Theos-Talk Archives (January 2005 Message tt01108)

Jan 31 2005

Dear Cass:

There is a difference between giving and taking. The first is legitimate
and the karma thereof belongs to the giver. The second, has a karma
related to the taker -- and may be legitimate or not. It depends on how
such knowledge is used.

To me, it seems that knowledge is used wisely only by those who are able to
visualize how it can be abused.  

Therefore, as I read history and the original Theosophical literature,
silence and secrecy are used as a protection for the" masses" who may
endanger themselves or others.

As a mater of tact the knowledge of laws of Nature, and the wisdom to use
them is always "there." It depends on the individual and his stage of
"progress." But it cannot be used illegitimately to flourish and advertise
it as a personal possession in order to cow others into either admiration or
submission. ISIS UNVEILED gives a number of such cases.

Mine is a cautionary note. It also reminds us that there is such a thing as
"pilfered information." And that can be abused.

I will repeat: We have no business trying to interpret Masters' meanings.
We are indeed privileged to study them. And from that derive personal
applications. I am sure we can make general statements concerning the
fundamental concepts: Spiritual unity, the prevalence of LAW and laws (
Karma) and reincarnation as providing a continuous and conjoined "school" of
experience and learning.

As to any statement of a general nature concerning study and interpretation,
that is as you say, a matter of personal work and conviction.  

The proof of the pudding is in the eating. Each one is able to test and
decide on their own. We can only speak of our experience. 

The brotherhood of Nature is THEOSOPHY and it includes not only information
but friendly (and general) cautions from those who may have had adverse
experience. 

Now, as an exercise, can we set up a list of such "cautions?" 

For example - from The LIGHT OF ASIA (Book 8)


So, these sins being slain, the man is come
NIRVANA'S verge unto.

Him the Gods envy from their lower seats;
Him the Three Worlds in ruin should not shake;
All life is lived for him, all deaths are dead;
Karma will no more make
New houses. Seeking nothing, he gains all;

Foregoing self, the Universe grows "I":

If any teach NIRVANA is to cease,
Say unto such they lie.

If any teach NIRVANA is to live,
Say unto such they err; not knowing this,
Nor what light shines beyond their broken lamps, 
Nor lifeless, timeless bliss.

Enter the Path! There is no grief like Hate! 
No pains like passions, no deceit like sense! 

Enter the Path far hath he gone whose foot 
Treads down one fond offence.

Enter the Path! There spring the healing streams
Quenching all thirst! there bloom th' immortal flowers
Carpeting all the way with joy! there throng
Swiftest and sweetest hours!

* * * * 

More is the treasure of the Law than gems;
Sweeter than comb its sweetness; its delights
Delightful past compare. Thereby to live
Hear the Five Rules aright: --

Kill not -- for Pity's sake -- and lest ye slay
The meanest thing upon its upward way.

Give freely and receive, but take from none
By greed, or force or fraud, what is his own.

Bear not false witness, slander not, nor lie;
Truth is the speech of inward purity.

Shun drugs and drinks which work the wit abuse;
Clear minds, clean bodies, need no Soma juice.

Touch not thy neighbor's wife, neither commit
Sins of the flesh unlawful and unfit.

________________

These words the Master spake of duties due
To father, mother, children, fellows, friends;
Teaching how such as may not swiftly break
The clinging chains of sense -- whose feet are weak
To tread the higher road -- should order so
This life of flesh that all their hither days
Pass blameless in discharge of charities
And first true footfalls in the Eightfold Path;

Living pure, reverent, patient, pitiful,
Loving all things which live even as themselves;
Because what falls for ill is fruit of ill
Wrought in the past, and what falls well of good;

And that by howsomuch the householder
Purgeth himself of self and helps the world,
By so much happier comes he to next stage,
In so much bettered being. This he spake,

----------------

To me, "wisdom" is a combination of intellectual rectitude and compassion,
as I see it is from you. We may express this differently, that's true. 

