Theos-Talk Archives (December 2008 Message tt00078)

No problem John and no need to blame the spellchecker, HPB herself 
was known to be a tippler of fine mokvba vodka which leads to its own 
kind of moksha:) 


--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Augoeides-222@... wrote:
>
> Richard,
>   It is hard to beleive that after tediously usiny the spell 
checker and making other direct corrections that this post ended as 
screwed up as we see it! My spell checker must have been drunk!
> Regards,
> John
> 
> -------------- Original message -------------- 
> From: Augoeides-222@... 
> Richard,
> Not intending to offend people who hold GDP is high regard. My 
personal view is he had zero idea of real Tibetan History and carries 
the karma for grossly misinforming a huge number of people that 
valued his erroneous renditions which are equivelent to nothing more 
than Theosophical fantasy's where he never knew of the oppressions of 
all the Tibetan sects by the Gelugpa such as is written by David 
Reigle and many Historians? How did theosophical teachers rely on 
bullcrap? GDP was never any expert on Tibet based on the quote you 
used. One can make almost any assertion to ignorant uninformed masses 
of followers and the general public and on a snap decision they will 
follow in suit as long as the assertion seems plausible and 
reasonable and aligns with the group agreements, but that doesn't 
make it right or correct. Just my personal views. There were huge 
omissions by Theosophy back then as to events on the world stage. 
Krakatoa seems to have been ignored in the main. The history
> of the British Troops in Tibet, the Russians, and others needs to 
be read from real Historians and then compared to Theosophy views. I 
don't mean there should not be "esoteric" views given in Theosophy 
but there is no possibility that true real events that really 
happened can ever be ignored in favor of unsubstantiated assertions 
that have no real basis and that when you look and it ends in a blind 
alley where no records are obtainable the ground is treacherous.
> The Gelugpa committed gross overt acts against any in Tibet who 
helvariantnBuddhistst views that includes also the Tashi Lama. 
Exterminating, burning, making anathema Kagyu, Sakya , Jonompa, and 
the others to include the Bon and also Shaminism. It was anything but 
a Happy time, tens of thousands of Tibetans lived in fear of severe 
grave reprisals and even death for many centuries not from a foreign 
power, but from the Gelugpsuccessionon. Their Monastery's were burnt 
to the ground by Gelugpa. Their sacred Texts, Sutra'sReligious 
Objects and History's were destroyed and burnt with a zeal that 
equeleequeledquisition that HPB wrote so much about. Isn't it curious 
that the so morale, ethical followers invent 
ratirationalizationsaccomadate their need to accept bullcrap? At 
least there is one person that accepts group karma for theitheir 
deeds of the past and is making efforts to unburden the 
accumaccumulationt is the Dalai Lama Lamaelf in the current era. Just 
my view. I adjure peopl
> e to read the actual history of negotiations with the 
TibeTibetan'sing the modern period it is hysterically rediredictulous 
the extreme and had me in tears laughing at the mindless responses of 
the Gelugpa and the AdmAdministrativevGovernmentat nearly drove any 
foreigner insane lol!!!
> 
> When is comes to real History I have found Theosophical versions 
skewed, contorted, absent of real factual analysisin several cases. 
It is very "New Age" in the context of la la land acceptance of pure 
baloney in certain cases. I don't think Tibet had "abominable 
intestines", I think he was trying to say "abominable internecine".
> 
> Sorry if Isensibilitys sensabilitys here but I have a terrible 
habit if being some what direct and blunt atapologizeo I apoligize in 
advance recognizing certain people have needs to be assuaged by some 
people who may read this post.
> 
> Regards,
> John 
> 
> -------------- Original message -------------- 
> From: "Richard Semock" <semockr@...> 
> I know it as moksha and consider myself on the path of pratyeka as 
> one that does not like sudden changes but once freed from the 
wheel, 
> dont expect to see me returning in selfless service to mankind or 
> anything of the kind. Its strictly splitsville for me. Until then 
> however I see a responsibility to ensure that Kali Yuga does not 
win 
> in Tibet.
> 
> As for the Tashi Lama, GdeP, the expert theosophist and a big say 
in 
> certain circles has this to say. His prescience in this matter as 
is 
> his prediction of conditions on the moon turns out to be something 
of 
> a turnabout according to what he says in the last paragraph:
> 
> "Is it known why the Dalai Lama drove the Tashi Lama out into 
India? 
> He has had to fly to Mongolia and live there in seclusion and hide 
> there. It seems a mystery. [Question asked in 1932] 
> 
> It is a mystery. I can tell you this: if the truth were known, 
there 
> was no 'driving out' at all. Tibet has been doing its best in 
> desperation to keep its frontiers inviolate against the hammering 
> tactics of Western European powers trying to penetrate into the 
> country; and they have resorted to the age-old Asiatic ways of 
> diplomacy -- letting things appear which are not so, if you 
> understand me. 
