Theos-Talk Archives (April 1998 Message tt00425)

I have not studied Krisnamurti (Kr) as deeply as his followers might. From
what I have studied, his process was meant for interaction with the whole
world. The weakness he saw in traditional training was that individuals in
intensive groups designed for gaining contact with their "higher selves"
(ashrams, etc.) quickly lose whatever heights they attained when out of
such controlled environments. How, then, to maintain such a contact with
the higher selves when you are out working a regular job, talking to
regular folks, watching popular media, etc.? The problem I have with HPB's
statement was that it creates exclusivity. The statement basically states
that individuals who are in environments that helps them maintain contact
with their higher selves will evolve, whereas all others (and many all
others) are in danger of destroying their Antahkarana. This is like the
traditional Christian thought of those who are not Christened are condemned
to be in a nowhere place (I forgot the name for it, not hell but not
heaven).

As soon as I find out who's right, I'll either become a Christian or a
Theosophist. Geesh, we all want to get as close to either heaven or
nirvana as we can, don't we? Of course, in analyzing, it's safer to be a
Christian with or without being a theosophist. You achieve both ends as a
Christian, whereas as a non-Christian theosophist, you'll never reach
heaven.

I find it interesting that future theosophical writers, G. de Purucker,
A.E. Powell, emphasized evil deeds done over several lifetimes as a cause
of disconnection. Perhaps they disagree with HPB's view on this. I'm not
even sure evil deeds would cause a disconnection. I wonder whether evil
has its function in this world, also. If I review instead of "expect",
everything seems to have a place, even evil.

Thoa :o)

Govert:
>Again I like to refer to a quote from HPB. This time I wil try to sumerize
>and paraphrase it and put it against K's view.
>
>HPB: For the mind to contact Atma it has to tread a path or climb a ladder
>on which one first has to go through Buddhi-Manas, which can not be skipped=
.
>If you want to skip it you'll get disconnected, which will lead to second
>death.
>
>K: For the mind to be directed by intelligence it has to get rid of the ego
>by way of a radical inner timeless revolution. There is no path, buddhi nor
>atma, which are all products of thought and tradition and will lead you
>nowhere.
>
>I have no problem with interpreting K in such a way that it will harmonize
>with HPB. For example one could make the point that there is a gradual
>process involved in understanding K, where one goes from intellectual
>understanding to intuitive understanding to transformative understanding to
>a certain illumination and maybe, if one was lucky (or unlucky) like Vimala
>Thakar, K might have initiated you into his realm of enlightenment. K, and
>any purist student of his teachings with him, would deny the possibility of
>this gradual process and denounce such thinking as mind-games of the ego. A
>theosophist might find some appeal in this reasoning and as such he would d=
o
>nothing less than execute a certain esoteric correction of K's teachings,
>which might guarantee the safety of his soul. The soul of a purist followe=
r
>of K would be in greater jeopardy, because he would try to execute K's
>revolution while denying the reality of his Buddhi principle, which would
>cause its disconnection. So, as a theosophist I am very concerned and hope
>that one day K will come back to correct his teachings and balance his Mt.
>Everest of Karma. Meanwhile, instead of a theosophization of Krisnamurti's
>teachings, I see a subtle Krishnamurtization of theosophy happening. And
>with it comes the aforementioned danger to the soul.
>
>Govert
>
>P.S. This is the quote:
>
>H.P.Blavatsky, The Esoteric Writings, pp. 413-414:
>
>=93In order not to confuse the mind of the western student with the abstrus=
e
>difficulties of Indian metaphysics, let him view the lower manas, or mind,
>as the personal ego[personal self] during the waking state, and as
>Antahkarana only during those moments when it aspires towards its higher Eg=
o
>[higher self], and thus becomes the medium of communication between the two=
.
>It is for this reason called the =91Path.=92... Seeing that the faculty an=
d
>function of Antahkarana is as necessary as the medium of the ear for
>hearing, or that of the eye for seeing; then so long as the feeling of
>ahamk=E2ra, that is, of the personal "I" or selfishness, is not entirely
>crushed out in man, and the lower mind not entirely merged into and become
>one with the higher Buddhi-Manas [higher self], it stands to reason that to
>destroy Atahkarana is like destroying a bridge over an impassable chasm; Th=
e
>traveler can never reach the goal on the other shore. And there lies the
>difference between the exoteric and the esoteric teaching. The former make=
s
>the Ved=E2nta state that so long as mind (the lower) clings through
>Antahkarana to Spirit (Buddha-Manas) [higher self] it is impossible for it
>to acquire true Spiritual Wisdom, Jny=E2na, and that this can only be attai=
ned
>by seeking to come en rapport with the Universal Soul (Atm=E2) [the divine
>self]; that, in fact, it is by ignoring the higher Mind [higher self]
>altogether that one reaches R=E2ja Yoga. We say it is not so. No single r=
ung
>of the ladder leading to knowledge can be skipped. No personality can ever
>reach or bring itself into communication with Atm=E2, except through
>Buddhi-Manas; to try to become a Jivanmukta or a Mah=E2tm=E2, before one ha=
s
>become an adept or even a Naljor (a sinless man) is like trying to reach to
>Ceylon from India without crossing the sea. Therefore we are told that if
>we destroy Antahkarana before the personal [personal self] is absolutely
>under the control of the impersonal Ego [the higher self], we risk to lose
>the latter and be severed for ever from it, unless indeed we hasten to
>re-establish the communication by a supreme and final effort. It is only
>when we are indissolubly linked with the essence of the divine Mind [higher
>self] that we have to destroy Antahkarana.=94