Theos-Talk Archives (March 2006 Message tt00101)

If the Masters lost contact with the TS in 1891 then I would suggest that there work was completed and the society that formed the basis of the teachings became superfluous.

Cass

carlosaveline cardoso aveline <carlosaveline@hotmail.com> wrote: 
Dear Krishtar,

My impression of Sinnett, so far, is that he had many shortcomings, 
including pride, narrow-mindedness, etc. --  but was a man of character.  He 
sincerely believed his illusions. That is something (and no one of us is 
free from illusions but we can be sincere and try to be open-minded).

The problem of being unable to accept the fact that the Masters closed 
outward, verbal contacts with the theosophical movement in 1891 was by no 
means only Sinnett's. It got most of the theosphical groups/organizations. 
Only en 1909 Crosbie organized the ULT quite outside those illusions.

To Adyar and Pasadena, it seems it took up to mid-century to abandon fancies 
of verbal/visual contact with the Masters. In the case of Adyar, with which 
I am much more aquainted, the institutional structure and culture are up to 
now clear results of the clairvoyant fancies.

I guess the "seal of legitimacy" is not with this or that organization. This 
question is  to be solved or not inside the heart and mind of each 
truth-seeker...


Best regards,  Carlos.



>From: krishtar 
>Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: Theos-World A MAP: Sinnett,  "Mary" and CWL's Fancies
>Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2006 13:08:05 -0300
>
>++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>Caro Aveline,
>
>Thanks for the reply, very helping!
>It would be very desirable if you could enlarge this statement in order to
>clarify a bit more and set a deeper basis:? =>  "AP Sinnett described
>this process quite honestly, and he truly believed in such mediumnistitc
>pseudo-contacts." Is it based in his own bio? In this booklet he writes in 
>a
>very simple and humble way about  the need he had to have a second source 
>on
>the masters...
>So CWL jumped in his bandwagon....
>
>Regards
>Krishtar
>
>
>
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "carlosaveline cardoso aveline" 
>To: 
>Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2006 11:01 AM
>Subject: Theos-World A MAP: Sinnett, "Mary" and CWL's Fancies
>
>
>
>
>ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
>
>Sinnett,  "Mary" and CWL's Fancies
>
>THE  MAP  OF  THE  CHESS  GAME
>
>ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
>
>Dear Krishtar,
>
>
>You are absolutetly right.
>
>It all began with the medium "Mary" in Mr. Sinnett's "inner circle".
>
>Soon CW Leadbeater joined as co-medium.
>
>In 1894, Mrs. Annie Besant joined, too, and she was the "outer head" of the
>Esoteric School, Adyar.
>
>Few people were humble and realistic enough to admit that outer, verbal
>contacts with Masters had ceased when HPB went away.
>
>The period of wild fancies began to end in the 1940s and 1950s, yet the old
>power-structure,
>created by AB and CWL and having all such fancies as its origin, still goes
>on losing strength little by little.
>
>Ms. Radha's policy, for instance, is not to promote these fancies.
>
>She privately admits they are but fancies.
>
>Yet she avoids this being put clearly on the table. Joy Mill's position iis
>rather similar, perhaps a little bit more outspoken as to CWL being as 
>fraud
>(but privately only)
>
>Pedro Oliveira and other Liberal Catholic Church people, on the other hand,
>actively defend CWL.
>
>John Algeo and Daniel Caldwell go further and actively attack HPB, even if
>in a disguised form. Their goal seems to be  to avoid HPB being
>"rediscovered" by Adyar members.  Daniel may work on this using diferent
>"names", if Paul Johnson's documented texts on his pseudo-persons  are
>correct.
>
>We are beginning to look and see beyond all those fancies and political
>games by now.
>
>Fancies started with Sinnett, indeed,  and Leadbeater learned from him on
>how to forge, or how to fancy, contacts with the Masters.  Sinnett 
>described
>this process quite honestly, and he truly believed in such mediumnistitc
>pseudo-contacts.
>
>
>Best regards,  Carlos Cardoso Aveline
>
>
> >From: krishtar 
> >Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: Re: Theos-World On Scott-Elliot - quem vive da mente, mente.
> >Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2006 21:16:50 -0300
> >
> >Hi  Friends and Carlos:
> >
> >Let me so better understand :
> >Was that same  " Mary"  that used to claim to be a channel, an 
>intermedium
> >between the master M and AP Sinnett during the period of time in which
> >Sinnett was trying to be in contact with the mahatmas independently of
> >HPB�s
> >activities?
> >In his Bio he also wrote that the master said, in a s�ance,  that he 
>should
> >not tell HPB about the  <>> contact because HPB could be 
>jeallous
> >somehow.
> >So, if it�s true, didn�t the master say that he was not in contact with
> >this
> >Mary and that the only channel was HPB? I can�t remember if this occasion
> >was indeed about this  woman in special.
> >So I gess that AP Sinnett was responsible by the  distortions and
> >mistifications brought by CWL that fed the Adyar�s attraction for psychic
> >contacts and experiments.
> >So it was not CWL that, besides AB, started the investigations in the
> >occult
> >field, but mediums of the class of a  certain Mary who were used as
> >instruments?
> >If it is so, I can now understand why today�s spiritist books, mainly in
> >Brasil,  get so similar
> >to those explanations given in books from Leadbeater and Annie Besant.
> >In portuguese I could  quote " quem vive da mente, mente!", which means
> >approximately " the one who lives relying in his mind, lies".
> >Mind is aways playing tricks on us.
> >
> >Krishtar
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "carlosaveline cardoso aveline" 
> >To: 
> >Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 7:10 PM
> >Subject: Theos-World On Scott-Elliot
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Dear Theo,
> >
> >You will find something, at least,  in "Theosophical History".
> >
> >His wife was "Mary", the medium who purported to talk to Masters in 
>s�ances
> >in the "inner group" organized by A. P. Sinnett.
> >
> >It was there that C. W. Leadbeater started to "talk to the Masters".  The
> >magazine "Theosophical History" published the revealing "Autobiography" 
>of
> >Mr. Alfred Sinnett, in which he frankly tells all about it.  Scott-Eliot
> >was
> >also a member of such a mediumnistic group.
> >
> >When Sinnett died, Leadbeater wrote that in the 1890s his "inner group"
> >made
> >important "occult investigations", and so on.  Sinnett also says that 
>Annie
> >Besant joined that
> >mediumnistic group after HPB's death, that is, while AB was already the
> >"Outer Head" of the Esoteric School, Adyar.
> >
> >So it seems that the occult fancies started precisely in Sinnett's inner
> >group with "Mary", a pseudonymn for Scott-Elliot's wife.
> >
> >I hope that helps, even if marginally.  If you want me to, I can give you
> >the bibliographical  references.
> >
> >
> >Carlos.
> >
> >
> > >From: Theo Paijmans 
> > >Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > >To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > >Subject: Theos-World request biographical information on Scott-Elliot
> > >Date: Fri, 24 Feb 2006 23:04:56 +0100
> > >
> > >Dear all,
> > >
> > >Does anyone have - or know where to find - biographical information on
> > >Scott-Elliot, the author of The Story of Atlantis and The Lost Lemuria?
> > >I am not abel to find it at all in the usual theosophical sources.
> > >
> > >Kind regards,
> > >
> > >Theo
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >_________________________________________________________________
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> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>_________________________________________________________________
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