I hold it a duty that to spread a knowledge of its tenets and doctrines is
of prime value for all, and am confident (as I see you are) that those who
receive it can make decisions about use, independently, by themselves; I
mean: independent of us and our methods.

I was thinking of what you write -- may I offer this for consideration?

Study of our world and its constitution, shows that the "esoteric" is always
embodied in the "exoteric."

It cannot be expressed or explained. It has no "form" of existence. But it
forms the "Unknown Root" of the basis for life and ex-istence, and of the
community of relationships we have with all beings in our universe, whether
human or others.

We cannot "live" in this Earth without air, water, food, clothing,
habitation and companionship. But these are made up of the elements
supplied by an impersonal and benevolent, compassionate and supportive
Nature. [ Do we stop to enquire why we deserve this support? How is it
possible for us -- and every other being -- to co-exist? Why do we live at
all? What is the benefit? and, to whom? ]

These "elements" are made up of innumerable components: cells, molecules,
atoms, and a host of sub-atmic particles of surprising electro-magnetic
strength and organization. It is a real marvel, when we are made aware of
the facts. 

How is this done? We don't know, and with our limited knowledge and
abilities, we don't manage, except very superficially -- we are, a kind of
"Tennant" to whom a wonderfully intricate mechanism (our body) has even
entrusted.
[But how many of us look at themselves in this way ?]

Cannot we call this the "esotericism" of our being, or our existence? And
does this yet explain clearly what the difference between "thought" and
"feeling," or "emotion" is? Who are WE ? Is that not the eternal
"esoteric" puzzle? And although it confronts us momentarily, we don't
recognize it as a fact.

Ancient Hermes said: "Man Know Thyself." -- there is "esotericism." It
is not a "think-object" it is an Ideal. It is not an object or a system, it
is an immortal BEING IN ITSELF. We are It, but, we don't recognize IT yet.
We however have an inkling, a suspicion of its existence. How do we set
about proving it? The attempt to study ourselves, our essentials and
faculties, gradually reveals to us our inner base. We can mentally
penetrate behind the physical to the elctro-magnetic lattice of forces on
which physical molecules are arranged (the "astral body") . We can "see"
that behind this is a series of "life-currents" -- of breaths peculiar to
ourselves and to our Karma, (the "Prana"). Then behind that are the many
subtle emotions, desires, feelings, wants, and needs (generally grouped
under Kama.

As yet (in our analysis and thinking) we have only approached to the MIND --
the OBSERVER the THINKER -- Mind may be seen as a tool of the PERCEIVER, and
also as ruler of the Personality, but, also, occasionally its victim. This
is condition in which we all at present are.

But there is a Power that transcends the Mind -- called BUDDHI in ancient
oriental philosophy -- and defined as the Universal Wisdom and perception of
all the Laws and Purposes of the vast Universe (of which we are an integral
part). Finally it dawns on us that there is a ONENESS in all things -- a
SPIRITUAL CHANGELESS ESSENCE or ROOT. Its LAWS are the same for all and are
intransgressible.

This is the ATMA, the name given to the SPIRITUAL SOUL of the UNIVERSE --
and even if some claim it is periodical in manifestation, as "thought,
memory and planning," it never "dies" - it emanates from the inconceivable
and immutable ABSOLUTENESS (some like to call that "chaos" or "darkness")
which always is, whether there be the timeless "light" of manifestation, or
the (to us) interminable sleep of Pralaya.

Each student has to seek for meaning based solely on the ETHICAL / MORAL
equity, balance, impersonality and universality of LAW, justice,
impartiality and uniformly -- and if he is diligent, he will find that this
LAW (and its many sub-laws) is completely diffused throughout the manifested
Universe. They are the active supports of all LIFE 

As one may read it, Theosophy states: Every being (monad) is ruled by this
condition; and by its uniform and universal existence, they are also all
inter-related.

Hence the first object of the THEOSOPHICAL MOVEMENT is UNIVERSAL
BROTHERHOOD.  

