Theos-Talk Archives (February 2002 Message tt00134)

In a message dated 02/05/02 12:34:40 AM, adelasie@surfari.net writes:

>Could you elaborate a bit on the statement, "All this universe is pervaded
>by me in my invisible form, all things exist in me, but I do not exist in 
them."
>This statement has puzzled me, since I understood that the inner 
>world is the center of all existence, and that in the hierarchy of 
>being, all exists within the one. How is it then that the one does 
>not exist in all?

If I may butt in... Let's see if we can logically and scientifically examine 
this question from several points of view and, perhaps, arrive at an answer 
that can satisfy most of us. For starters, picture this: 

(*---*= italics) 
Perhaps, the meaning will be quite clear when one considers that Krishna is 
speaking from the standpoint of the infinite, unmanifest, *primal beginning* 
or Parabrahm, that exists, forever unborn and outside of (manifest, or 
finite) space-time, as an infinite potentiality of the unmanifest or primal 
"zero-point." 

This primal point, being dimensionless and motionless, can only express 
itself (when spread out within manifest space) as the finite multidimensional 
(triune, septenary, etc.) field expansion of its fundamental aspect of 
"spinergy" (that ultimately, has its center "everywhere" and its overall 
circumference "nowhere"). 

This expansion into finite beings, or "monads," within the overall metric or 
manifest space -- each of limited manifest energy that is tied up in the 
structure of their own physical being -- in no way diminishes the fundamental 
nature, or independent and forever unchanging separate existence of the 
primal zero point -- which, when spread out as countless dimensionless and, 
therefore, coadunate *zero (laya) point*monadic centers (individual 
existence's) -- is located *everywhere* and pervades *everything*. 

Therefore, forever unmanifest, in itself, the primal zero-point eternally 
contains infinite aspects and potentialities... While all manifest beings 
(or "lives") are rays from or reflections of this primal point, each having 
their own zero-point or "laya" center, they are independent finite 
existence's in space-time (within the all pervading preexistent and timeless 
primal space) and, accordingly, have limited aspects and potentialities. 

Thus, since these finite material beings are of the essence only of the 
"spinergy" surrounding the *primal zero-point*, they exist independently 
within *its* overall field of action, but this One primal reality cannot 
exist (as an independent entity) in them. 

In other words, being infinitely potent and thus undiminished by the 
expansion of its spinergy, the zero-point itself, representing the primal 
source, Parabrahm (AKA, Krishna) can never be separated from itself (or from 
its own will to keep on spinning in all directions, as always) and, 
therefore, cannot "exist" as an independent entity within any separate 
universe or being that was formed out of its own essence. 

>From another POV; That whose noumenal existence is causeless, and is itself 
the cause of phenomenal existence, cannot be the cause of its own existence 
(i.e., its own independent nature, that exists without a cause, cannot exist 
phenomenally or be a part of any existence it serves as the cause of). 
Also, we might ask, how can an unchanging noumenal reality "exist" as an 
entity "in" anything or anyone that exists as part of a constantly changing 
phenomenal reality?

Krishna indicates this in the Gita when he says, "I established this whole 
universe (and all the beings in it) with a single portion of myself (its 
'spinergy') and remain separate" (undiminished, since Its spinergy always 
remains infinite, and It still exists, unchanged, outside of these external 
"being's" time and space). "Therefore," as he might continue, "...they (as 
conscious, independent beings) are part of me, (Its outside garb or 
spin-energy) but I am not part of them." (their separate, individualized 
material forms -- for It is not only omniscient, omnipresent and omnipotent, 
but also, entirely independent of its own creations) (my parenthetical 
additions) 

I hope this gives us sufficient food for thought, and helps us resolve in our 
minds the relationship between the Absolute primal source and our individual 
being.

LHM