Theos-Talk Archives (March 2006 Message tt00682)

Now I understand the protest against TMR.  Thank you, Bruce.  The 
letter is anticlimaxtic after the spitting and shouting done over 
it.  

Verifying a letter of that nature should be the first step before 
using it, as well as comparing it to other correspondence of the 
same period.  Similar situations with other people also might be 
compared with it.  Uri Geller is a contemporary example.

The letter doesn't change my opinion about HPB in any way.  The 
Mahatmas asked people to assist their nation on more than one 
occasion.  That kind of blew my mind at first, but it makes sense 
that nations are a primary means of social organization.  I believe 
that national karma is easily visible, and HPB predicted the karmic 
situation that would lead to World War I that, in turn, gave rise to 
World War II then the Cold War.  HPB lived in the 19th century, an 
era that was very different in many ways than the 21st century.  

We can't erase the lines of HPB's life to make it exemplary in 
contemporary terms a hundred years after the fact.  The facts of her 
life will be given a different perspective in the 22nd century, as 
people in that era look back on the 19th century.

I think Jerry had the right idea, that the way to deal with 
objections to TMR is to produce a work that deals with the 
questionable issues with more research.   

HPB's life was one of dynamic change, and the 1872 letter adds to my 
interest in her.  I'd like to see a well reasoned response to TMR, 
instead of a kick fight.  Like it or not, people believe what they 
are capable of understanding and, in most cases, what they want to 
believe.  