If we are able to appreciate, and adopt this as our view, then, from that
point on, we affirm our belief in the unity of all beings and also in their
IMMORTALITY -- as "Eternal Pilgrims," each at the level of evolution, where
the faculties being developed by their own self-effort, are an index of the
ethical and moral WISDOM of that being. Yet, in every being, the divine
Potential is present. Eventually it will manifest.

As one may study it, Theosophy states, that: if this is not grasped, there
can be no real understanding of Theosophical propositions, tenets, or
doctrines.-- which, as HISTORY, preserved by the Great Lodge of Adepts since
the beginning of time, and it underlies all systems of religion, philosophy
or science at their ROOTS and ORIGINS. At their "roots" they are all ONE and
unified.
[S D I 272-3]

One may try to penetrate every doctrine, tenet, axiom or proposition to
their own individual source to prove this for themselves. It can never be a
matter of physical plane instruction or impartation, it is (as I understand
it) always a matter of self-generated effort. We "initiate" ourselves. The
immortal Initiator is within. [The Higher Self - Atma]

The Mind, when purified of passion, distraction, maya and ignorance, becomes
the storehouse and the repository of universal knowledge. (See the Yoga
Slokas of PATANJALI)  

Yet, each one has the capacity of expressing their understanding and perhaps
of showing others the "doors" and "windows" that, individually, they have
discovered which have afforded them a view of the "INFINITE GOAL" -- of
SUBLIME PERFECTION -- which is common for all of us. It is NOT outside
somewhere, but always interior. We are the Immortals. We are the eternal
students, We seek the "esotericism" of which we are the shrine and the
temple. And so, we: "Look inward, thou art Buddha."

Ceremonial magic, mantrams and postures of discipline are not in any way the
equivalents of the inner mental mediation and search, search for TRUTH. And
TRUTH is the possession of no one, and yet all have it within. No one can
by some single method induce in others a knowledge of themselves. It is an
individual effort and has to be entirely honest and sincere if any lasting
result is to be attained. And, I would add, it cannot be advertised.

The 3 FUNDAMENTAL PROPOSITIONS of The SECRET DOCTRINE (Vol. 1, pp. 14 -19)
have to be fully grasped by all (any one) who desire to understand and
penetrate to the interior, as well as the Universal, Divine Monad
(Atma-Buddhi) which is the root-base of our present ex-istence. The
"bridge" we all have -- our MIND, does this, when controlled and directed.

The whole of The SECRET DOCTRINE demonstrates this as a fact, but we have to
make the effort to read, to correlate, and to study -- discussion,
speculations, doubts and opinions have no permanent existence -- as any one
can see. But there is such a thing as the memory (Mind faculty) and the
intuition (a Buddhi-Manasic faculty) which we can all access in ourselves.

The "esoteric" always relates to BUDDHI-MANAS and is interior at the root
base of our own Spiritual SELVES -- the HIGHER SELF (the Atma) the Divine
tutor (see SECRET DOCTRINE I 207-21, II 167, 275fn, 281-2). It is not
"outside," nor can it be taught in some discipline, or system of meditation,
nor is it expressible in "outside language."

Mysterious this may sound, but (as I see it) every Adept, every Initiate,
every Prophet has attested to this as fact.


Best wishes, 

Dallas

======================================
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Cass 
Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2005 9:53 PM
To: 
Subject: RE: Checked by the Master


Dear Dallas

When this information is given to the masses, then the individual cannot be
held to a vow of privacy or secrecy. If things were to be kept secret
shouldn't they have been passed down by word of mouth?  


Why do you feel it a curiousity that some of us should raise questions?
Many of us have thoroughly studied the recorded original teachings of
Theosophy and many of us have different interpretations, to question and
debate those interpretations should lead to a comprehensive understanding
for all.  


If Theosophy is a Brotherhood then all should share in the knowledge, even
those that may be considered unworthy. Who are we to judge who is worthy
and who isnt. Theosophy will stand or fall on its own.  


I believe that Theosophy touches the heart, not the intellect, and therefore
cannot misguide.

Cass


"W.Dallas TenBroeck" <dalval14@earthlink.net> wrote:


Jan 30 2005

Dear Friends:

May I observe?

