Re: stray comments on reincarnation
Oct 23, 1998 02:48 AM
by Dallas TenBroeck
Oct 23rd 1998
Thank you - this is valuable.
May I ask some questions interjected here and there in the text
of your article ?
> From: Eldon B Tucker
> Sent: Thursday, October 22, 1998 9:17 PM
> Subject: stray comments on reincarnation
A number of points regarding the theosophical view of
reincarnation have appeared in the current discussion.
Following is my stray list of ideas -- something quickly
written in the hope of perhaps adding another idea or
two to those now circulating.
* The current method and timing of reincarnation is
specific to the current forms, personalities, and
evolutionary status of humanity.
THE MORAL QUALITY OF OUR LIFE HAS A LOT TO SAY IN REGULATING THE
TIME WE SPEND IN "AFTER-DEATH" STATES. In THE OCEAN OF THEOSOPHY
starting p 99 on to page 116 covers most of the important
statements that Theosophy offers on this period. KARMA rules all
* Being in the Kali Yuga, a time period of intense
happenings, we tend to reincarnate more often, seeking
more frequent rebirth to take advantage of the opportunity
for growth. This increases the apparent world population,
as more people are in body at any one time.
AS WE ARE IMMORTALS THE QUESTION OF TIME HAS ONLY RELEVANCE TO
OUR PRESENT LIVES.
The "after-death" states are "effect-states." The amount of time
spent in them depends on our lives now. If there is a reference
that speaks of accelerated incarnations for the average person I
would be glad to see it.
* In earlier races, humanity was quasi-astral, and had
different methods of reproduction. The same may be
true of distant future races of humanity. How things
currently work is not necessarily indicative of how
things may be.
* Highly advanced humans -- chelas and Mahatmas -- do
not have the same need of devachan and other after-death
states as we do, so their time between births is much
* In the case of accidents, suicide, bad karma resulting
in insane or other problems preventing a normal life,
the after-death states may be greatly shortened, or
* In some cases, an chela may assume the body of a young
child that has just died, and assume that outer personality,
growing up and living a life in that child's body, which
would have otherwise when the child departed it.
THIS IS SAID TO BE RARE - THE ONE CASE WE ARE GIVEN DETAILS ON IS
THAT OF Mr. JUDGE WHO USED A "BORROWED Body" It is a special
case and was done for special reasons which he narrates. The
account is given starting on p. 249 in the ULT edition of LETTERS
THAT HAVE HELPED ME.
* Although Mahatmas may be able to skip devachan between
lifetimes, they still have need of a deep, special time
of quietude, dwelling deep within, as described in THE
THE MAHATMA IS QUITE BEYOND THE NEED FOR DEVACHAN AS HE ADJUSTS
KARMA ALL THE TIME AS HE LIVES AND NEVER TRANSGRESSES THE LAWS OF
KARMA. HE HAS NO NEED FOR "REST" AND "MEDITATION." The
philosophy of theosophy explains this clearly. [ KEY p. 148,
Transaction p. 18, HPB Articles Vol II pp. 199-205, HPB - THE
MYSTERIES OF AFTER LIFE Lucifer January 1889; WQJ Articles Vol.
2 pp. 371-378, REWARD FOR UNMERITED SUFFERINGS, Path March 1891;
and DEVACHAN, Path, September 1890 Ocean pp. 112-3
* There is mention of a ratio of 1-to-100 regarding years
of earth life and the time in the after-death. The number
"100" could refer to many things. One is 10 x 10 states
or classes of other-world experience, each having it's
own sort of "time", disassociated with our normal sense
of the passage of time on this, our Globe D physical earth.
I HAVE NOT COME ACROSS SUCH A RATIO BEING MENTIONED. COULD A
REFERENCE BE GIVEN PLEASE ?
* Our state of awareness, which in embodied existence, is
especially lucid, a rare gift, where in we can achieve
considerable advancement, if we perfect our minds and
spiritual natures. In after-death states, we are in a
subjective state where no new progress, nor karma, is made,
except in the passive sense of working out energies in our
personal natures that were set in motion during embodied life.
* Our exceptional lucidity, which embodied, derives from the
COMPOSITE nature of our being. Different Monads or beings
come together to form the complete human, including a
demigod acting as our Higher Self, a Manasaputra; ourselves
as the essentially-human nature; an animal Monad acting as
our animal/human nature; and yet other parts. In sleep and
in death each part goes to its own realm, with US, the human,
gravitating to devachan; the God going to our parent star;
the Spirit going to its own home; and so forth. We are
MORE THAN OURSELVES, while alive, because of this union
of conscious, with various parts of us drawn from the various
kingdoms. There are many mysteries associated with this.
THIS SOUNDS LIKE A COMPOUND OF A NUMBER OF TEACHINGS. Perhaps
the most complete explanation of this during the sleeping state
is in TRANSACTIONS pp 66 to 76 - where it is shown that the
"embodied mind" (Kama-manas) catches glimpses occasionally of the
indwelling HIGHER SELF - the Manasaputra within.
As I recall the "Parent Star" is referred to in the SD, Vol. 1 p.
* No one makes us come back into incarnation. It's just
something that naturally happens. We are drawn to concrete
existence, to reestablish the lucidity of composite
existence. Our essential nature, a human Monad, a mind-being,
becomes like one atom join several others to form something
bigger than any of them -- a molecule.
* Apart from our physical world, there are associated with
our earth other places where we could possibly exist, being
fully-incarnate, having all seven principles of consciousness
including what corresponds to a physical body, on different
and higher planes. These are called "the globes of the
earth planetary chain," with the physical world as we know
it being one of them.
While this may be true, the essential thing to grasp is that
there is ONE CONSCIOUSNESS. It pierces up and down the seven
planes of being and serves to uphold the memory of all the varied
experiences on the several planes that it contacts. We are that
* Subjective states, like our typical after-death states, are
had in "spheres of effects," located "between" these globes,
which are called "spheres of causes," the places where we
make karma and are fully functional beings. All but the highest
of us are born on this earth, Globe D, have a period of rest
in the following sphere of effects, going through kamaloka
and devachan there, then find ourselves immediately reborn
on Globe D again. The Mahatmas and some chelas may find rebirth
on the other globes.
I AGREE IN GENERAL WITH THIS, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A
REFERENCE TO A STATEMENT MADE THAT THE "Mahatmas and Chelas may
find rebirth of the other globes.
I ask this because Karma demands that all bonds be first
harmonized on any plane or globe before proceeding to others -
that is as I understand it.
... no more time for further stray thoughts ...
,MANY THANKS ELDON. THIS IS VERY HELPFUL - BUT I WOULD LIKE TO
HAVE THOSE REFERENCES IF POSSIBLE.
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