Theos-Talk Archives (May 2005 Message tt00272)

Dear Anand
Thank you for your reply. 

You wrote:
> That means when you supported those authors you believed you were 
> right. Now you don't think so. So truth is for most of the students 
> is subjective or relative. You should say " I now think .... is 
right 
> but I may be wrong because at other moment I believed opposite 
views 
> were right"

You say:
>"you believed you were right". 

Never was this the case. How could my mind be remotely correct when 
compared with these teachers whose esteem was, and still is, so high 
in the Adyar Society. 
On the contrary it was my trust that I was studying and conveying the 
teachings of honest and honourable people that was my biggest mistake.

You say:
> So truth is for most of the students is subjective or relative. 
>You should say " I now think .... is right but I may be wrong 
because at other moment I believed opposite views were right".

For me, these are wise words to which we might all aspire although 
with respect, you don't often appear to represent them in this forum. 
You seem utterly convinced as to the rightness of your belief in the 
pronouncements of Leadbeater and Besant, and the worthlessness of 
those of H P Blavatsky.
Both Leadbeater and Besant have been proven far and beyond any 
reasonable doubt to have lied, and to have manipulated and deceived 
their followers on many occasions and in many ways.
At this stage, the same cannot be said of Blavatsky with any degree 
of proof.

This certainly does not mean to me that Blavatsky is an infallible 
guru, although some of us on this forum are accused of believing 
this, which is yet another dishonest attempt to avoid the real issues 
and to libel us in spite our continued protestations to the contrary.
Nor does it mean that Leadbeater and Besant were wrong in all that 
they said and did.
It is simply that Blavatsky has far greater credibility as a teacher 
of Theosophy and occultism as far as most of us can ascertain at this 
stage. 
However, it seems to me we should still maintain an ever open mind 
and heart to new perspectives, an attitude she demonstrably supported.
However, even in this, the same cannot be said for Leadbeater and 
Besant who almost demanded obedience from their followers and 
unfortunately succeeded and still succeed beyond all measure.

Regards
Nigel


>Nigel wrote:

>Dear Leon and all
>Leon, you wrote in part to Anand Gholap:
> Don't know why I even bother writing this -- since I see no one on
this forum
> are suckers for this kind of nonsense. But, maybe it will alert
some lurking
> newcomer who might take this subject seriously. :-)


>>From my perspective, your last sentence highlights the essential need
>to continually expose and challenge many of the pronouncements of
>Bishop Leadbeater, his clones and supporters.

>Like many, my Theosophical studies began with an open mind, with
>predominant exposure to Leadbeater, Besant, Hodson, Jinarajadasa and
>their commentators' information. After a number of years as a serious
>and committed student I began lecturing for the Adyar Society and
>even constructed and ran an introductory course for newcomers for a
>number of years, based in part on the above authors' teachings. After
>considerable work, this course was published and distributed
>throughout Adyar Lodges in Australia, now very, very much to my
>regret.
>In the mid nineties I participated in a number of study groups into
>the Secret Doctrine and Mahatma Letters run by Joy Mills culminating
>in a three month's intensive at Adyar headquarters in India.
>The reason for this explanatory introduction is that only during and
>after all this study did the enormous differences and contradictions
>between the teachings and mindsets of HPB and Leadbeater et al become
>apparent.
>These differences and contradictions in teachings are well documented
>and thankfully regularly highlighted for students on this forum.
>Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for the Adyar TS as Perry has
>informed us.

>Quite apart from this and Leadbeater's many ongoing, blatant and
>provable untruths, what is not often discussed is the insidious
>nature of his and his clones' mindset.
>Whilst he and they occasionally, disarmingly state that we should
>decide matters for ourselves and not accept their words prima facie,
>they subtly and sometimes not so subtly write in such an
>authoritative manner as to command the listening ear and respect of
>the often vulnerable beginner. This, together with the esteem in
>which they are held in the Adyar Society, and their
>Augustinian/Aquinian moral pronouncements, has caused, and still
>causes, many earnest and sincere beginners to believe they are
>exposed to mighty and honourable beings.

>In the important matter of how we think, whilst HPB's writing style
>and teachings are occultly designed to free our minds to enable their
>exposure to the genuine mysteries of existence, Leadbeater and his
>clones' style and teachings work hard to develop a simplistic,
>compliant, blind-following mindset. From my experience, in this they
>have so often succeeded.
>Add to this their inherent motivation that `"God's in his heaven and
>all's right with the world" as long as you follow us and our
>teachings', and you have a recipe for entrapping a newcomer's
>skandhas into pseudo-theosophy potentially for incarnations to come.

>For myself, it is this domineering mindset and style of writing which
>is insidious to the core and which requires exposure just as much as
>the differences and contradictions of teachings.

>In spite of all the above, this is not to suggest that Leadbeater's
>life and teachings were totally worthless. Motive aside, his tireless
>work for his church and his Theosophical Society was determined
>effort, however much dishonesty was involved.
>It is simply to suggest that, from my experience his and his clones'
>teachings do not support many of HPB's as he and they dishonestly
>claimed, and that his and his clones' mindset is highly pernicious
>for the unsuspecting and gullible seeker whose birthright it is to
>think for themselves.
>Best wishes
>Nigel