Theos-Talk Archives (December 2002 Message tt00683)

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Bart Lidofsky <bartl@s...> wrote:
> Do you have any reliable cites for that? (P.S. The American Nazi
> Party's website is NOT a reliable cite).

Whatn about the Farrakhan site? There ar e two versions of the 
story, one of which was written by a Hebrew writer and one of which 
comes to us from the Eguptians. If you compare them point by point 
you see that they agree on the facts of what happened, but each spins 
it according to his unique perspective. This is as one would expect, 
ethinks. Anyway, the fact that each confirms the other independently 
suggests to an amateur historian that the incidents swaceibws 
probably happened in hstory.

The Hebrew writer had a very sharp sardonic sense of humor which most 
modern readers completely miss. One example of this was the so-
called "plaguue of lice" which misfortune overtook the Egyptians 
because they had the Hebrews in their country. The Egyptians during 
that time frame had an obsession with cleanliness tat wouldhave made 
Howard Hughes blush. They were constantly washing, shaving, etc. 
The Hebrews during that sime time period considered all this washing 
rather effeminate and wore dirt as a badge of honor. Bear in mind 
this was more than 3000 years ago. Anyway, if you kniow the 
historical context, it is obvious when the Henrew writer has Moses 
say in effect: "Let us outta here or you will be infested with lice!" 
he was not stating an historical fact but having some fun with the 
culture clash which contributed to the expulsion of the Hebrews in 
the first place.

Anyway, the Egyptians claim they wanted the Hebrews out and that the 
Hebrews, who faced starvation if separated from Egypt's fleshpots, 
were naturally not keen on going. Both the Hebrew and Egyptuan 
accounts agree that one cause of the clash was the Egyptian king's 
anxiety that there were so many Hebrews in his country they could 
take over the place. There were other foreign groups as well, and 
other exodus leaders. I think it was Diodorus who said a fellow 
named Danaus led the Greeks out of Egypt at the same time Moses was 
leading the Hebrews out. That these other groups existed is briefly 
referred to by the Hebrew writer. Since we see that kind of 
xenophonia today, it seems entirely reasonable to me that it must 
have existed in ancient times as well. I see another example of the 
Hebrew writer's wit in his insistence that the Egyptiuans just could 
not stand to see their guests go and did everything possible to keep 
them around. Yhat despite the fact that they were worried about 
being overrun, complaining about lice, etc.

I also see an instance of the Hebrew writer;s sense of humor when he 
says the Egyptians asked the Hebrews to please rape and pillage the 
place and that the Hebrews were merely obliging an Egyptian request. 
It is rather unlikely that it happened that way in history, but the 
Egyptian writer confirms that the Hebrew guy was telling the truth 
when he says his ancestors were "heavy laden with the spoils of the 
Egyptians." The Egyptian writer is more detailed on what happened, 
but they both agree that granaries were ruined, etc.

We only have quotations from the Egyptian account by Manetho, who was 
the most important no-Hebrew writer on this incident. Josephus 
discusses his account at length in his book AGAINST APION. 
Naturally, Josephus favored his own version of the natuonal legend, 
but a careful comparison of the two shows Manetho's account has 
considerable credibility.

Two points that may be mentioned: (1) Manetho says the Hebrews 
rampaged across Egypt during the reign of Amenhotep IV, (2) the 
rampage is mentioned in the Tell-el-amarna letters, which were 
excavated a century or so ago. Those letters were written during the 
reign of Amenhotep IV, and the marauders were referred to as 
the "Habiru", a name which evolved into the later Hebrew. The 
letters were published in book form and can be found in some large 
university libraries. So there is confirmation that this inciudent 
occurred in documents written during the period in which the rampage 
occurred. I find that very persuasive, especially in light of other 
testimonies from later historians. Anyway, nomadic peoples then and 
now felt no personal vested interest in the status quo of city 
dwellers and they did tend to loot when they could. We seethe same 
behavior on the part of ancient armies, which paid soldiers by 
letting them loot defeated cities.

I am aware that Budge and others place the exodus a few years after 
Amenhotep's death, during the reign of Ramses. Manetho claims 
Amenhotep died before the battle at the Red Sea, though, and that 
that altercation was led by another king.