An observation was made: "as far as I understand the historical evolution
of humanity - this use of letters by a Master was not uncommon or wrong back
then. When the circumstances called for a physical letter to be given to a
young chela it happened. Not all chelas got letters back then. - They were
perhaps given from time to time when a chela had doubt about an impression
given by the Master using telepathy ..."


I don't think we are in a position after all these years to question the
actions or letters from the Mahatmas to specific students (not to us, nor
in our condition).

So why not take the position of observers? And as such we have to look at
ALL that has been so far recorded (and we may assume that much has not been
recorded, nor are we privileged to expect to see more.) 

In fact I would say we are seeing material never meant for the average
student's eye. 

>From several of the statements made by those Great WRITERS -- They asked for
privacy and secrecy to be observed. We now see it has been violated -- for
one reason or another -- and the curiosity of (we) the side-sitters, is not
easily appeased. 

============================================================


I would like to make a few observations:

1 If we have not thoroughly studied the recorded original teachings of
THEOSOPHY we have very little basis to go on. 

We need to grasp the fundamentals, and apply them in our thought and efforts
to understand our lives, and those of others, as we all experience them
together in that single vast BROTHERHOOD that was, IS and WILL BE this
Universe, (and this includes our Earth and ourselves). 

2 The Spiritual Immortality of all beings (whether they be named
mesons, electrons, atoms, molecules, skandhas, monads, humans, chelas,
gurus, Mahatmas, Buddhas, planets or galaxies lies at the immutable,
spiritual CORE-BASIS of their existence. That is in th control of the
Universe and its potent agents. 

3 The whole Universe is efficiently run on Laws -- and one of these:
the MORAL LAW of COMPENSATION (KARMA) is an absolute essential component,
and cannot be evaded, even by the cleverest and sliest Kama-Manas. 

4 Every being is at a school (reincarnation or reembodiment) where the
Universe provides lessons [as effects invariably follow causes] and every
circumstance of our lives are opportunities for self-progress. Our past
choices are reflected in our circumstances of "today," or of "tomorrow." 

For us to be able to read (and make hazardous conclusions) based on our
scanty knowledge of occult and esoteric systems and laws, is simply a waste
of time and may delude others. Our knowledge is inadequate.

If we have come to THEOSOPHY to learn, then lets do that. That is our first
responsibility.

Who am I to say this? No one but a fellow student, with our conjoined
progress and goodwill in mind. I will also say that thee is an enormous
amount we can learn all together.

Best wishes, 

Dallas

=============================

-----Original Message-----
From: M. S
Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2005 2:14 AM
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Checked by the Master


My views are:


Cass wrote:

"> I also have problems with the Masters, sending letters to students to 
advise them that they have been accepted as a disciple or a Chela's of a 
certain Master. My belief is that when the student is ready the Master is 
there, and that instruction can be given when we are out of our bodies, e.g.

in sleep. The necessity to be in their presence is only required when the 
pupil has acquired a certain level on the path."

My answer:

Well, as far as I understand the historical evolution of humanity - this use

of letters by a Master was not uncommon or wrong back then. When the 
circumstances called for a physical letter to be given to a young chela it
happened. Not all chelas got letters back then. - They were perhaps given
from time to time when a chela had doubt about an impression given by the
Master using telepathy or another kind of ESP.

Today we have a different situation - especially because of the informations

technology we use and the higher level of knowledge among the average
citizens today.

Back then only few were able to read the papers. And books like The Isis 
Unveiled and The Secret Doctrine was just too far out to be read by most 
people.

A book being published back then would be bought and sold in a quite 
different manner than today. The knowledge about it would also spread in a 
different manner. The same with the spread of the latest news and knowledge 
about what happened in government and in science in one country compared to 
another. It would take more time and happen to a lesser amount. And since 
fewer people were able to read and understand the texts fewer would hear 
about it.

Today communication is much more easy, because of the use of our 
informations-technology. Communication is faster and the level of knowledge 
is higher. And the world is more complex in more than one sense.

CUT 





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