> 
> It is true that Tibet in the past has had abominable intestine 
> struggles and wars; but that was mostly before the reformation of 
> Tsong-kha-pa. After his time, which was the fourteenth century of 
our 
> era, things have been quieter; and century after century has seen a 
> happy people, light-hearted, loving learning, cultivating the 
things 
> of the spirit and of the mind. 
> 
> There is a great future before the Tibetans. They are a 'young 
race,' 
> evolutionally speaking. They are going to come forth in the future. 
> But they won't be Tibetans then as the Tibetans now are."
> 
> Studies in Occult Philosophy by G. de Purucker 
> Theosophical University Press Online Edition 
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Augoeides-222@ wrote:
> >
> > Erica, 
> > There is more than one spelling even in India and sometimes in 
> country's in Europe they have their own version. Take your choice, 
> Moksha is fine also it means final liberation. 
> > 
> > Regards,
> > John
> > 
> > -------------- Original message -------------- 
> > From: Erica Letzerich <eletzerich@> 
> > Maybe you mean Moksha?
> > Erica
> > 
> > ________________________________
> > From: "Augoeides-222@" <Augoeides-222@>
> > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 7:28:51 PM
> > Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Some thoughts on the situation of 
Tibet
> > 
> > Morten,
> > The tradition of Moskva is ancient Hindu and long before there 
was 
> any Russia or Moscow by more than 4000 years lol! I agree it 
strikes 
> the mind as "Moscow" if one is not familiar. Moskva 
> means "Liberation" . 
> > Another interesting word from Hindu is "Svar" (Svarupa) it is 
found 
> in several forms, but in the stream of time it's permutative 
presence 
> is also found in many prominent cultures. Such as:
> > Caesar--- Rome
> > Czar ----Russia
> > Kaiser---Germany
> > 
> > Regards,
> > John
> > 
> > ------------ -- Original message ------------ -- 
> > From: "Morten Nymann Olesen" <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk> 
> > LOL
> > Thanks, that touched my heart.
> > In my country the word "moskva" is the same as the capitol in 
> Russia.
> > I was flat on the floor laughing with tears and all.
> > 
> > But allright.
> > Carry on.
> > 
> > M. Sufilight
> > 
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: Augoeides-222@ comcast.net 
> > To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com 
> > Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 6:09 PM
> > Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Some thoughts on the situation of 
Tibet
> > 
> > Richard,
> > >>> The thought that in order for anyone to be freed from the 
wheel 
> > everyone must be freed from it according to the Mahayana 
school.<<<
> > 
> > I don't know where you got that view. The Mahayana also speaks of 
> Pratyeka Buddha's who individually obtain moskva by not becoming 
> Bodhisattva. There are also I believe several other unique 
individual 
> conditionals that also allow Moscva before all others. The Vow of 
the 
> Bodhisattva "return" is standard in both lay and left home in 
> Mahayana. Hinayana has view of each person is on the gradual path 
and 
> they don't have the Bodhisattva Tradition as the sudden school of 
> Mahayana. In the Theosophical teaching the "return" is ingrained 
for 
> us and is described as the "Selfless Service to Mankind" that 
> dictates our choice option as the ideal in the samsaric journey. 
The 
> Mahayana is called Sudden School and the Greater Vehicle and the 
> Hinayana is called the Gradual School and the lesser Vehicle.
> > 
> > I think people are forced to become apologists in many cases due 
to 
> existential investment even when the reality is markedly removed 
from 
> their cherished agreements. 
> > 
> > It seems everyone is in some form of denial in regards to the 
Tashi 
> lama. My earlier point is made.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > John
> > 
> > ------------ -- Original message ------------ -- 
> > From: "Richard Semock" <semockr@hotmail. com> 
> > The number of times that this job has been finished in all the 
> rounds 
> > and races is countless times, check it out in the akashic records 
> if 
> > you dont believe me. The Dalai Lama knows this and sees the 
cosmic 
> > joke in it.
> > 
> > The thought that in order for anyone to be freed from the wheel 
> > everyone must be freed from it according to the mahayana school. 
> The 
> > hinayana school on the other hand believes that we can free 
> ourselves 
> > from the rounds and if we return as a bodhisattva to save others 
it 
> > is by our own choice.
> > 
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com, Drpsionic@ . wrote:
> > >
> > > The Chinese would love nothing more than that surprise. It will 
> > allow them 
> > > to finish the job.
> > > 
> > > For all it's geographic area, Tibet is a land of no strategic 
or 
> > economic 
> > > interest to any Western power. India may feel differently but 
how 
> > differently 
> > > is a question.
