Theos-Talk Archives (June 2009 Message tt00627)

Seems to me that there have been a few in the TS who have been loyal to their ideas rather than the ideas expressed through the masters!     

Cass


>
>From: preethi muthiah <seeker_preethi@yahoo.com>
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Wednesday, 24 June, 2009 6:56:42 PM
>Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Cleansing of bad influences
>
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>Hi all,
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>In a letter from the Masters of the Wisdom to AP Sinnett, the Master KH mentions that we must learn as Theosophists to be loyal to the Idea rather than to Them. I would paraphrase that statement to say that we must learn to be loyal to the Idea rather than to the Society (which is defined as a collection of individuals with a common goal or Object)...the goal is always bigger than its instrument. The Object or Idea of the Theosophical Society is bigger than the Society itself, which is an instrument. So put rightly, and here I am including a point made by Prof CA Shinde -- a well-wisher, committed member-worker at Adyar, a national lecturer of the Indian Section of the TS -- when we last met at Adyar that my leaving the ES and Adyar is going to be loss for these two organizations. ..to put it rightly, the TS and ES and Adyar have had very few "successes" or "gains" since their inception... .
>
>I believe I am not a "loss" to the TS or ES or Adyar. In fact, i am oned with their spirit...One needs to understand the purpose behind the founding of the TS and one would then see that when an aspirant after the Truth finds his/her feet and takes the first step to speak the Truth as s/he sees it, s/he becomes a "success" or "gain" for the organization founded to be a forum where truth seekers can find the space to explore and express the Truth, as they see it.
>
>Seen this way, Mrs Burnier is definitely a loss to the TS. As are the other GC members who don't do anything to uphold the Truth. as also members of the TS who are even now keeping silent, doing nothing, postponing the decisive moment....
>
>Fraternal Greetings
>Preethi
>
>--- On Mon, 22/6/09, Anton Rozman <anton_rozman@ yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>From: Anton Rozman <anton_rozman@ yahoo.com>
>Subject: Theos-World Re: Cleansing of bad influences
>To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
>Date: Monday, 22 June, 2009, 9:50 PM
>
>Thanks Roberta; yes, I mean "unable"!
>
>--- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, "robertapimenta26" <robertapimenta26@ ...> wrote:
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>>
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>> Mr. Rozman,
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>> 
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>> You write: "'enable' to reveal their identity", perhaps you mean UNABLE, yes? 
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>> 
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>> ES members are TS members, and in this capacity they should have the decency to come out and speak up, if it's true that the present situation is that alarming. It is all about the TS (Adyar) and its task as vehicle for theosophy. If truth is what members want to go for, so be it, no matter what the price is: ES member TS member, or like me, no member but independent, what is there to loose?
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>> 
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>> Roberta
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>> 
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>> --- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, "Anton Rozman" <anton_rozman@ > wrote:
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>> >
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>> > Dear Roberta and all,
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>> > 
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>> > It is clear that in regard to the critical issues concerning the management of the Theosophical Society the TS Headquarters Administration doesn't correspond directly and publicly with membership and that there was number of persons who in last two years somehow spoke on its behalf having access to critical documents. It is not clear if this highly questionable and unconstitutional way of communication was chosen by TS Headquarters Administration itself or arbitrarily by some individuals or group of people what would indicate the presence of parallel government within the Theosophical Society. In addition, it seems that there is present also strong tendency to represent somehow distorted picture and that there are some TS members who are highly alarmed because of this situation and are trying to convey more faithful information but who are, for various reasons, enable to reveal their identity. It is my impression that until the ES members, who are
>after all members of the TS, will not be in the position or willing to speak publicly about the real state of affairs and to show their genuine concern regarding the fate of the Theosophical Society, there is great danger that we will ultimately lose the TS as we imagine it.
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>> > 
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>> > Warmest regards,
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>> > Anton
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>> > 
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>> > 
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>> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, "robertapimenta26" <robertapimenta26@ > wrote:
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>> > >
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>> > > Dear Mr. Rozman,
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>> > > 
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>> > > The silence from the International President (Adyar) is significant, but not surprising. Some individuals are doing the talking for her, like Mr. Pedro Oliveira, who according to some messages I received is travelling through Europe at the moment. There are alarming stories going round and they point to two main issues: 1) the adminstration of the Adyar estate itself, the contribution of Mrs. Preethi was an example and 2) a secret attempt by the International President to do away with all those who believe that she cannot fulfil her office as International President any longer. Mind you, these are, for as far as I am concerned only rumours, don't want to speculate, but does any of you contributors know more about this? 
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>> > > 
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>> > > Roberta
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>> > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, "Anton Rozman" <anton_rozman@ > wrote:
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>> > > >
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>> > > > Cass,
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>> > > > 
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>> > > > We are all missing the "word of the President", addressing this critical situation, proposing solutions, indicating the way out. Is not this silence possibly crying out that maybe she is not in a position to speak on her own any more?
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>> > > > 
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>> > > > Best regards,
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>> > > > Anton
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>> > > > 
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>> > > > 
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>> > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, Cass Silva <silva_cass@ > wrote:
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>> > > > >
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>> > > > > I don't hear any cries of helplessness coming from Ms Burnier unless of course she is hoping that the bad publicity will go away?
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>> > > > > 
>
>> > > > > Cass
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>> > > > > 
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>> > > > > 
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>> > > > > >
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>> > > > > >From: Anton Rozman <anton_rozman@ >
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>> > > > > >To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
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>> > > > > >Sent: Sunday, 21 June, 2009 2:45:39 PM
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>> > > > > >Subject: Re: Theos-World Cleansing of bad influences
