Theos-Talk Archives (May 2006 Message tt00116)

Jerry-

I suggest that there is very little differentiation between a seer's 
conscious expectations and a person's subconscious dream 
projections.  It is the same part of the brain which creates both of 
them, thus marring the experience.  Suffice it to say that we 
commonly project illusions onto our daily waking reality, which also 
mars our waking perceptions.  It's the same part of the brain.  It is 
only when the dream material and/or the expectations cease 
altogether, that the seer is seeing clearly, in the absence of 
projected imageries.

Blessings

Vince

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Jerry Hejka-Ekins <jjhe@...> wrote:
>
> Dear Vince,
> 
> An interesting theory you have concerning the brain projecting 
dream 
> material into an untrained seer's vision.  I'm not sure I 
understand how 
> (or if) you are distinguishing between expectations the seer may 
have as 
> the result of training, and the brain's function of interjecting 
images 
> when it cannot accept what it is seeing.  For instance, in normal 
waking 
> life, one may witness an event and still perceive an unexpected 
> outcome.  On the other hand, if one is forewarned to expect a 
certain 
> outcome, and that forewarning is not questioned, one's perceptions 
may 
> be altered to conform to that forewarning. 
> 
> Best
> Jerry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vincent wrote:
> 
> >Jerry-
> >
> >I'm not one to claim that I speak with ascended masters, but I 
have 
> >encountered a myriad of ghost entities (many hundreds at least) 
> >during my travels upon the astral planes.  Suffice it to say that 
> >most supernatural experiences (99%) that people have are distorted 
by 
> >dream material which is projected onto them.  When the physical 
brain 
> >is not acclimated to the supernatural realm, it remains 
> >materialistically focused, and therefore dreams.  However, when 
the 
> >brain's materialistic dependencies cease for a time, then the 
dream 
> >imageries also cease, and a person is capable of percieving 
directly 
> >into the supernatural realm without skew.
> >
> >Hallucinations and dreams are triggered by the brain's failure to 
> >reconcile higher supernatural experience with the lesser material 
> >reality.  In other words, if the brain cannot accept a 
supernatural 
> >experience, it will most definitely project hallucinogenic/dream 
> >images onto it.  For example, an unknown ghost entity may 
literally 
> >appear to a person from the supernatural realm, but if the brain 
> >cannot accept the supernatural experience, the brain will 
invariably 
> >colorize the event with imageries of Michael the Archangel or 
Jesus 
> >Christ.  Whatever is familiar to the individual.
> >
> >Blessings
> >
> >Vince
> >
> >--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Jerry Hejka-Ekins <jjhe@> wrote:
> >  
> >
> >>Dear Friends,
> >>
> >>I posted this message about twenty days ago and, for some reason, 
> >>    
> >>
> >it 
> >  
> >
> >>failed to go to distribution.  So, for Cass (you asked in the 
first 
> >>place) and others who might be interested in the subject, I am 
> >>re-writing and reposting it as a new discussion string. 
> >>
> >>
> >>Dear Cass, Friends,
> >>
> >>Cass, I'm not sure that visions for their own sake are all that 
> >>interesting for a third party who does not actually experience 
> >>    
> >>
> >them. In 
> >  
> >
> >>my case, I don't see beings on Mars or talk to ascended Masters.  
I 
> >>    
> >>
> >do 
> >  
> >
> >>think that people experience a variety of different kinds of 
visual 
> >>    
> >>
> >and 
> >  
> >
> >>mental phenomena that originate from a variety of states of 
> >>consciousness that all people can potentially achieve.  What the 
> >>    
> >>
> >people 
> >  
> >
> >>actually relate in their experiences has, I think, more to do 
with 
> >>    
