Theos-Talk Archives (May 2006 Message tt00113)

Frank,

You write:

"ULT publishes falsehoods about Purucker and Tingley.
Not the person who quotes these ULT texts is guilty, but the persons 
who wrote and spread these falsehoods." 

I'm wondering if you could specify for readers on Theos-Talk
what you are referring to when you write about the ULT 
publishing "falsehoods about Purucker and Tingley"?

A few examples would help readers to understand your point.
I for one would like to know what you consider "falsehoods".

Also what "ULT" texts are you referring to?

I see that Carlos is recommending a ULT text when he writes:

"Other books are also useful.'The Theosophical Movement', published 
by ULT associates, is unfortunately unavaible as long as I know."

Frank, do you believe that these above mentioned falsehoods are in 
this book mentioned by Carlos?

Moving on.

I'm sure a number of readers have noticed that Carlos is almost 
constantly referring to "slanders," "lies" and  "falsehoods."

Notice just one of Carlos' recent postings where he writes:

"I invite Daniel to stop circulating the old
slandes which he knows all too well to be pure
lies."

"I hope I clarified my point.  I feel the same with
regard to Paul Johnson, Katinka Hesselink, John
Algeo and others who propagate falsehoods."

Now the question that comes to my mind is:

Frank, I wonder if you use the term "falsehoods" the way Carlos uses 
the term.

For example, do you consider the following testimony given by Robert 
Crosbie about Mrs. Katherine Tingley to be in the category of 
slanders, lies and/or falsehoods?

Here is Mr. Crosbie's testimony:

"...I went to Point Loma at Mrs. Tingley's urgent request to assist 
in the proposed work, and was there for two years, helping to 
prepare the way for the expected developments. . . . I am slow to 
turn back from any task I have set myself, and am prone to excuse 
inconsistencies and deviation in others, so that although I had 
begun to doubt, and to see, it was more than a year afterwards 
before I saw so clearly and unmistakably that I took occasion to 
tell Mrs. T. the facts as I saw them, and to state my intention to 
withdraw from all connection with her. She tried of course in every 
way to change my determination, but finding me unchangeable, she let 
me go, and as I afterwards heard, gave out that she had sent me away 
for "bad conduct" - just what I do not know.  This of course, 
to "save her own face" as the Chinese say. I am quite will aware of 
her capacities in the above direction form the history of others who 
had discovered her real character, and left; there is no slander too 
low or mean for her to use in such cases to justify herself. Sorry 
as I am to say it, such is the character of Katherine Tingley, the 
Leader of the Theosophical Movement Throughout the World, as she 
styles herself - (there is more of it that is simply too nauseating 
to write.) It was a hard schooling for me, but it had its good uses 
and effects. I feel no enmity towards her; I truly pity her and 
would help her do right any time it might be in my power. I also 
feel most deeply towards those who are held in mental bondage by 
her; but nothing can be done - they must open their own eyes, they 
mare not in a condition to have them opened by anyone else...."

"She will also speak in Belasco Theater on Sunday eve on "Some 
Practical Lessons in Human Life", and will doubtless present a fair 
picture to the mind's eye; and yet she is as I have said. Those who 
see these pictures would not believe anything different from what 
they see - and she knows it, and preys upon the best and noblest in 
human nature for her own ends. I tremble for the Karma she 
invokes. . . . " 

Pretty strong words!  Are Crosbie's words slanderous?  

And notice that Crosbie even accuses Mrs. Tingley  of 
being "slanderous":

"...there is no slander too low or mean for her to use…."

I also wonder what Carlos' reaction would be if Mr. Crosbie had used 
those identical words (quoted above) to describe Madame Blavatsky?

If this was a description of HPB, would Carlos call it:  slanders, 
lies, falsehoods?

In fact there are descriptions of HPB by certain individuals which 
sound similar in description and tone to what Mr. Crosbie says about 
Mrs. Tingley.

Now notice that Carlos accuses Katinka Hesselink of "propagating 
falsehoods." [See his text above.] 

He does not specify in this posting of his exactly what he is 
referring to in regards to Katinka.  

But it should be noted that the complete transcript of Mr. Crosbie's 
testimony about Mrs. Tingley is published on Katinka's website at:

http://www.katinkahesselink.net/his/dtb_7.htm#bionotes

So is Katinka guilty of circulating slanders, lies and falsehoods 
about Mrs. Tingley?

What is your "take" on this Frank?  

And it will be interesting to see if Carlos gives us his forthright 
opinion about this....

Food for thought.

Daniel