> > > 
> > > Chuck the Heretic
> > > 
> > > 
> > > In a message dated 11/28/2008 10:55:35 P.M. Central Standard 
> Time, 
> > > prmoliveira@ ... writes:
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In _theos-talk@ yahoogrotheos- t_ (mailto:theos-
> > talk@yahoogroups. com) , 
> > > Erica Letzerich <eletzerich@ ele> 
> > > wrote:
> > > 
> > > > Dear friends,
> > > > 
> > > > Its very sad the position Dalai Lama was placed by China and 
> the 
> > > horrible lies and accusations perpetuated by the chinese 
against 
> > the 
> > > Dalai Lama. China also keeps on with their claims about the 
> Indian 
> > > territory Arunachal Pradesh. The Chinese are pressing the 
Indian 
> > > government to not recognize any valid government of Tibet in 
> Exile. 
> > > As the situation gets worst, China reinforces the tension with 
> the 
> > > claim that states of Arunachal Pradesh used to belong to Tibet 
> and 
> > as 
> > > so belong to China.
> > > > 
> > > > We know the Chinese government has a strong campaign against 
> > > anything related to Tibetan Buddhism and to Dalai Lama. 
Chineses 
> > > working for the Chinese government are to be found everywhere 
in 
> > the 
> > > internet, and are the very first to make such kind of attacks. 
> > China 
> > > is becoming more agressive with its politics and if other 
nations 
> > do 
> > > not raise their voice against it, things promisses to get 
worst. 
> > > Unfortunatly on 15 of November the British Chief Minister 
> > recognized 
> > > the Chinese sovereignty over Tibet. 
> > > > 
> > > > Recently the Dalai Lama made the following statements:
> > > > 
> > > > "My trust in the Chinese
> > > > government has become thinner, thinner, thinner," 
> > > > "Suppression
> > > > is increasing and I cannot pretend that everything is OK."
> > > > "I
> > > > have to accept failure. Meantime among Tibetans in recent 
> years, 
> > our
> > > > approach failed to bring positive change inside Tibet, so 
> > criticism 
> > > has
> > > > also increased."
> > > > 
> > > > Recently I've joined a group in google, dedicated to 
> > the "Buddha" 
> > > boy, more out
> > > > of curiosity to follow what is happening and what will be the 
> > final
> > > > result of it. Their web-site was hacked yesterday, and a 
person 
> > made
> > > > the following post: "Thank you to have allowed me to take 
your 
> > land 
> > > and
> > > > rape your women." I've also read uncountable articles in 
> > different 
> > > blogs of anonymous persons defending China and making horrible 
> > > accusations against the Dalai Lama and Tibet. The Chinese 
> > aggressive 
> > > approach is not only centered on Tibet but underground they 
also 
> > > work against Tibetan Buddhism. I am afraid that pretty soon the 
> > > Chinese claims over Indian Territories will also increase. 
> > > > 
> > > > Some leaders must assume a very strong position against China 
> > > claims and policies. Otherwise we shall soon witness much worst 
> > > things happening.
> > > 
> > > Dear Erica,
> > > 
> > > The genocide of Tibetan people perpetrated by Communist China 
for 
> > > more than 50 years is a very clear evidence that for the 
Western 
> > > liberal democracies, led by the EU and the US, "human rights" 
is 
> a 
> > > nothing but a useful political slogan which serves to deflect 
> > > attention from the fundamental fact that the 1.3 billion strong 
> > > Chinese market is inded the central interest of the "freedom-
> > loving" 
> > > nations. 
> > > 
> > > Call me a skeptic if you want, but I am convinced that not even 
> > > Barack Obama would have the guts (or the interest) to take on 
> > China 
> > > on the issue of Tibet. 
> > > 
> > > Western liberal democracies continue to have blood on their 
> hands. 
> > > Every time they renew their "Most favoured nation status" with 
> > China 
> > > they do so on the background of torture, killing and raping of 
> > many 
> > > Tibetan Buddhist nuns, as well as of monks and activists. They 
> > have 
> > > condoned and continue to condone one of the most brutal 
political 
> > > regimes in modern history. And they know it.
> > > 
> > > When the Dalai Lama officially announced that he had given up 
on 
> > > negotiating with China he was just being honest. You can't 
> > negotiate 
> > > with people that do not take you seriously.
> > > 
> > > The Chinese government may soon have a surprise in their hands 
> > when 
> > > the more radical wings of the Tibetan movement call for full 
> > > independence from China, instead of autonomy, and takes the 
> > struggle 
> > > to a new political level, in which nothing is excluded.
> > > 
> > > So far for Tibet and the Tibetans Kali Yuga has won. So far.
> > > 
> > > Pedro 
> > > 
> 
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