> >>
> >the 
> >  
> >
> >>"reality" they attribute to it.  For instance, I recently had 
> >>entertained a visitor who trained for many years with a Brazilian 
> >>spiritist from the Kardec school.  For a couple of hours she 
> >>    
> >>
> >related to 
> >  
> >
> >>me various visions she had.  She told me in total seriousness of 
> >>    
> >>
> >her 
> >  
> >
> >>meetings and conversations with the Archangel Michael and other 
> >>    
> >>
> >such 
> >  
> >
> >>celestial celebrities.  While she was telling me these things, I 
> >>    
> >>
> >thought 
> >  
> >
> >>to myself: "now if she were from India and had the same 
> >>    
> >>
> >experiences, she 
> >  
> >
> >>would probably be telling me of her meetings with Krishna etc. 
> >>
> >>So, I think the visions themselves are less important than the 
> >>    
> >>
> >insights 
> >  
> >
> >>they point to for the person who has the experience.  That is 
> >>    
> >>
> >because 
> >  
> >
> >>the insights seem always to be around some personal context. That 
> >>    
> >>
> >is, we 
> >  
> >
> >>experience certain things precisely because of there meaning to 
us, 
> >>    
> >>
> >or 
> >  
> >
> >>because of our need to see them.   For instance, I have had 
several 
> >>people tell me of a time when they were in deep despair and 
> >>    
> >>
> >a "Master" 
> >  
> >
> >>appeared in their room.  Was the appearance physical; an astral 
> >>projection; a waking dream?  That would be hard to determine.  
> >>    
> >>
> >Perhaps 
> >  
> >
> >>the importance of the vision is the meaning it conveys, or the 
> >>reassurance it gives to the person at the time. 
> >>
> >>Another kind of vision is what I would call a waking lucent 
dream.  
> >>    
> >>
> >That 
> >  
> >
> >>is, the person is completely awake and aware of the actual 
> >>    
> >>
> >surroundings, 
> >  
> >
> >>yet is experiencing a vision of a place somewhere else with all 
of 
> >>    
> >>
> >the 
> >  
> >
> >>sounds, smells, sensations etc. associated with it. These kinds 
of 
> >>experiences sometimes occur in meditation.
> >>
> >>Others fall into the clairvoyance category.  There is a story 
that 
> >>Swedenborg, while visiting in a distant town, clairvoyantly saw 
his 
> >>    
> >>
> >own 
> >  
> >
> >>town on fire.  He described to the other guests the progress of 
the 
> >>    
> >>
> >fire 
> >  
> >
> >>and which buildings burned.  The accuracy of his vision was 
> >>    
> >>
> >confirmed in 
> >  
> >
> >>a newspaper story that appeared a couple of days later. 
> >>
> >>Other phenomena I have seen includes telepathy.  About 35 years 
ago 
> >>    
> >>
> >I 
> >  
> >
> >>used to  work in an open setting Community Mental Health Center 
in 
> >>    
> >>
> >Los 
> >  
> >
> >>Angeles.  There, I ran into several patients who were remarkable 
> >>telepaths, and would give voice to things that I was thinking.  
> >>    
> >>
> >There 
> >  
> >
> >>were others who heard voices.  They believed that God, or angels, 
> >>    
> >>
> >or 
> >  
> >
> >>departed spirits were speaking to them. 
> >>
> >>Another phenomena I have witnessed is the presence of entities of 
> >>    
> >>
> >some 
> >  
> >
> >>kind amidst extremely pathological situations.  Some people seem 
to 
> >>    
> >>
> >be 
> >  
> >
> >>particularly good a drawing such entities and are surrounded by 
> >>    
> >>
> >them 
> >  
> >
> >>most all of the time. 
> >>
> >>There are other things too, but this might be enough to start off 
a 
> >>discussion. What other kinds of phenomena have you witnessed? In 
> >>    
> >>
> >these 
> >  
> >
> >>phenomena, what might be the difference between spiritual and 
> >>    
> >>
> >psychic 
> >  
> >
> >>visions, hallucinations and imagination.  How are these elements 
> >>different, and how do they interact? 
> >>
> >>I hope this helps.
> >>Best
> >>Jerry
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> >
>