Theos-Talk Archives (February 2008 Message tt00153)

It is a free world and each can come to theri own conclusion and stay with
it.

I am not a scholar; just an ordinary student. No organization can lead
anyone for self development. All they can do is do the mechanical stuff. The
real work, I think, the individual has to do it himself/herself.

mkr

On 2/16/08, Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@stofanet.dk> wrote:
>
> I feel absolutely free to disagree with you. "Organisations" as a word
> covers a lot of content in its definition. Saying that the great white lodge
> cannot help and benefit humanity, and that only J. Krishnamurti can and will
> is just about the most wrong conclusion one can get into ones head!
>
> Do you really think, that Master Morya, H. P. Blavatsky, Damodar
> Mavalankar are no more?
> Really. How far are you prepared to go to put the Old Lady and Master
> Morya down the toilet?
>
> But, of course I must be misunderstanding you, because you sound like an
> intelligent scholar.
>
> M. Sufilight
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: MKR
> To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com <theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2008 4:33 PM
> Subject: Re: Fw: Theos-World Distortions and diversions?
>
> Thanks.
> I have said this many times.
> One of the lessons that one learns from K's disbandment of organizations
> is
> the need to set ourselves free to inquire as organizations cannot take us
> to
> enlightenment.
>
> mkr
>
> On 2/16/08, Shel Steijl <shelley@sai.co.za <shelley%40sai.co.za>> wrote:
> >
> > Well said, MKR.
> > Shel
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: MKR
> > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com <theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com><theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2008 3:15 PM
> > Subject: Re: Theos-World Distortions and diversions?
> >
> > Any open minded person need to keep certain facts in mind.
> >
> > Organizations are great when it comes to mechanical tasks such as
> > publishing
> > and re-publishing and arranging for meetings and gatherings etc. Once it
> > goes beyond that, they cannot lead one to self-discovery (which you have
> > to
> > do it yourself unfettered
> > by any preconceived ideas or notions). Once there is an organization,
> > there is the bureaucracy and the need for group conformity. Once you
> > are in the group for a long time, it is very difficult to think
> > outside the box. The other complicating fact is that many
> > organizations own a lot of very valuable real estate
> > with the ownership comes other headaches and problems that may interfere
> > with the distribution of teachings. Spirituality and property and money
> do
> > not mix well.
> >
> > It should be recalled that during the early days of TS, there was very
> > little money. Even the Adyar estate was purchased by borrowing money
> with
> > the support of some active theosophists. The lack of money helped the
> > founders to concentrate on spreading theosophy than having to worry
> about
> > managing money.
> >
> > Looking at some of the past litigation that organizations have got
> > themselves into, you will find that property and money are at their root
> > and
> > in all these litigations, it was the attorneys who came out winners.
> >
> > Organizations have their place and let us not over emphasize their role
> in
> > personal development and progress and spirituality.
> >
> > mkr
> >
> > On 2/16/08, nhcareyta <nhcareyta@yahoo.com.au <nhcareyta%40yahoo.com.au><nhcareyta%40yahoo.com.au>>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear mkr
> > >
> > > Thank you for your comment.
> > >
> > > You write, "If Pablo takes time to read all the
> > > past archives of various theos lists, he may
> > > come out with a different opinion."
> > >
> > > I really hope that he might indeed read the past
> > > archives and other available literature with a
> > > truly open mind. However I suspect this might
> > > be difficult for him.
> > >
> > > As an ex-Adyar Society apologist I can attest
> > > to the difficulties faced by one thoroughly
> > > absorbed in the organisation and its powerful
> > > mindset.
> > >
> > > I was exposed to some of the issues of Bishop
> > > Leadbeater and Dr Besant whilst President of
> > > the local Lodge but dismissed it as muckraking.
> > > It was only whilst living at the Adyar Society
> > > headquarters in India for a few months that I
> > > was able to conduct more thorough research. The
> > > enormity of their betrayal of "original"
> > > Theosophy and the extraordinary and all-important
> > > deleterious far-reaching effects of their mindset
> > > upon unsuspecting and uninformed members became
> > > increasingly apparent, to the extent I could no
> > > longer support the organisation. This despite
> > > recognising some value in its continuance and
> > > the many selfless and hard working people among
> > > its membership.
> > >
> > > This mindset and the pervasive manner in which
> > > it works can destroy free thinking which so
> > > often leads to blind and stubborn resistance
> > > to truth.
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Nigel
> > >
> > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com <theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com><theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com><theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com>, MKR
> > > <mkr777@...> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > If Pablo takes time to read all the past archives of various theos
> > > lists, he
> > > > may come out with a different opinion. Archives have a lot of
> > > material you
> > > > will not find anywhere else. This is due to the fact that the lists
> > > are
> > > > outside the control of any organization and is totally unmoderated.
> > > This is
> > > > something that many organizations used to control flow of info to
> > > its
> > > > adherents and is finding it very hard to come to grip
> > > > with. Anyone will also notice that rarely one finds well known
> > > leaders
> > > > in the hierarchy of organizations participate in any of them, even
> > > > though they may lurk to see what is going on.
> > > > A paradox in the internet age.
> > > >
> > > > mkr
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 2/15/08, nhcareyta <nhcareyta@...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Dear Pablo
> > > > >
> > > > > Recently you wrote, "In this circle it is fashionable
> > > > > to criticize Besant and Leadbeater for whatever
> > > > > they did, and most of the times the statements
> > > > > are unsupported."
> > > > >
> > > > > On two occasions I have asked, "Would you kindly
> > > > > define your term "unsupported. And apart from
> > > > > the current claim by Cass, would you also be
> > > > > so kind as to show where "unsupported statements"
> > > > > have been made."
> > > > >
> > > > > Unless you are in process, it appears you are
> > > > > disinclined to reply to my questions.
> > > > > Given that you have subsequently responded to
> > > > > other contributors to this discussion, I will
> > > > > assume certain things.
> > > > >
> > > > > Your word "unsupported" may mean
> > > > > not substantiated, meaning groundless and
> > > > > baseless.
> > > > > If this is correct then you have failed to
> > > > > demonstrate this with any examples.
> > > > >
> > > > > It must therefore be assumed that you have
> > > > > little or no evidence to support your claim.
> > > > >
> > > > > In light of the above, I ask you to reconsider
> > > > > your apparently derogatory words to Cass to
> > > > > determine whether they might actually refer to
> > > > > yourself, "It's interesting to see how our mind
> > > > > plays games. "Consistency" is not its main
> > > > > feature..."
> > > > >
> > > > > I still look forward to examples where unsubstantiated
> > > > > statements have been made about Bishop Leadbeater
> > > > > and Dr Besant in this forum that we may discuss them
> > > > > objectively and without bias.
> > > > >
> > > > > Regards
> > > > > Nigel
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------
> >
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> 
>


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