Krsanna



--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Bruce MacDonald" 
<robert.b.macdonald@...> wrote:
>
> Some people have been looking for a sense of what the TMR is all 
about and 
> why it may be objectionable.  To give people an idea, the book is 
divided 
> into three parts, Part 1: Adepts, Part 2: Mahatmas, and Part 3: 
Secret 
> Messages.  Part 1 deals with HPB's early years and the various 
people that 
> she might somehow be connected to and how these might be 
inspirations for 
> her later work.  Part 2 deals with individuals that might be the 
prototypes 
> of the various Mahatmas that HPB wrote about.  Part 3 deals with 
all sorts 
> of ugliness and could best be described as the political glue that 
holds the 
> rest of the book together.
> 
> In Parts 1 and 2, the book utilizes quotes from the Coulombs, the 
brothers 
> Hare ("Who Wrote the Mahatma Letters" - read about them 
in "Defence of 
> Madame Blavatsky" by Beatrice Hastings, 
> http://www.theosophycanada.com/ct_file/DefenceHPB.pdf), the 
Coulombs sourced 
> from "The Occult World of Madame Blavatsky" (demonstrates why this 
volume 
> can be dangerous), Olcott's "Old Diary Leaves", and Blavatsky's 
fictional 
> "Caves and Jungles".  These, in addition to letters, etc. are used 
to drive 
> the arguments and connections in the book.  Clearly some of these 
sources 
> are dubious at best, other sources are those of outright liars.  
Although 
> the contents of the sources themselves are not usually 
controversial, their 
> origin makes them questionable all the same.
> 
> The problem with trying to get into somebody's head by looking at 
the people 
> that they may have crossed paths with is that you never know what 
type of 
> lessons your subject is deriving from these encounters.  What TMR 
focuses on 
> in its many short biographies is the political motivations and 
relationships 
> of these people in addition to whatever occult sources of 
knowledge they may 
> have access to.  You come away from the first two chapters with a 
strange 
> mix of politics and the occult.  The problem with these two 
endeavors, as 
> any occultist will tell you, is that they do not mix.  Politics is 
the art 
> of influencing others to help achieve worldly ends; the occult 
serves an 
> entirely different mistress - it is the art of encouraging people 
to think 
> for themselves.  The only way the two can mix would be if HPB was 
a 
> book-learned occultist without possession of the Heart Doctrine.  
In this 
> scenario, HPB would be a great intellect who provided the world 
with a 
> remarkable body of literature.  She might properly be called one 
of the true 
> greats.  Great what? Great scholars.  HPB has been transformed 
from an 
> occultist into a scholar.  Perhaps this is high praise coming from 
the pen 
> of a scholar.
> 
> To lend credence to this picture, TMR begins Part 3 as follows:
> 
> &#65279;IN 1993, SEVERAL DOCUMENTARY discoveries shed new light on 
HPB's 
> political involvements. Maria Carlson's No Religion Higher Than 
Truth, a 
> history of the Theosophical movement in Russia, reprints portions 
of a 
> letter Blavatsky wrote on 26 December 1872, while in Odessa. 
Addressed to 
> the Director of the Third Section, it volunteers her services as a 
secret 
> agent:
> 
> "During these twenty years I have become well acquainted with all 
of Western 
> Europe. I zealously followed current politics not with any goal in 
mind, but 
> because of an innate passion; in order better to follow events and 
to divine 
> them in advance, I always had the habit of entering into the 
smallest 
> details of any affair, for which reason I strove to acquaint 
myself with all 
> the leading personalities, politicians of various nations, both of 
the 
> government factions and of the far Left....
> 
> As a Spiritualist, I have a reputation in many places as a 
powerful medium. 
> Hundreds of people undoubtedly believed and will believe in 
spirits. But I, 
> writing this letter with the aim of offering my services to Your 
Excellency 
> and to my native land, am obligated to tell you the entire truth 
without 
> concealment. And thus I must confess that three-quarters of the 
time the 
> spirits spoke and answered in my words and out of my 
considerations, for the 
> success of my own plans. Rarely, very rarely, did I fail, by means 
of this 
> little trap, to discover people's hopes, plans and secrets.... I 
have played 
> every role, I am able to represent myself as any person you may 
wish." (p. 
> 216)
> 
> Were the Theosophical world to take note of this discovery in the 
Central 
> State Archives of the October Revolution in Moscow, it would be 
seen as a 
> bombshell exploding the hagiographic interpretation of the 
founder's early 
> life. But it is likely to pass unnoticed. Her description in this 
letter of 
> her activities in the 1850s and 1860s corresponds accurately to 
the portrait 
> that has emerged in the present investigation. Quite striking, 
however, is 
> her apparent willingness to violate the trust of the same men she 
was later 
> to mythologize as Masters. Nevertheless, according to Carlson, the 
Russian 
> government rejected her offer, and no evidence has been found to 
confirm 
> that she ever became a secret agent for her native country.  She 
did, 
> however, become a secret informant of the
> British government, but not until fifteen years after her offer to 
St. 
> Petersburg was rejected.
> 
> This ends the quote that begins Part 3.
> 
> The rest of Part 3 deals with suspicions by the British concerning 
HPB's 
> possible involvement as a Russian Spy, her unfortunate involvement 
in an 
> effort to stop an Indian uprising that could only have resulted in 
the death 
> of many of India's poor turned to desperation, Hume's involvement 
in the 
> whole mess, and hearsay nonsense surrounding what is called "An 
Occult 
> Imprisonment".
> 
> This gives the people who have not read the book a sense of what 
it is 
> about.  The TMR is basically a house of cards where if the 1872 
Spy letter 
> is removed, the whole thing collapses.  The Spy letter helps to 
establish a 
> state of mind for HPB just prior for her leaving to America and 
establishing 
> the Theosophical Society.  At one point the book uses the Spy 
Letter to 
> blunt or dismiss HPB's contempt for the whole field of politics.  
TMR quotes 
> from "The Letters of HPB to AP Sinnett", Letter LXXXVIII, where 
HPB laments 
> at being drawn into the political world due to the above mentioned 
plot.  
> From TMR we then read the glib comment: "This Letter suggest HPB's 
ethics 
> and sense of responsibility had evolved considerably since her 
1872 offer to 
> the Third Section."
> 
> If we are to speak of responsibility, before using the 1872 letter 
to club 
> HPB over the head with, perhaps it would have been responsible to 
make some 
> effort towards its verification.  To my knowledge there has been 
no effort 
> to verify this letter before or since.  How can you then in good 
conscience 
> write a book around it, especially when so much of the book is put 
together 
> with thinly supported accounts?  But then if one was to try and 
verify the 
> letter and fail, that would sure put the breaks on a 
sensationalistic book!  
> Perhaps it was best to leave well enough alone.
> 
> I don't think we need professors to tell us whether this book has 
merit or 
> not.  It seems that we can decide that perfectly well on our own.
> 
> Sincerely,
> Bruce
> 
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