Re: theos-talk the coming of the torch-bearer of truth.....
Jan 14, 2012 11:22 AM
by M. Sufilight
Dear John and friends
My views are:
I see.
We obvoiusly disagree about various things. I do not mind that. We might learn from each other despite this....Do you not think so?
But let us seek to keep the focus...
I think we can agree upon that the Theosophical Society was not a Masonry organisation - from the begining in 1875 - not in any - ordinary - known sense of the word - when we compare it to modern Fremasonry or any kind of Western Masonry. Or do you think something else?
That was my main point with my previous post or email.
If you disagree on this, it is of course your choice. I will then eagerly like to know where - precisely - the documentation are for such a claim?
I think I have shown it to be something else in my previous post.
I have seen your links - but do not have time to read them all at the moment.
M. Sufilight
----- Original Message -----
From: Augoeides-222@18PJt5toFJOqowUQrT63qCQbwCFfDETLC_WWnWzmCiuJ211OH0iXQwW2VvmxZ8hXaYUnM9SPS6RfPT5FNR8TWOt5.yahoo.invalid
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2012 5:36 PM
Subject: Re: theos-talk the coming of the torch-bearer of truth.....
Morten,
I posted information you can accept or reject as you preferr. Morten I don't accept the position about hte Jesuits as the original culprits behind the "33" degree's of the Masons which you regard as origin of the "33". The Buddhists have 33 Heavens. The Tripitaka Masters of the Mahayana Ch'an wear the 33 partitioned robe which indictated the attainment level of the Trip[ataka Masters. The entry level Monk wear a robe having 1 partition. There are other ancient "33" correlates found in comparitive studies ;ilke the 33 Aeons of Valentinus and early Gnostic/Christian Bishop whose break away Gnoctic Sect threatened to overwhelm by membership the early Catholic Church. Read G. R. S. Mead's Fragments of a Faith Forgotten. John Dee who served the Crown of Britain also had his own version of 33 Aeons he used associated with invocations of denizens of the universe. I also reject your assumption about Jo shua ben Pandera being factual, Mead reads it otherwise in his "Did Jesus live 100 B.C.?". you use the viscious story used by both the Roma ns and Jews as a me ans to devalue and mock and ridicule the Jesus legend for thei r own purposes of self preservation. You use it for mean reasons of your own. My personal view is radical to many of the views. My view places a good deal more importance to the ancient M andaeans of Iraq, John th e Baptist (Brother of J esus) was the E lder of the Mandaeans, The T ita l of the M andaean Elder was "Nazi". The Mandaeans were the "Nazareans", Jesus was a Nazarean ie, a M andaean. Why? Becau se no city named Nazareth existed then at the time of the life time of Jesus in the place the biblical story pla ces it so he could not have lived there or be born there becau se it didn't exist at the time he lived. But the Templars told of the mysterious "Prester John" whom they received their secret doctrine from, it was the secret teaching of the M andaean. Jesus was bap tised at the Jordan River by John the Baptist. The mandaeans in the cold winter of iraq traveled to the Jordan for warmer temperatures, Jesus went to his Bother John , the E lder of the M andaeans to receive Initiation of the baptism of W ater, there being 4 spiritual viscosity or densities which also align to the acient traditions everywhere. W ater, Wine , Blood and Oil, so J esus in the biblical construct changes W ater into Wine, sh eds his Blood and is the Anointed One as initiate. Also there is an ancie nt connection thread going back to before the 1st Dynastys of Egypt focusing about Adams son Seth that travels into the Mandaeans also.
The 33 heavens of the Gods - Trayastrimsas
>>>http://www.tientai.net/teachings/dharma/6realms/33gods.htm<<<
The Realm of Heaven Map
>>>http://www.tientai.net/teachings/dharma/6realms/heavenmap.htm<<<
Vedic Gods and Goddesses
>>>http://www.hinduwebsite.com/hinduism/vedicgods.asp<<<
Mandaean History --- In the name of the Great Life
>>>http://mandaean_canadians.webs.com/mandaeanhistory.htm<<<
The Heavenly Twin in the mandaean Gnosis
>>>http://weblog.bergersen.net/terje/archives/001127.html<<<
The Man of Light in the Iranian Sufism
>>> http://books.google.com/books?id=JE89AAAAIAAJ&pg=PA33&lpg=PA33&dq=mshunia+kushta&source=web&ots=cPMtYL4mn7&sig=KcI-02RdVWIGnR8MSWKjjxkYP3w&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=5&ct=result
The Secret Adam -- A study of Nazoraean Gnosis
>>>http://weblog.bergersen.net/terje/archives/001053.html<<<
Lady Ethel Stefana Drower The Principal Author on the Mandaeans (who was very much like H. P. B. in many ways)
>>>http://books.google.com/books?q=Lady+Ethel+Stefana+Drower&btnG=Search+Books<<<
On the Jain - The Kalpa Sutra and Nava Tattva (the Pre-buddhist Bodhists)
>>>http://books.google.com/books?id=yaJtAAAAIAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=kalpa+sutra&hl=en&sa=X&ei=T4IQT-njA6KkiQK-3-XPDQ&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=kalpa%20sutra&f=false<<<
Regards,
John
----- Original Message -----
From: "M. Sufilight" <global-theosophy@9jTmPa-UkE_olUk5RCsJbC9apfHwdvNOVhMw1raZxAGAjT_P1OBSxlSAJPU5FMvUCW6qiY-k9mDdz1ZOT9O03enr.yahoo.invalid>
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2012 2:55:42 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk the coming of the torch-bearer of truth.....
