Theos-Talk Archives (March 2003 Message tt00362)

Hi Erica, 

I don't know who you are talking to here - anyone in particular? 

I find it rather confused (sorry to be this direct). If you haven't 
studied others than Blavatsky, don't judge them. You don't know what 
you are talking about. 

As for Annie Besant expelling the German section for not believing in 
Krishnamurti being the World Teacher - I heard the story differently. 
The way I heard the story told is that she expelled Rudolf Steiner 
because he refused to let people into his German Section (he was 
president) who did believe in Jiddu Krishnamurti. Which makes it a 
freedom of thought issue. She had right on her side in expelling him, 
in my opinion. 

As for Krishnamurti teaching a particular path - he didn't. The quote 
I sent is one of the very few where he actually gave people advice on 
how to meditate. There are far more quotes to be found where he said 
that a method would get you nowhere. 
see:
http://www.katinkahesselink.net/kr/
The quote (if the below was a response to that) was selected by me 
because it talks about slowing thought instead of stopping it - the 
latter being much easier. That he in this case advised the use of a 
diary to help slow the thought is secondary to me, and I'm pretty 
sure it was secondary to Krishnamurti as well. 
--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Erica Letzerich <eletzerich@y...> 
wrote:
> 
> 
> "Disputes and conflict is ditthi-mana. Therefore the
> Buddha taught us to let go of views. Don't allow mana
> to cling to those views beyond their relevance."
> 
> 
> How may someone to progress on the path, if not have
> faced his dark sites? How may someone to progress in
> the path if not have awaken and enlighten the dark
> corners of his/her soul? How may someone to progress
> if he/her does not know deeply his or her nature? How
> can someone to progress if still has believes?
> Necessarily will remain a silent faith on the unknown,
> nothing else. 
> 
> When one wants to accelerate this process, attending
> the call of his soul he will be tested friend. Facing
> situations in life and conflicts in the inner self.
> The real strength and power arises when someone
> recognize and face his/her own weakness. This is hard
> dear friend! Have you faced yours? I would advice
> nobody to try; it's not a "game for children in the
> kindergarten". You may not understand what am I
> talking about, because of the limitations of the
> language.
who are you talking to?
You don't advice people to face their weaknesses? What kind of advice 
is that? I mean, I can understand not advising yoga, or meditation in 
general, or most other methods - they can get "the system" (as I like 
to call it) pretty upset, especially if one is psychologically 
unstable. But to not face your weaknesses ... Everybody has the 
capacity to face their weaknesses. And everybody who is going to do 
at least the minimal amount of spiritual practice is going to have to 
face their weaknesses. Facing your weaknesses is what is going to get 
you off your alcohol-abuse (not you personally - know nothing about 
you). Facing ones weaknesses is going to get people off their self-
erected pedastals and be open to other people and tolerant of their 
weaknesses. Facing ones weaknesses - at any level - is the first step 
in overcoming them. 

You probably didn't mean it as I read it - where are you from, 
English is probably not your first language, is it?

Can you tell us where the quotes came from?

Katinka
> I am not denying the teachings of the Great Ones, this
> would be blindness, I am not in favour or against any
> teacher, and I am not a follower of Krishnaji.
> Actually the love I have for Madame Blavatsky and for
> the Master is too deep to allow me to be in favour or
> against any other sincere try made by someone to break
> the veils of Maya. Of course I am against any kind of
> teaching with leads deeper into anger, racism etc.
> 
> I go further even Krishnaji's followers aren't able to
> understand what he was talking about. Many of them
> also within Kama-Manas take his teachings as a body of
> truth and the best truth. Is this a reaction of a mind
> still rooted deeply on kama? 
> 
> What I see as result of many persons trying to follow
> a series of techniques and methodology is that they
> are more nourishing the Kama-Manas, instead to
> overtake it. It's very easy friend when everything is
> apparently correct into someone's life to keep on
> making prayers, meditation, concentration exercises
> etc. Of course results will flourish, but still within
> kama-manas such results will be rooted. 
> 
> After one have open the inner gates, things change in
> a way no description in words can be done. 
> 
> "A mind filled with craving is not wholesome, a mind
> filled with aversion is not wholesome, and a mind
> filled with ignorance is not wholesome. When the mind
> is concentrated with the help of an object of craving,
> aversion or ignorance, it will achieve concentration,
> but it will be neither balanced nor equanimous. Such
> concentration of the mind is not proper, not pure, and
> not conducive to happiness. Concentration that is
> dependent upon craving, aversion or ignorance is the
> absorption of an unbalanced mind-how can it be
> beneficial?"
> 
> Annie Besant, as you mentioned about the way Blavastky
> advice her to start exercising on "Dharana". I will
> tell you such try sincerely made, but with a mind
> still rooted on Kama-Manas will lead eventually into
> the development of lower Siddhis, and an apparent
> balance of the mind. Don't forget that Annie Besant
> strong expression of a mind still rooted on Kama-Manas
> was her try to make out of Krishnamurti the new
> Messiah and the creation of a new world religion.
> 
> I am sure you are aware that she closed down the
> German Section, expelling from the Theosophical
> Society 2.000 members because they didn't want to
> accept Krishnaji as the new messiah. See history shows
> that human nature to change it's the most difficult
> task, doesn't matter what techniques one may follow
> and practice, what believes one may hold, any motion
> arising within kama-manas will reflect intolerance
> towards the ones that have other believes, and the
> need to hold himself or herself within a body system
> of knowledge leading to disunion, intellectual
> antagonism, etc. 
> 
> Erica Letzerich