Theos-Talk Archives (January 1999 Message tt00297)

Leon,

It would appear that in a message of yours dated 98-12-31 02:51:04 EST, you wrote:

"In response to blafoun@azstarnet.com, Richtay@aol.com and any other nit pickers
of theosophical teachings who babble about Red Hats and Dugpas,while justifying
their nefarious practices, with the lame excuse that they are doing it to defend
HPB from her detractors. . . ."

Leon, please clarify.  Are you trying to suggest that blafoun@azstarnet.com
(that's me) has tried to justified the "nefarious practices" of the Red Hats and
Dugpas?  If this is part of what you are saying in the above sentence, then I ask
you to prove it by quoting chapter and verse from what I have written on
Theos-Talk.

Please, please be careful about lumping everybody together.

Also if I have been babbling "about Red Hats and Dugpas" on Theos-Talk, it was in
order to understand exactly what Madame Blavatsky, the Masters M and KH meant when
they referred to these terms in their various writings.  Is that such an
anti-theosophical study?

Please remember Leon that HPB and her Masters ALSO talk about Buddhism, Red Hats,
Bons, etc. etc.  Therefore why is a discussion of such subjects so off the subject
of Theosophy?

Concerning the subject of "karmamudra", let me just remind you that there are a
number of passages written by Madame Blavatsky that are very relevant to this
subject which apparently you don't want any of us to discuss on Theos-talk.

Also let me repeat what I believe I wrote some time ago on Theos-talk.  You have a
very interesting definition of "karmamudra" which apparently was derived from the
Nyingmapa teacher you have mentioned several times.  But this is NOT the
definition of "karmamudra" as found in various Gelugpa writings, etc.  I have
confirmed this with a number of Blavatsky students who are knowledgeable about
Tibetan matters.

In your latest email to Jerry S., you write:

". . . .you didn't understand the real meaning and usage of the word 'karmamudra'.
. . ."

Although I disagree with many of the opinions of Jerry S., I think that in this
case Jerry understands perfectly well the real meaning of the word karmamudra *as
given by various Gelugpa lamas, etc*.  Maybe certain Nyingmapa lamas understand
the definition differently.  But it is problematic that these latter lamas have
any better understanding of the term.  Personally I am inclined to believe that
the Gelugpa lamas are *literalists* and don't understand the esoteric meaning of
"karmamudra".  I think HPB's "definitions" which I gave in a previous post make
more sense.  Literalism is part of the Kali Yuga, as I see it.

Finally, an understanding of the issues involved with "karmamudra" has helped me
in the last month or so to understand much better what HPB writes in several
places (like in her Esoteric Instructions) on related issues.

So this discussion of karmamudra, Red hats, etc. has helped me to understand more
fully various things said in Madame Blavatsky's writings. Is THAT  such a waste of
time??