Theos-Talk Archives (December 2001 Message tt00541)

Sunday, December 30, 2001


Dear Friend:


I agree that there are many ways of translating one’s understanding of
Buddha’s “last words.”


However might I put up for consideration the following thought -- I always
like to seek for CAUSES I will apologize in advance for being very
analytical of those words and concepts -- so if you will bear with me, lets
together look through my eyes and mind -- at what I see of this Wise One/s
last words on our physical plane in the body of Gautama, erstwhile, Prince
of Kapilavastu.


“Impermanent are all component things” -- sounds to me like a fair statement
of fact.


Transience implies movement of something within a medium of containment, or
of contrast. Relations and relativity play their parts here. What are the
essentials and what can be eliminated as part of our consideration ?


What was contained? Where will it transit to?


It also implies perception of that movement. It may be an idea or an object
perceived at some distance, or in some other relationship. Who or what
“perceives?”


The perception may be internal, external (as one viewing an event) or both.
It may be minutely analytical or crudely careless and gross, in the
observation of relevant phenomena, and in framing relevant conclusions.


Also, a starting point, and either a fixed or a movable goal.


“Impermanent are all component things” -- sounds to me like a fair statement
of fact.


All that exists as “form” (large or small, human or otherwise) is made up
of movable components -- permanency is relative, as from infinitesimal
moment to moment in precise time ( The Masters are said to be knowers of
the final components of manifested TIME ) Are we regarding the atoms of the
body now dying, or the Mind, or the spirit, or the disintegration of the
underlying astral form and the slowing of the flow of life-currents? etc.
etc.


I imagine when a “form” is no longer useful to the Ego-sum, the power of
assembling and renewing the powers of reformation, selection and elimination
stop -- so that physical death results.


But this does not cause the cessation of INTELLIGENCE, consciousness, nor
does it destroy the continuity of the HUMAN SPIRITUAL SOUL -- But then our
modern Science does not consider these as they are still impossible to
define with any accuracy, other than as wishes, hopes and imagination (if
not superstition).


Form implies an “intelligence” for which it serves, in its aggregation,as a
vehicle.


Presumably there is an intimate relationship in the selection of the
representative aggregations of components to provide a special forms, and
perhaps these relate to the subtle planes of Mind, of Feeling and of Desire
as well as the life-currents in the AEther. What causes the selectivity of
materials from food, drinking and breathing that they come and remain
temporarily with us to make up our bodies for a while. what causes them to
leave? What kind of intelligence resides in our bodies that directs this
without any attention from us? Are we not “tenants” in a most marvelous
home -- flexible adaptable, and in general careful of its own existence ?
Is it not a form of symbiosis ?

But I find that only in theosophic thought are the latter considered as
significant.


“--- therefore seek out your salvation with diligence.”


This has moral and ethical implications as it echoes the age-old fact that
every human grows in intelligence entirely dependant on his or her own
choice. Children in their classes at school with common educational
circumstances actually choose their learning patterns and frame their
success within the convenience provided.


The limitations of circumstance and their influence is admitted. However no
two individuals react to “circumstances “ in exactly the same way, nor are
“circumstances” ever exactly identical -- only similar.

May questions -- but interesting if they can be resolved.

Best wishes,

Dallas

====================



-----Original Message-----
From: IH----ng
Sent: Sunday, December 30, 2001 4:03 AM
To:
Subject: Re: Buddhism and Theosophy

A fine mailing Dallas. I would only have one correction. The Buddha's last
words were not as HPB said, that "all was Spirit."

The last dialogue of the historic Buddha is recorded in the Mahaparinibbana
Sutta. His very last words have been translated into English in various ways
(but ALL with the same meaning), and here are three versions:
"Transient are conditioned things. Try to accomplish your aim with
diligence."--What the Buddha Taught. BQ 4132 R3313 1974, p. 138.

"All the constituents of being are transitory; work out your salvation with
diligence."--Buddhism in Translations. BL 1410 W3 1962, p. 109.

"Dharmas are impermanent. If there is birth, there is death. Be diligent in
your efforts to attain liberation."--Old Path, White clouds. BQ 882 N4813
1991, p. 560.

As you can see, he spoke with regard to transience, not Spirit. Spirit in
the Theosophical sense doesn't appear in Buddhism. This is a very important
and it totally misrepresents Buddhist thought to say that he spoke of spirit
in his last moments.

Kind reagrds,


Ian ---




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