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>> > > > > >
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>> > > > > >
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>> > > > > >Dear Cass,
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>> > > > > >
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>> > > > > >Every patient wants to be cured. Resistance is just sign of deep helplessness and is actually cry for help. The only remedy is truth of facts which can be very painful, so that some would rather die than expose it. But in this situation we are all patients and we can cure ourselves only with mutual help and humility. No one is above the situation, no one is without guilt. We all allowed it to happen, some more and some less. We are all in the same boat.
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>> > > > > >
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>> > > > > >Best regards,
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>> > > > > >Anton
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>> > > > > >
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>> > > > > >--- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, Cass Silva <silva_cass@ ....> wrote:
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>> > > > > >>
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>> > > > > >> Anton, the patient must want to be cured before any healing can take place!
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>> > > > > >> 
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>> > > > > >> Cass
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>> > > > > >> 
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>> > > > > >> 
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>> > > > > >>  
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >From: preethi muthiah <seeker_preethi@ ...>
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>> > > > > >> >To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
>
>> > > > > >> >Sent: Saturday, 20 June, 2009 6:29:35 PM
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>> > > > > >> >Subject: Re: Theos-World Cleansing of bad influences
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >Hi MKR,
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >If i could put it more appropriately cleansing is needed overall, but instead of harping on about the "secret disenfranchising attempt made by some of the General Secretaries -- which i understand was just a suggestion rather than a finalized move -- one needs to look at the reasons why this suggestion was even thought about". In treating a disease, one can either look at the symptoms or at the root cause.
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >If you start looking at the root cause of this whole problem you will, willy-nilly, trace it back to the ineffective leadership of the current international president (which she has been over the past 29 years), Mrs Radha Burnier and the policies she uses to "rule".
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >One will also notice, if one is perceptive, that the attempt from Mrs Burnier's lobbyists has always been to look at the symptoms and focus attention there, rather than to look at the root cause of this whole division in the TS.
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >One can then look at some of these things deeply and question them or ponder over them: (a) What is all this fear doing in an organization that has altruism as its ideal; (b) Why does the leader of this organization initiate gossip and why has she never thought about the deep-seated effects this kind of behaviour will generate among members; (c) One would expect the head of a spiritual organization to have insight into human nature. Why  has this aspect of Mrs Burnier never found expression even though opportunities for this insight and resultant understanding were present throughout her career as president of the TS, including during the elections and its aftermath? and (d) since we are all supposed to be intelligent, thinking, rational individuals, why, even when the corruption rampant in Adyar is brought to everyone's attention, are we allowing Mrs Burnier to rule our hearts and minds?
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >Preethi
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >--- On Sat, 20/6/09, MKR <mkr777@gmail. com> wrote:
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >From: MKR <mkr777@gmail. com>
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>> > > > > >> >Subject: Re: Theos-World Cleansing of bad influences
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>> > > > > >> >To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
>
>> > > > > >> >Date: Saturday, 20 June, 2009, 1:16 AM
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >Cleansing is needed more urgently in the West, IMHO. Have we forgotten last
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >year's failed ultra secret attempt to disenfranchise all of us and handdful
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >of GC members seize power to "appoint" the president, thus make the
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >president a puppet in their hands?
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >MKR
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >Visit www.theosophy. net
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >On 6/16/09, preethi muthiah <seeker_preethi@ yahoo.com> wrote:
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>> > > > > >> >> Hi all,
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >>
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>> > > > > >> >> Am glad we are looking into cleansing here. Cleansing is what the TS and
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> especially its heart, Adyar, requires today...and it is we who need to do
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> the cleansing... We members of the Theosophical Society. Would you like to
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>> > > > > >> >> join me?
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>> > > > > >> >> Preethi
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> --- On Mon, 15/6/09, Cass Silva <silva_cass@ yahoo. com<silva_cass% 40yahoo.com> >
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> wrote:
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>> > > > > >> >> From: Cass Silva <silva_cass@ yahoo. com <silva_cass% 40yahoo.com> >
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> Subject: Re: Theos-World Cleansing of bad influences
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com <theos-talk% 40yahoogroups. com>
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>> > > > > >> >
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>> > > > > >> >> Date: Monday, 15 June, 2009, 7:06 AM
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>> > > > > >> >> Only that the smoke from sage cleanses negative spirits?
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>> > > > > >> >> Cass
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>> > > > > >> >> >From: MKR <mkr777@gmail. com>
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>> > > > > >> >> >To: theos-talk <theos-talk@ yahoogro ups.com>
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>> > > > > >> >> >Sent: Monday, 15 June, 2009 1:17:44 AM
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>> > > > > >> >> >Subject: Theos-World Cleansing of bad influences
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>> > > > > >> >> >With all the bad entities operating around us and perhaps against us as
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>> > > > > >> >> >well, either by themselves, or through some unsuspecting deluded victims,
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>> > > > > >> >> >HSO mentioned that before he and HPB took residence anywhere, it was
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>> > > > > >> >> >approved by a Brother or Brothers and it was cleansed of undesirable
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>> > > > > >> >> >influences etc. before they moved in. When the cleansing was done, the
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>> > > > > >> >> place
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>> > > > > >> >> >was vacated of everyone. It has been reported that similar cleansing was
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>> > > > > >> >> >done by Jiddu Krishnamurti.
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>> > > > > >> >> >Has anyone read more about the issue of cleansing?
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>> > > > > >> >> >MKR
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>> > > > > >> >> >More on theosophy at www.theosophy. net
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