Theos-Talk Archives (April 2005 Message tt01409)

>>"I just disagree with your perception that it
> > is okay for you to judge that a particular writing is wrong for me."
> Well...John I didn't do that.
> Perhaps you perceived my email in such a manner.
I think (though I didn't check the web archive to make sure) that if you 
check the continuity of messages that what you said about "certainly DO 
NOT find that amusing" came after what I said about "judging". That can 
change the perception.

Also, my statement about judging was not pointed at you, but at any 
message in which someone tries to tell another person on this list what 
they should and should not be reading. I wrote my reply because of many 
previous messages from various people trying to say that one person was 
right and another was wrong, implying that nothing of that other person 
could be right.

Finally, in response to the person who posted the link about autism, you 
might want to also read up about Asperger Disorder, a type of autism 
that can cause an adult person not necessarily make the right decisions 
in social situations, or even to recognize that he's made the wrong 
decision in such a situation. Not to make excuses for him, but if CWL 
had Asperger Disorder, it could mean that if he were tried today, a 
judge might rule that he was incapable of being tried. It could also 
explain why he might have (allegedly) believed that what he was doing 
was all right.

It is possible for an adult to have Asperger Disorder and still function 
in society. I am such a person. I didn't find out that I had it until 
about ten years ago when I was diagnosed as having mild Aspergers by Dr. 
Dale Jordan who used to be the state Learning Disabilities specialist 
for the Arkansas Department of Adult Education. I also have moderate 
Attention Deficit Disorder (not high enough to require medication) and 
mild dysgraphia.

I might add that understanding what I have has made a difference in my 
life. I am a totally different person since my "awakening" than before 
specifically because I understand myself better.

Of course, it is impossible now to diagnose someone for something he did 
a century ago, but my point is to try to offer a scenario in which he 
can be wrong in one respect, but still not wrong in another.

Finally, let me reiterate, I am NOT trying to say that what he 
(allegedly) did was right. I'm just saying that even if he did it, it 
should not mean that everything he did in his life was 100% wrong as a 
result. I still believe that it is possible for parts of his writings to 
be right for someone in this group, and in some strange way, even his 
ramblings about martians might even be right for someone. Note that I'm 
not trying to say that any of these writings are right for you, because 
you might have already made up your mind for yourself.

> But, let us be honest - I did NOT judge
> what is right or wrong for you.
I don't recall that you did, but when someone on this list says that his 
writings are wrong for anyone else, it comes across to me that a person 
is saying that it is wrong for me, because it sounds to me like he (or 
she) is saying that person is 100% wrong.

I just hate to see people on this list say that CWL's writings are 100% 
wrong, or that HPB's writings are 100% wrong. I believe it's possible 
for both of them to be right, to some extent. (But I refuse to say that 
either one is 100% right ... I reserve the 100% figure for God. (It is 
said that the Amish women deliberately put a mistake into every quilt 
that they make, because they don't want to make a perfect quilt, because 
only God can make perfection.)

If you want to read more about Aspergers, hereare a few links:
** Freaks, Geeks and Asperger Syndrome
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/1843100983/ref=nosim/recommendations
** Pretending to be Normal, Living with Asperger's Syndrome
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/1853027499/ref=nosim/recommendations
** Reflections from a Different Journey, what Adults with Disabilities 
wish All Parents Knew
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/asin/0071422692/ref=nosim/recommendations

> X is more clever than Y and this is a fact.
> It will not work the other way around Y is more clever than X.
That is something that I will not do. I will not get into a comparison 
where I try to say that one person is better than another. I also refuse 
to say that one person's religion is better than another's.

So, I won't say that X is more clever than Y, because it's not for me to 
judge.

I might concede that X is more clever than Y in one person's opinion, 
and that Y is more clever than X in another person's opinion, but I will 
not try to make it a fact that is undisputable that one is factually 
more clever than another.

Likewise, for some people, Pope Benedict is more clever than the Rabbi 
down the street from you, but that does not mean that it's wrong for 
somone in your neighbor to decide that the Rabbi is more clever than 
Pope Benedict. It's more a matter of opinion than fact.

> Because that is a lie.
It's only a lie when you try to twist what I say. I never tried to say 
that one person was better than another. I'm only trying to say that it 
is possible for BOTH of them to be right (and the unspoken assumption 
that I now add ...

I believe that it is possible for both of them to be equally right ... 
in God's eyes.

> What you in fact are saying is that our talk about who is right or 
wrong is
> amusing.
I think it's amusing that someone can say (or imply) that one person is 
100% wrong because of one (type of) incident. I also find it amusing 
that some people say that Bill Clinton did NOTHING GOOD in his eight 
years in office because he had oral sex with an intern (Why did he get 
reelected if he did nothing good?). I've met some Republicans in this 
area that admit that he actually did some good in office, like ending 
his term with a surplus and supporting education better than a certain 
present administration that shall remain nameless (but whose secretary 
of education is getting sued because they are demanding that schools 
increase spending for "No Child Left Behind" but not supplying the 
funds, forcing schools to get rid of art and music in order to support 
the other requirements (mandates?).).

> I think it is serious.
I believe you are serious. But why does it bother you that I believe 
that it's possible for CWL to have some good inside him? I believe that 
God loves CWL just as much as he loves HPB, and that it is possible that 
God allowed the (alleged) behavior that has been brought up so many 
times on this list in order to spark the debate that is happening.

It just seems to me that everytime someone tries to say that they read 
CWL's writings, that others on this list try to point out every reason 
why they should not. I just believe that it is possible for people to 
find good in EVERY person, and in every person's writings (to some 
extent). (I will admit that I have no desire to read Hitler's manifesto 
(whatever it was called), nor do I wish to read the Protocols of the 
Elders of Zion, because I know they were written deliberately to deceive 
(in my opinion).

> But i get you point, that it is sort of silly
> to discuss whether X is right and Y is wrong - OR - whether Y is right 
and X
> is wrong.
Right ... It is silly, since I believe that both of them are right, to a 
similar extent.

> But - in this manner some of us learns something.
Actually, I hope that ALL OF US learn something. (Except for the person 
with his head in the sand who is convinced that there is nothing left 
for him to learn).

> Yet - you still answered my email - in our little deabte on who is 
right or
> wrong - did you not?
Honestly, when I replied, I was not replying to you, but I was replying 
to my frustration to everyone trying to prove that one point of view is 
better than another.

If you are convinced that you are 100% right in your opinions, then 
please don't bother to reply to try to convince me that I am not right 
in my opinions. I prefer discussions where both sides realize that there 
is room for learning. I know that I can learn from everyone on this list 
(and I know that no matter how many centuries I read this list, I will 
never be perfect). If you believe you can learn from everyone, then 
reply away. If your only purpose in replying is to prove the others 
wrong, then please don't reply,
--
John, webmaster
www.GodLovesEveryone.org and www.MAZES.com

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