Theos-Talk Archives (October 2004 Message tt00270)

Hi Daniel and all,
Its quite interesting that the JWs don't believe in a literal hell
where souls are burned but rather see hell (Hades-Sheol) as
figurative. (Sheol the word translated as "hell" in the Old testament
was the Hebrew word for grave" 

"And he said, My son shall not go down with you; for his brother is
dead, and he only is left: if harm befall him by the way in which ye
go, then will ye bring down my gray hairs with sorrow to Sheol." -
Genesis 42:38; American Standard Version.

For the JWs there is no after death state at all except for 144,000
chosen ones who will rule with "Christ" in "Heaven".
All other plebs will live on earth in a "paradise" ruled under
totalitarian dictatorship of Yahweh & his minion Christ.
After death is a sleep till the dead are resurrected into the Paradise
on Earth after Armageddon.

During the first 1000 years of "Christ's rule" the dead will be
resurrected into physical bodies with all their memories from there
pre- resurrected life.
Here they will live forever with their resurrected relatives and those
who where saved after Armageddon.

Most of their beliefs where borrowed from the Seventh day Adventists
and / or from the writings of Charles Taze Russell an ex Adventist
himself.

The correlation's I find are that are in the original theosophy after
death there is unconsciousness (with certain exceptions)in Kama-loka
(sheol) until the higher Manas awakens (resurrects) in
Devachan.(Paradise?)
The lower negative aspects have been purged (Armageddon?) in Kamaloka.

These can also be looked at on deeper levels I think as well in terms
of globes rounds and chains.

HPB and the Kabalah also discuss the Nephesh as being the animal soul.
The JWs say quite rightly that as the animals are described as having
nephesh the term does not relate to an immortal soul.
The problem is they then draw the conclusion that nephesh is
describing the whole being rather than just an aspect.

The word nephesh is generally translated as soul, which the bible says
that animals would also have nephesh.

This translation I have read is considered incomplete as it relates
also the Greek term anemos (breath/air) the word soul coming from the
latin solus - alone /sole. (also animus)

The other Hebrew term is Ruach which is related to an "invisible power"
or Spirit and is more impersonal.

In the New testament the word Psyche is translated as soul.

The JWs draw many simplistic conclusions from there interpretations on
the usage's on these words in the bible however at least in some cases
they do point out some interesting points of difference from the
standard fundamentalist beliefs but the underlying premise is the same
and as well the demand for blind belief.

The talking snake and garden of Eden are seen as literal and without
this literal interpretation the whole Christian theology falls flat on
its face.
The only mainstream Christian group I've heard give ear to the
possibility of a metaphorical reading of the bible is in the more
liberal sector of the Anglican church, they also have started to give
women back their power through ordination and maybe even consecration
in the church.
Maybe this is needed before humanity can drop the whole idea of
priesthood's?

As far as Christianity goes they seem to be the ones bringing it into
the 21st century.

Perry

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel H. Caldwell"
<danielhcaldwell@y...> wrote:
> 
> Jehovah Witnesses & Mahatma KH/HPB 
> on Body/Soul/Spirit & Life after Death 
> 
> Some 35 years ago when I discovered the
> Mahatma Letters & HPB's writings, I noticed 
> some interesting SIMILARITIES between the 
> teachings in the letters of Master K.H. and 
> HPB's ISIS UNVEILED and the teachings of 
> the Jehovah Witnesses and the Seventh-Day
> Adventist on soul and spirit, life after death, etc.
> 
> At that time I also was studying a book titled:
> 
> The four major cults: 
> Christian Science, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormonism, Seventh-Day 
> Adventism. 
> by Anthony A Hoekema
> 1963 
> English Book xiv, 447 p. 24 cm. 
> Grand Rapids, Eerdmans 
> 
> I also remember taking a copy of the Jehovah
> Witnessses' IS THERE LIFE
> AFTER DEATH? and underlining the similarities
> with those in the Mahatma Letters.
> 
> I believe the small book IS THERE LIFE AFTER DEATH? 
> is the correct title. The printing I usually
> used or saw was bound in green. 
> 
> I'm wondering if any of the Theos-Talk readers
> (maybe Perry???) has also seen and pondered
> on these similarities. [Yes, I know there
> are differences, too!]
> 
> In Isis Unveiled, the Mahatma Letters, 
> and The Secret Doctrine, what terms are
> used that would be equivalent to the 
> FOLLOWING terms as found in the Old and New 
> Testaments?
> 
> neshamah, nephesh, ruach 
> 
> sheol
> 
> soma, psyche, pneuma
> 
> hades, gehenna
> 
> demons, devils
> 
> Also what theosophical ideas
> illuminate the following questions
> discussed by Christians??
> 
> Are human beings conscious after
> death and/or tormented in hell?
> 
> Is there a Resurrection of the dead?
> 
> What is the second death?
> 
> What does the "The Return of Christ" mean?
> 
> I include here my butterfly illustrations I
> posted once on Theos-Talk:
> 
> As a Butterfly in Its Chrysalis
> http://blavatskyarchives.com/mon/monwwdie.htm
> 
> Once Awakened from Their Post-mortem Torpor . . . .
> http://blavatskyarchives.com/mon/revivingf.htm
> 
> Some useful background reading that might be
> helpful is below:
> 
> DEATH, SOUL AND HELL 
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_death_soul_hell_menu.htm
> 
> THE BIBLICAL VIEW OF HUMAN NATURE
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_biblical_view_human_nature_1.htm
> 
> THE BIBLICAL VIEW OF DEATH
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_biblical_view_of_death_2.htm
> 
> Two Basic Views of Human Nature and Destiny 
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_two_views_human_nature.htm
> 
> The Doctrine of the Immortal Soul
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_doctrine_of_immortal_soul.htm
> 
> Origins of the Word 'Hell' 
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_origins_of_the_word_hell.htm
> 
> HADES
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_hades.htm
> 
> THE GRAVE 
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_the_grave.htm
> 
> Do YOU Have an IMMORTAL SOUL?
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/hd_immortal_soul.htm
> 
> THE ORIGIN AND HISTORY OF HELL
> http://www.heavendwellers.com/origen_and_history_of_hell.htm
> 
> 
> See also:
> 
> THE SPIRIT
> Is It Conscious After Death?
> http://reslight.addr.com/thespirit.html
> 
> Neshamah
> Is It an Immortal Soul in Humans?
> http://reslight.addr.com/neshamah.html
> 
> Neshamah
> http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Hebrew/heb.cgi?number=05397 
> 
> Ruach
> http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Hebrew/heb.cgi?number=07307 
> 
> Nephesh
> http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Hebrew/heb.cgi?number=05315 
> 
> Pneuma
> http://bible.crosswalk.com/Lexicons/Greek/grk.cgi?number=4151 
> 
> 
> Daniel
> http://blavatskystudycenter.org