Dear John and friends
My views are:
Yes. I also appreciate the effort by Daniel and others on his website, although I sometimes question myself where the aim with that website actually is compared to what Blavatsky herself taught - with regard to altruism and all that....smile.
A few questions araise in my mind.
If I may...?
John wrote:
"The three objects that Morten assigns exclusively to Theosophy actually were pick me ups from the Masonic Dogma and can be forund in Morals and dogma, I oten wondered why none have pointed that out for over 11 yars that I have been sitting here reading lol."
M. Sufilight says:
May I ask, what objects are you referring to? If, it is the Objects of the Consitution and Rules of the Theosophical Society - then I ask from what year do they originate in the TS?
And what Masonic dogma are you referring to - there are many branches of Masonry, you know - on what page in "Morals and dogma", I did not find anything about comparative studying with emphasis on Eastern Literature there?
The Theosophical Society was clearly not founded as a Masonry organisation with 33 grades hatched from the Jesuit College at Clermont in Paris and incorporated by Chevalier Ramsey and others - this must be a fact which aught to be stated, when you write what you do in your post, John. I mean in all fairness...All right?
M. Sufilight
----- Original Message -----
From: Augoeides-222@18PJt5toFJOqowUQrT63qCQbwCFfDETLC_WWnWzmCiuJ211OH0iXQwW2VvmxZ8hXaYUnM9SPS6RfPT5FNR8TWOt5.yahoo.invalid
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2012 5:23 AM
Subject: Re: theos-talk the coming of the torch-bearer of truth.....
Daniel,"
Thx, for all you do and your organized compilations. Just an aside, in your listings of later day personages you mention a "Brother Phillip" author of "Secret of the Andes". Brother Phillip was the nome de plume of Geo rge H unt Williamson ( also wnet by the name Micheal de Obronevic of the Romanoffs) who made expeditions to south America and the Marca Hausi Plateau. He also wrote :
Secret Places of the Lion
The Saucers Speak
Other Tongues --- Other Flesh
UFO's Confidental
He disappeared for many years and later turned up in Santa Barbara Ca. Associated with The Pacific Holistic Institute and was engaged in research upon the Glastonbury Zodiac, he passed away in the later 1980's. He was accussed of being member to the Silver Shirts Sect.
Also Morten made mention of the swastica and jewish seal on the John King portrait. The swastica antedates hitler by a few thousands of years particular to the Buddhists and the pre-Buddhists Jina Bodhists. The Jewish seal was also long recognized as the Seal of the Hindu Vishnu. L Ron Hubbard reorganized it by inverting the lower triad so that both triangles pointed upward indicating ascent by re-intregation of Affinity, Reality, Communication and Be(ing) ,Do(ing), Have(ing) ,thereby morphing an ancient symbol into a new modern statement of achievement possible for mankind.
The three objects that Morten assigns exclusively to Theosophy actually were pick me ups from the Masonic Dogma and can be forund in Morals and dogma, I oten wondered why none have pointed that out for over 11 yars that I have been sitting here reading lol.
beat regards to all, happy new year.
PS: my old 8th grade science teacher told to always remember this "I will never become overwrought about conditions which are beyond my control".
John
----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniel" < danielhcaldwell@gguyrut1btp2iqBBpNRBawY4-O3ptrb0jwnQvAqtMNp446Ltw92u2mE1Fl_Z6oW3Nb6hAlKfJGTQa2sR-rxc7_WNaIc.yahoo.invalid >
To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, January 13, 2012 6:16:23 PM
Subject: theos-talk the coming of the torch-bearer of truth.....
If HPB can be considered a teacher, the messenger of the masters, the torch-bearer of the truth for the 19th century, then surely one can be open to the idea expressed in 3 different statements given by HPB. In the following link in the section on Alice Bailey, the reader will find those 3 quotes by HPB:
http://blavatskyarchives.com/latermessengers.htm#five
I would suggest that all three of these have to be carefully read and then one can ask how is all of this to be considered in light of the morass of claims and counter claims given out by all the individuals listed at the following link:
http://blavatskyarchives.com/moderntheosophy.htm#Endnote
and also what was the occult status of HPB?
see the 4 quotes from the Mahatmas given in the 1st section of the following paper:
http://blavatskyarchives.com/latermessengers.htm#1
Daniel
http://hpb.cc
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