Theos-Talk Archives (May 1999ar Message tt00080)

Hi Martin,

> A human is only a human being full of possible errors, and in an
> ever learning quest for reality which takes several lifetimes
> with trial and error, and IMHO, is better to err in the path
> to the Truth than TAMAS.

That strikes a chord in me. The way I interpret what you have said is that
we each have to do the best that we can for those around us in the 'light'
of the abiding 'Truth' that is within all of us. We will err many times, no
doubt about it, but better to err from time to time in working for the
welfare of others than to be always 'right' in working solely for ourselves.

> Ethics, virtues, spiritual practices along with the study of the
> Occult Teaching given by the Masters should be our  interest and
> finding the way to share it is our duty, I think.

Nicely put, Martin. So with that as our common aim we will each find
different ways to translate that into action according to our ability,
skills, understanding and the 'place' in life in which we find ourselves.
It is our common aim and not our diverse actions and variety of ways in
which we tread the Path that brings us together.

best wishes

Peter













>
> I do not mean to argue forever about it with you. You have a
> valid historical point
> and is well taken, and maybe some members have not come to terms
> with it and
> integrated ii in a healthy manner. But time and your posts will do it.
>
> Look at the situation: I posted something spiritual written by
> Besant, and you thank
> me and replied with the K, ES &  AB mess. Ok it means that every
> time that me or
> anyone posts something about someone , you want written also, all
> the personal
> mistakes, errors, and membership count,  so we learn that, that
> person is human,
> makes mistakes, we are suffering the consequences of it.  I think
> is a bad, poor
> approach to the beauty of the theosophical writing.  Ramadoss, I
> think some day you
> should transcend it and put to rest all the TS mistakes and move
> forward. Or maybe
> you have that karmic duty of telling and re-telling the ugly to
> all. I'll try to
> learn to love and accept you they way you are. After all, in this
> we are all
> together . . . the point of blaming A. Besant for the membership
> count is over and
> it is on our lap... if membership is low is because of you, me
> and all of us, not
> able to address their spiritual needs,  expecting them to
> understand our way of
> explaining theosophy.
>
>
> Changing the subject:
> And, where do you live? I spend couple of days lecturing in
> Houston and wanted to
> meet you.
> Would you be kind to email me the Pathless Land of K. There is a
> line in it  that I
> need clarification. Thanks.
>
>
> Martin Leiderman
> in West Los Angeles
>
>
> M K Ramadoss wrote:
>
> > Thanks Martin. The points you made are timely and on target.
> However, since
> > you have referenced me in your msg, I think that further
> clarification is
> > necessary.
> >
> > Your wrote:
> >
> >         " We should stop  comparing Besant, Judge, Tingley ,
> Crosbie, GDP, Radha,
> >         Algeo, Grace, Krishnamurti (this one is for Ramadoss
> who repeats every 6
> >         months the incident of K, and AB and the closing of the
> ES) etc, to each
> >         other , and focus on the WORK, in the Duty of making Theosophy
> >         available. And learn the synergy of the union instead
> of the detrimental
> >         vibrations of superiority."
> >
> > The fact of the matter is that historical matters relating to
> TS cannot be
> > ignored. IMHO, anyone interested in Theosophy and TS should be
> aware of the
> > historical facts so that they are fully informed and such facts will be
> > helpful to keep the total picture in proper perspective and prevent one
> > from being misled from incomplete or inaccurate information that may be
> > available. This is especially true of newer recruits to
> theosophy and TS.
> >
> > I think every one should be aware of the tremendous sacrifices
> made by well
> > known theosophical leaders ? whether formal or informal, that should not
> > mean that one should ignore things they have done which may not
> have helped
> > theosophy or TS nor anyone should be immune from criticism. Humans being
> > imperfect, knowing the full picture helps while being very
> grateful for the
> > sacrifices they have made even in matters they were misguided
> or may have
> > harmed. I also do not know of a single person who has not recognized the
> > sacrifices made by the leaders past and present.
> >
> > K and the history of TS are intertwined. Many, even long time
> theosophists
> > are not aware of the some of the facts surrounding some of the important
> > incidents that occurred. I did not become aware of the details
> until after
> > I was around TS over 35 years. I think that K's declaration of
> "Truth is a
> > Pathless Land" and his severing of all connections with all
> organizations
> > is the most significant event in the history of TS. It was then that the
> > downward slide of membership started and no one has been able to stop it
> > since then.  Closing of the ES by Annie Besant and its
> reopening is another
> > very significant event, even though "officially" ES has not
> connection with
> > TS. At that time Annie Besant had publically declared that
> almost all the
> > members of the General Council of TS are members of ES. So
> these facts are
> > important in my opinion and thanks to Internet we are able to make
> > theosophists and especially the newbees aware of them.
> >
> > Influence of K on TS and its leadership did not disappear after
> his "Truth
> > is a Pathless Land" declaration and disbanding of Order of the Star of
> > East. CJ was known to have maintained his contact (When he returned to
> > India after WWII, there is a recorded incident of CJ personally
> visiting K
> > and delivering a bunch of Fiction Novels to K.) Sri Ram, the next
> > President, who was Annie Besant's private secretary, had known
> K for a long
> > time and I am sure he did maintain contact with him. In 1960s, when I
> > attended the TS International Convention in Adyar, K was also
> speaking at
> > his place each evening. The TS Convention schedule was arranged so that
> > there was no conflict with K's lecture schedule. All those attending the
> > convention showed up at K's lectures, this included Sri Ram. (It was at
> > that time that I had the first opportunity to hear K.) K's
> influence on TS
> > continued in an indirect way. He had known Radha Burnier since her
> > childhood. It is reported that after John Coats died and the
> International
> > President's election was called, and Rukmini Arundale ( the
> wife of George
> > Arundale and sister of Sri Ram) was planning run for the
> office, it was K
> > who convinced Radha Burnier to run for the office. She did run
> and win the
> > election. So in a way K's influence on TS continues to this day. So K
> > matters of the past, as historical facts are relevant even today, IMHO.
> >
> > In view of the above, no one should be surprised if these historical
> > matters come up in the maillists from time to time.
> >
> > MKR
> >
> > -- THEOSOPHY WORLD -- Theosophical Talk -- theos-talk@theosophy.com
> >
> > Letters to the Editor, and discussion of theosophical ideas and
> > teachings. To subscribe or unsubscribe, send a message consisting of
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>
>
> -- THEOSOPHY WORLD -- Theosophical Talk -- theos-talk@theosophy.com
>
> Letters to the Editor, and discussion of theosophical ideas and
> teachings. To subscribe or unsubscribe, send a message consisting of
> "subscribe" or "unsubscribe" to theos-talk-request@theosophy.com.
>


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