Theos-Talk Archives (April 1999 Message tt00139)

In a message dated 4/13/99 4:54:02 PM, schuelergerald@optec-hq.optec.army.mil 
writes:

><<Otherwise, how does one get past the clutter and 
>"noise" of the mind?  That's where imagination sits. >>
>
>I am sorry that your opinion of the imagination is so
>low, Leon. Imagination is part of buddhi, not manas.

I'm sorry that your usual practice of putting others you disagree with on a 
lower level must be your way of imagining yourself somewhat higher. Or, am I 
imagining your personal innuendoes.:~)   

But, you were the one to speak of imagination as (paraphrased) "pictures of 
clouds flowing through your mind."  Ideas may come directly from buddhi, but 
it takes manas to "image" them and be able to think about them.  I still 
think that while imagination is, as you say, a useful starting tool for 
beginning meditation, it is not a part of or necessary for reaching any 
higher state of consciousness (or should I say, awareness) which is the real 
"goal" of meditation--as you initially implied.  Or, did I misinterpret you 
again?  So, I still ask, how can a yogi "imagine" a higher state of awareness 
that is far above the level of manas, or even buddhi?

Patanjali teaches that imagination or meditation with a seed is only useful 
for practice, before attempting to meditate without a seed.  Since we all are 
different, as you say, I find it much easier to just let the automatic 
thoughts pass by without attention (which is the essence of intentional 
imagination).  So, perhaps, we are really talking about the same things, and 
you just like to argufy in order to hear yourself think.:-).  In future, I'll 
keep that in mind when I read one of your admittedly "wild" assertions, and 
simply answer, "baloney".:-)  Would save a lot of time--although I wouldn't 
avoid answering if I thought it might enlighten or give a kick to some 
theosophical lurkers in this forum.:-)

Leon   


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