Theos-Talk Archives (January 2004 Message tt00428)

Hello Krishtar,

There are many people who actually experience the things put forth in SD, =

through meditation and experimentation. Which is also what I have done with=
 
a group in Adyar. All I can say is try it (what I have written below) or do=
n't try it 
and just accept your pre-conditioned thoughts. It's up to you. Some people=
 
PROJECT unconciousley and some peope do so with awareness. The 
TRUTH is in experiencing, not intellectualizing, which is what I have outli=
ned 
for those who wish. If not, I'll keep silent about the rest...

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" <krishtar_a@b...> wrote:
> Hi Ariel
> Still the same question:
> The quote " The mind is the slayer of the real - H.P. Blavatsky, the Voic=
e of 
the Silence, p.1" doesnīt mean to destroy Manas, it is a dead letter 
interpretation.
> It means lowering the activity of our mind to perceive, to feel the true=
Man, 
we cannot reach our true essence in the disturbance of our day by day life.=
We 
must slow down, listen to our inner being.
> Reducing the creation of thoughts, you can begin to perceive your real 
being.
> It is the Voice of silence!
> There is no use in knowing so much intellectual knowledge if we do not 
apply it, it will never turn intelectual knowledge into wisdom.
> and wisdom is what matters, is what changes our inferior qualities.
> Stop reading SD for awhile and go meditating :)
> 
> Krishtar
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: arielaretziel 
> To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
> Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2004 2:32 PM
> Subject: Theos-World Re: The mind murders the real
> 
> 
> 
> Dear Katinka,
> 
> Keep thinking, your getting close. Actually, the Manas is the gift of t=
he S=
> olar 
> Pitris. It is what makes Man ... Man. The word comes from Manas, Manu, =

etc.=
>    
> and it was the Elohim who worried that with this gift now Man could be =
as 
t=
> he 
> Gods. 
> 
> According to HPB, Man can undo himself by severing his Manas from his 
triad=
>    
> and therefore go to Avitchi, a hell of unconciousness. It takes work to=
ach=
> ieve 
> this as the Manas is part and parcel of who we are and differentiates u=
s fr=
> om 
> the beasts. 
> 
> Through Manas, even though we are such small specks in the immensity 
of 
> the universe, we can conceptualize the vastness, higher mathamatical 
> dimensions, and even infinity. We can build entire geometirc stuctures =
in 
o=
> ur 
> head and work out all the dynamics before we manifest it physically in =
an 
> architectural project. We are aware of far off galaxies and sub-atomic =

> particles. This exists in a plane of the self called the Manas. If we r=
emov=
> e it, 
> we can be like a dog, forever happy and seeing the world as it is. 
> 
> The Neo-Platonists would probably tell you that Mind is picking up actu=
al 
> things that exist. These things actually do exist but are in a higher f=
requ=
> ency 
> than matter and emotions. Matter is picked up by our senses, ENERGY is =

> picked up by our emotions, and THOUGHT FORMS are picked up by 
Manas, 
> not something illusionary but a real thing made of real substance. 
> 
> There are all kinds of thought forms that exist in the plane of manas. =
Ther=
> e are 
> the thought forms built from our association with our own Kama Rupa or =

> desire body. There are thought forms built up of Astral energy that flo=
ats =
> 
> around the world, hence we sense a good atmosphere or a bad one. 
There 
> are thought forms that are the imprints of the Akashik Records. There a=
re 
> thought forms that are abstract concepts that just float in Space to be=
pic=
> ked 
> up and used by higher entities as they choose. This all requires 
experience=
> to 
> test out what I am saying. But even a little experimaentation produces =
it's=
>    
> results.
> 
> Understanding our projections and our pre-concieved notions cannot be 
> possible without an awareness of Thought-Forms, especially in the Kama =

> Rupa. Otherwise it leads to self deception and one goes to a darker pla=
ce. 
=
> 
> Manas is the "light" of Lucifer and the BRIDGE to Buddha awareness. 
Atleast=
>    
> according to Theosophy. All I can say is experiment and find out for y=
ours=
> elf.
> 
> There is another word that is also translated as Mind, but has a 
completely=
>    
> different meaning. This word is Chittas. It differs from Manas. It is t=
he "=
> ether" of 
> the astral realm that vibrates. It is usually filled with Vrittis which=
hav=
> e been 
> translated as "thoughts" but really means "disturbances" or "pertibatio=
ns".=
>    
> Sometimes Vrittis are translated as Mind Stuff but this is incorrect. T=
his =
> is 
> Astral. Our strongest Senses of experience is found in the Chittas and =
if w=
> e 
> control it and still the waters so to speak, Than the Manas can listen =
to t=
> he 
> voice from above, in the Buddhic plane. "As above, so below" except in =
a 
le=
> ss 
> perfect fasion, as we pick up the voice from above often yet it gets di=
stur=
> bed 
> by astral waters and comes to us as if by code, in analogy. 
> 
> This is all I'll write for now, but I hope it helps some of you in undr=
stan=
> ding 
> 
> A^A^
> 
> 
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Katinka Hesselink" <
k.hesselink@h...> 
> wrote:
> > The mind is the slayer of the real - H.P. Blavatsky, the Voice of the=

> > Silence, p.1. 
> > 
> > I think the meaning of this sentence isn't that difficult. It simply
> > means that our thoughts are by definition partial and usually
> > conditioned, so that if you take them for the real, you are mistaken.=

> > The only path to seeing things (and people) as they are is in letting=

> > go of preconceptions and simply seeing what is. This is a simple
> > psychological fact. I agree that one can't just throw out the manas.
> > We need manas to figure a lot of issues out. Still it is useful to be=

> > reminded that as a tool to finding the Ultimate Truth - it doesn't
> > work so well. 
> > 
> > I think I read somewhere in Blavatsky that one of the perks she thoug=
h
> > t reading the Secret Doctrine would have was simply that it would kee=
p
> > people busy enough to stay out of trouble. I am not saying that book
> > isn't useful and interesting. But ultimately it is meant to wake up
> > our intuition - not stimulate our manas. 
> > 
> > Katinka
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" <krishtar_a@b...> wrote=
:
> > > The "quote" does not come from the Stanzas of Dyzan, it's from The
> > Voice in
> > >  
> > > the Silence. And unfortunately, unlike the Stanzas, we don't have
> > the good =
> > > 
> > > fortune to have HPB's commentary for this ancient book, so anyone's=

> > guess 
> > > on this line is as good as any other. Of course, if you succesfull=
y
> > slay y=
> > > our 
> > > Manas, you will be rewarded with Avitchi. Good luck,
> > > 
> > > Ariel
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "krishtar" <krishtar_a@b...> wro=
te:
> > > > Ariel
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > I am sorry that my discussion is irrelevant and a gossip for you.=

> > > > But I donīt wish to be framed in one type or another.
> > > > I study theosophy but I donīt consider anything in it a Dogma.
> > > > If you belong to the " first group" you can recall that:the "
> > mind is th=
> > > e true 
> > > murderer of the Real.." ( Dzyan Stanzas )
> > > > It means that everything we catch through our physical sences -
> > the mind =
> > > -  
> > > is not the reality.
> > > > In this plane we do not see things as they are, but how they look=

> > like.
> > > > 
> > > > Krishtar
> 
> 
>    
> 
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