Theos-Talk Archives (November 2006 Message tt00440)

Daniel,


Look at your postings here in 2006, or in the last month if you will, and you will see that you have specialized yourself in attacking the ULT. 

Which is probably flattering for the ULT students.


Carlos. 



De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com

Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com

Cópia:

Data:Tue, 07 Nov 2006 15:13:05 -0000

Assunto:Theos-World Carlos on my criticisms and remarks about ULT

> Carlos,
> 
> Let me make several points to clarify what you are writing below.
> 
> Down thru the years I have been interested in researching various
> branches of the Theosophical movement. A few years ago on Theos-Talk 
> I posted a considerable amount of material on Leadbeater, Besant, Neo-
> Theosophy, the Adyar Society, etc. etc.
> 
> My interest in ULT and Crosibie is no different than the my interest 
> in the Adyar TS or the Point Loma TS.
> 
> Now my attention over the years on ULT, DES and Crosbie has been 
> deepened because of the number of ULT students that have responded to 
> some of my research, postings, etc. on ULT, DES and Crosbie.
> 
> For example many years ago on Theos-Talk, I posted detailed info that 
> showed that the Theosophy Company's edition of THE VOICE OF THE 
> SILENCE had been EDITED and was not a "verbatim" edition of HPB's 
> original. I pointed out at the time that a truly "verbatim" edition 
> of HPB's original is the one published by Theosophical University 
> Press.
> 
> I would have thought that ULT students would have welcomed such 
> information. Instead most of the students responded with comments 
> either denying what was so obvious or by all sorts of quibbling, etc. 
> etc.
> 
> So these kinds of responses simply perked my interest even more in 
> what might be call the "ULT mindset". 
> 
> Why such a concerted effort by some ULT students to deny what was as 
> obvious as could be --- that is, that the ULT edition of the VOICE is 
> not a facsimile edition of HPB's original and that some unknown 
> editor has silently changed and "corrected" HPB's text?
> 
> I could give dozens of more examples, but the insight I gained from 
> all of this is that in many, many ways, I concluded that many ULT 
> students have a certain "mindset" which is very similar in many ways 
> with the "mindset" of many Adyar TS students.
> 
> That is, an unwillingness to admit the obvious when the facts are 
> presented. I still remain somewhat puzzled even after many years at 
> some Leadbeater students who apparently just can't see all the 
> contradictions between Blavatsky and Leadbeater and who deny some of 
> the most obvious facts about Leadbeater, etc.
> 
> Both groups of students seems to have what some might call a "cult" 
> mentality. A GROUP THINK mindset. 
> 
> Am I saying that the Adyar TS doesn't do some good work? Am I saying 
> that the ULT doesn't do good work? Am I saying that ULT or Adyar 
> members are not good people, sincere, etc. No, never said that at 
> all. I have even from time to time pointed out all the good things 
> that the ULT has accomplished. But I am not going to ignore other 
> things which seem less than commendable. For example, when Adyar or 
> ULT writers distort the historical record, etc.
> 
> In all my comments about ULT, I am not saying that its influence is 
> better or "bigger" than Adyar. I've made no comments whatsoever on 
> this.
> 
> And when you mention that I criticize ULT or certain aspects of it or 
> some of the history written about Crosbie, etc., well, is that bad or 
> wrong?
> 
> What criticisms have I made that are not accurate, true? Please if I 
> have stated anything about ULT, Crosbie, etc. that you believe is not 
> accurate, please state what I have written and then give corrections.
> 
> I could say more but I think what I say above gives a little context 
> in order to understand what you are writing BELOW.
> 
> Daniel
> http://hpb.cc
> 
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Carlos wrote:
> >
> > Daniel,
> > 
> > Thanks. 
> > 
> > If one would judge it by the amount of "attention" you give to the 
> ULT, one would think the ULT is much bigger than the Adyar TS, or the 
> Pasadena TS!
> > 
> > I must say that in my view this is an unconscious homage of yours, 
> payed to that small network of students, present in some 12 
> countries perhaps, called ULT and founded in 1909 by Robert Crosbie 
> and a few others. 
> > 
> > It means, I guess, that you consider the ULT absolutely central to 
> the movement nowadays, since, in discussing the movement, you can't 
> refrain from criticizing it all the time! And now without using 
> false names as you did before! (Congratulations for that, my 
> brother.) 
> > 
> > Yet I do know the ULT is but an effort to help the movement as a 
> whole, with priority for its core, its essence, and to help people 
> knolwn themselves better. 
> > 
> > And I can see other efforts are very important too, different as 
> they are. 
> > 
> > Regards, Carlos. 
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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