Theos-Talk Archives (January 2004 Message tt00282)

In a message dated 01/16/04 9:11:29 AM, christinaleestemaker@yahoo.com writes:

>Hallo Leon,
>Was that a real death or a near death?
>vr gr Christina

Hi Chris, and anyone else interested in death and after death, 
and what it's like to die.

Happened to me around 30 years ago. Here's how it went... 

As far as I was concerned -- since I felt all the symptoms of a massive heart 
attack (the sharpness of the chest pain was extremely intense) I thought I 
was really dying and resigned myself to it. Then, I actually died in my own 
mind. That's when I jumped out of the body, totally automatically, and literally 
"passed out" as my body crashed to the floor. Medically competent observers 
around my collapsed body, I was told later, also assumed I was dead due to its 
cyanotic pallor and its stopped pulse. However, my mind and continued 
consciousness was wide awake and even sharper and clearer than it ever was before -- 
much like these later days whenever I am engaged in deep, thoughtful contemplat
ion or concentrated, one-pointed meditation, or in the process of imaginative 
creation.

After five or so minutes (which seemed to me like it took hours and everyone 
seemed to be moving in extremely slow motion) I jumped back in the body (also 
automatically). This was after having a completely detailed past life review, 
and from a viewpoint up near the ceiling, watching everybody moving slowly 
around the body... And, I suddenly awakened, but began laughing when I realized 
what had happened, and understood, in a flash of intuition, how all the 
circumstances and experiences of my life was a karmic necessity that I had asked for 
in order to to teach me some lessons... And that, even if I died before 
learning them, it wouldn't matter, since they would be picked up in the next life 
that I could choose for myself. I also knew, before I jumped back, that I had 
some more lessons to learn in this life, and had some unknown mission to 
fulfill before I really died ... Which would come out eventually by circumstances th
at were already staged to happen. I knew then, in another flash of insight, 
that all I had to do from then on was watch and wait, take care of myself, and 
do whatever was necessary to be done in whatever circumstance might come along 
that I may or may not be able to anticipate. I also realized, that, since I 
had created these karmic circumstances in the first place, I could also recreate 
them. (But, that took me a long time to find out how, with conscious 
control... Although, I realized, I had been intuitively doing it all my life by every 
choice I made and every change I anticipated or envisioned.) 

After the ADE, It took all night in intensive care (while I was still 
chuckling) for the medics to figure out that I had a simple temporary blood flow 
blocking cramp of the main aortal artery -- that recovered naturally before 
causing any damage to the heart. 

I also feel that I karmicly induced this pseudo heart attack, when I was 
thinking about my father (my first real teacher) who had six real heart attacks 
(starting at 36, before the last one killed him in his sleep at 60, several 
years before this NDE happened). In this incident, I had worse symptoms than he 
always had, which helped convince me that I was dying. This proves how powerful 
the mind is. Is this why the Master advised us to "Never anticipate pain not 
yet come"? I also wonder if my Dad's heart attacks was not as part of my own 
karma, or a joint karma that may have been set up in our previous lives 
together? Almost everyone who ever met my father thought of him as a "mastermind." 
(Except others, who thought they were the mastermind. :-) But I never thought 
that was such a big deal. Because, when I was a kid, I thought everyone's 
father was a mastermind. </:-)>

After that experience my whole attitude toward life changed, and I became a 
more or less detached observer, a much deeper student of the "mysteries" (that 
my father knew and expressed in everything he did and said, but to which I 
never gave too much thought when I was younger) -- and far more open and flexible 
in my response to whatever change of circumstance would come my way from then 
on through karmic necessity. Incidentally, It wasn't more than a few months 
afterward that I (accidentally?) stumbled into the ULT and began a 25 year 
exploration of all the world's theosophical and mystical literature that I could 
get my hands on. It's also interesting that I bumped into many Masters, 
Adepts and Gurus over the years through apparently accidental meetings -- without 
ever seeking any of them out. (But, that's another story...)

So, I suppose we could say my experience was a bit more than a "near death." 
But, we can call it that. In any event, I doubt that there is any difference 
in the first stages of such a short death where the soul comes back quickly 
after apparently dying for a few minutes, or a "real death" where it doesn't 
return until the next incarnation. (I suppose, also, that such a near or short 
death experience is the only time one can be really sure they are talking with 
the dead... Although I didn't meet anyone... Maybe, because I was having a 
ball, and too busy watching the whole panorama of my life, and laughing at the 
slowpokes gathering around my body who, in their time frame, were running 
around like crazy ants..:-) 

In my case, I consider it a blessing that I had this NDE -- and can remember 
my past death in vivid detail. Therefore, I have no fear of it coming again 
-- however and whenever it will... With the knowledge that when it does come, 
whatever I had to do would be well done as far as it went (in spite of a few 
mistakes and restarts along the way) -- like everything I did and all the 
mistakes I made before I died for the first time in this life. (Is that why the 
initiation of the Ancient Egyptian Priests or Masters, which Moses [certainly] 
Jesus [probably] and Buddha [maybe] must have experienced, required that they 
spend a night inside the Kings Chamber of the Great Pyramid, and die and be 
reborn, before they are "initiated" into the great Arcane Mysteries of Creation?) 

Looking back, it's easy to see that the whole thing was just one big joke, 
since whatever we do in this world is of no consequence to anyone else but 
ourselves, and the only thing we take with us when we die is our own karma. 
Forgiveness for all our past sins comes when we realize there's no way to learn 
except by doing what we think is necessary and, in the process, making mistakes. 
The bigger they are and the harder we fall, the faster we learn. And, the only 
choices we have is usually between the lesser of two evils. It's also 
interesting that at the time of this experience, I was still living in luxury after 
all my business ventures that had put me at the top of the arts, entertainment, 
and publishing worlds had finally failed, and I was contemplating a whole new 
change of lifestyle and career -- possibly opening an auto repair shop with 
my oldest son (which I later did.:-) (That's why I was laughing so hard when I 
came back.) And why, today, life is one big funny joke, that one can only t
ake seriously when it comes to helping and teaching others, and doing what we 
can in any circumstance we are in, to relieve the suffering of those in pain or 
anticipation of pain. 

So, in spite of what anyone else thinks they know about dying, it's still 
nothing to be fearful of. Take it from someone who has been there and back (and 
kind of enjoyed it, and really didn't want to leave while I was there). </:-)>

Best wishes,

Leonardo





>--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, leonmaurer@a... wrote:
>> We're all born to die. So, we better learn to live with it. 
>> 
>> Actually, I died once, and then came back. I found out why we 
>> can't remember our last death. It's because while you are dying 
>> you jump out of the body so fast and there are so many old things
>> to think about, and new things to see, that you are too busy to feel 
>> that you are dying. That was a great relief. And, if you believe me, 
>> you have nothing to worry about. So, why try not to die? 
>> Aren't there better things to do?
>> 
>> Lenny the liver 
>>