is 

likely too cold. This sixth one bracketed right 

in the sweet spot in between, Vogt said.

With the star designated "a," its sixth planet is called Gliese 581g.

"It's not a very interesting name and it's a 

beautiful planet," Vogt said. Unofficially, he's 

named it after his wife: "I call it Zarmina's World."

The star Gliese 581 is a dwarf, about one-third 

the strength of our sun. Because of that, it 

can't be seen without a telescope from Earth, 

although it is in the Libra constellation, Vogt said.

But if you were standing on this new planet, you 

could easily see our sun, Butler said.

The low-energy dwarf star will live on for 

billions of years, much longer than our sun, he 

said. And that just increases the likelihood of 

life developing on the planet, the discoverers said.

"It's pretty hard to stop life once you give it 

the right conditions," Vogt said.


The National Science Foundation:


--- On Sat, 2/10/10, MKR <> wrote:
From: MKR <>
Subject: Re: theos-talk Alien life certain to exist on Earth-like planet, scientists say
Date: Saturday, 2, October, 2010, 4:02 PM



      If they are advanced than us, they will grab some of us and take them back

and keep us in their zoo. This would possibility would terrify everyone


On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 2:14 PM, Erica L. Georgiades <>wrote:


> Or bring to earth strange forms of life to expose on a a kind of zoo....but

> if

> the Aliens are technologically more advanced, and also are bad short green

> guys, than we will be in trouble... :)


> ________________________________

> From: MKR < <>>

> To: <>

> Sent: Fri, October 1, 2010 11:07:06 PM

> Subject: Re: theos-talk Alien life certain to exist on Earth-like planet,

> scientists say


> Once they locate life outside Earth, they will send our military to conquer

> and take over the planet.............


> On Fri, Oct 1, 2010 at 1:38 PM, Erica L. Georgiades <<>

> >wrote:

Â> Alien life certain to exist on Earth-like planet, scientists say

> >




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