Theos-Talk Archives (December 2006 Message tt00168)

Hi JB,
And I believe that Krishnamurti came at the appropriate time.  He focused (for me) on the personal ego and gave insights into how the ego deludes itself.  Until we come to understand and accept the personal ego not as master but as slave we will always be victims of our past actions (karma)  However, the journey is long and arduous with much soul searching in how we  came to be what we are.  Gurdgieff also helped in the aspect by teaching us to wake up, and catch the process of thought or as K's calls it, the thinker.  However, for some, Krishnamurti's advaita? system can be mentally challenging, which can lead to mental imbalance for westerners.

Cass

new7892001 <JB789@hotmail.com> wrote:                                  Hi Carlos,
 
 It seems to me you mis-understand quite a bit, and are caught in the 
 limited conceptual reasoning... (i.e. Words), which distorts your 
 seeing.
 Below some comments:
 
 --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "carlosaveline" 
 <carlosaveline@...> wrote:
 >
 > Dear JB,
 > 
 > Thanks. 
 > 
 > Well, there are a few facts:
 > 
 > * that Krishnamurti talked against "personal selves and names"; 
 
 Jb: Incorrect. K. never talked 'Against'...
 he pointed out, for the listener to see and have an insight into.
 
 > 
 > * that "Krishnamurti Foundations" use his personal name;
 
 Jb: Carlos... _what would you like_ to call the place where books, 
 videos can be obtained, and dilaogs happen?
 Should it be called Theosophic Society, or Meditation Society, or...?
 That would not say much, since K's teaching is unique, and if one 
 wants to locate it in space and time, an appropriate 
 label/indication is necessary.
 
 But you say... 'Look at this man's big Ego!... he has his name on 
 the door... he is dishonest and crooked!"
 Right?
 
 Opinion, dsitortion, conclusion, trap.
 Only you can jump out of it...
 but I doubt you want... for
 it is rather _satisfying_ for the
 sense of the self-center.
 Kindly Look...
 right?
 
 > 
 > * that "his" Foundations work solely with his own personal 
 writings; 
 
 Jb: Thank God for that!; otherwise one would get a soup/cocktail of 
 the 1001 saviours and gurus... 
 but if you prefer that, I am not arguing with it - I have mixed 
 myself all kinds of models and 'experts' and dogmatic religions, 
 many years ago... till I found the foolishness of it - 
 ... but do go ahead and enjoy it...
 who is going to stop you?
 
 > 
 > * and more; 
 > 
 > * that Krishnamurti never works with the two basic and central 
 concepts of Karma and Reincarnation; 
 
 Jb: 
 Sorry, but here I have to slightly, smile...
 ..."concepts"... "karma".... ?!
 
 I can see that you are not acquainted with what Direct Insight is... 
 nor with what Krishnamuri had to say on these.
 You seem to follow the path of a Believer... - copying and repeating 
 others' 'concepts' - 
 and Not that of a free inquirerer and Discoverer, _first hand_.
 
 > 
 > * that he ignores the concepts of Adept and Discipleship, 
 Theosophy, Universal Wisdom, higher self (triad),  and Antahkarana.
 
 Jb: If I may share with you my honest view 
 on what your message shows, is this:
 You are trapped
 in the matrix of
 exotically
 conceptual games
 and dogmatic 'truths', 
 sinking your vision
 into a swamp of
 self-deceptive quick-sand.
 
 My friendly advice: start to SEE
 things _as they are_...
 which means, throw away everything
 you have learned from tradition
 and the 'experts'.
 
 > 
 > 
 > Aren't these some FACTS?   
 
 Jb: I have already replied to that.
 
 ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
 
 And there are more of them. 
 > 
 > 
 > Carlos. 
 > 
 > De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
 > 
 > Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
 > 
 > Cópia:
 > 
 > Data:Wed, 29 Nov 2006 20:08:20 -0000
 > 
 > Assunto:Theos-World Re: Krishnamurti Foundations
 > 
 > > Hi,
 > > Unfortunatelly, time is limitted - have no internet at home - so 
 it 
 > > will be short.
 > > As far as I can hear, your arguments are based on personal 
 > > values/beliefs/conclusions, and so in essence grounded in 
 > > ideational, analytical self-deception.
 > > I would inquire with you, into the significance of "comparative" 
 > > activities, your misunderstanding concernign the function of the 
 > > Foundations, what the 'I' is, _your_ impression of it as a cult, 
 etc.
 > > 
 > > But i leave that with you, to inquire into, if interested.
 > > Regards,
 > > Jb
 > > 
 > > 
 > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "carlosaveline" 
 > > wrote:
 > > >
 > > > 
 > > > Friends,
 > > > 
 > > > It is ironical, perhaps, to see that Jiddu Krishnamurti, who 
 > > talked so much against the "I", and who often said "the speaker 
 is 
 > > not important" in his talks, ended up having his personal name 
 used 
 > > in the "Krishnamurti Foundations".
 > > > 
 > > > His sole proposition, or that of his followers, seems to be 
 > > himself.
 > > > 
 > > > Years ago I went to the Krishnamurti Foundation in California. 
 > > There is nothing but material with Krishnamurti, there. Only his 
 > > books, tapes and videos. No comparative study, no other author, 
 no 
 > > books except his own, nothing. Only his personality, which was 
 said 
 > > to be not important. There is an air of personalistic cult 
 around 
 > > him. Since the times he used to be Christ. 
 > > > 
 > > > Carlos. 
 > > > 
 > > > 
 > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
 > > >
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > Yahoo! Groups Links
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > E-mail classificado pelo Identificador de Spam Inteligente Terra.
 > > Para alterar a categoria classificada, visite
 > > http://mail.terra.com.br/protected_email/imail/imail.cgi?
 +_u=carlosaveline&_l=1,1164831512.325733.20618.mangoro.hst.terra.com.
 br,4785,Des15,Des15
 > > 
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 > 
 > 
 > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
 >
 
 
     
                       

 
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