Theos-Talk Archives (June 2011 Message tt00162)

The Mayan calendar details an unprecedented alignment of planets in Dec 2012. ÂIf there is to be a pole shift this would be the result of sun and planetary movements, which would have an impact on weather patterns on the earth. ÂThis has nothing to do with horoscopes.
What I am calling Astronomy Blavatsky would have called ancient astrology, and this is where the confusion is coming in.
http://www.blavatsky.net/newsletters/astrology.htm

Extracts only
ANCIENT civilization saw nothing absurd in the claims of astrology, no more than many an educated and thoroughly scientific man sees in it today. Judicial astrology, by which the fate and acts of men and nations might be foreknown, [hardly] appeared, nor does it even now appear, any more unphilosophical or unscientific than does natural astrology or astronomy-by which the events of so-called brute and inanimate nature (changes of weather, &c.), might be predicted. For it was not even prophetic insight that was claimed by the votaries of that abstruse and really grand science, but simply a great proficiency in that method of procedure which allows the astrologer to foresee certain events in the life of a man by the position of the planets at the time of his birth. (Stars and Numbers)
>Primitive Astrology was as far above modern judiciary Astrology, so-called, as the guides (the Planets and Zodiacal signs) are above the lamp-posts. (Astrology and Astrolatry)
>THE STUDY OF INITIATES
>For Blavatsky, the knowledge of astrology refers to much more the term generally means today. It is part of the knowledge of the initiates of old.
>The books of Hermes Trismegistus contain the exoteric meaning, still veiled for all but the Occultist, of the Astrology and Astrolatry of the Khaldi. The two subjects are closely connected. Astrolatry, or the adoration of the heavenly host, is the natural result of only half-revealed Astrology, whose Adepts carefully concealed from the noninitiated masses its Occult principles and the wisdom imparted to them by the Regents of the Planets-the "Angels." Hence, divine Astrology for the Initiates; superstitious Astrolatry for the profane. St. Justin asserts it:
>>>From the first invention of the hieroglyphics it was not the vulgar, but the distinguished and select men who became initiated in the secrecy of the temples into the science of every kind of Astrology - even into its most abject kind: that Astrology which later on found itself prostituted in the public thoroughfares.There was a vast difference between the Sacred Science taught by Petosiris and Necepso - the first Astrologers mentioned in the Egyptian manuscripts, believed to have lived during the reign of Ramses II (Sesostris) - and the miserable charlatanry of the quacks called Chaldaeans, who degraded the Divine Knowledge under the last Emperors of Rome. Indeed, one may fairly describe the two as the "high ceremonial Astrology" and "astrological Astrolatry." The first depended on the knowledge by the Initiates of those (to us) immaterial Forces or Spiritual Entities that affect matter and guide it. Called by the ancient Philosophers the Archontes and
 the Cosmocratores, they were the types or paradigms on the higher planes of the lower and more material beings on the scale of evolution, whom we call Elementals and Nature-Spirits, to whom the Sabaeans bowed and whom they worshipped, without suspecting the essential difference. Hence the latter kind when not a mere pretence, degenerated but too often into Black Magic. It was the favorite form of popular or exoteric Astrology, entirely ignorant of the apotelesmatic principles of the primitive Science, the doctrines of which were imparted only at Initiation. Thus, while the real Hierophants soared like Demi-Gods to the very summit of spiritual knowledge, the hoi polloi among the Sabaeans crouched, steeped in superstition - ten millenniums back, as they do now - in the cold and lethal shadow of the valleys of matter. Sidereal influence is dual. There is the physical and physiological influence, that of exotericism; and the high spiritual, intellectual,
 and moral influence, imparted by the knowledge of the planetary Gods.
>One of the distinctive astrological assertions of Blavatsky is that the stars do not "cause" events. Rather they only "indicate" them. Here is one of her most extensive explanations of that distinction.
>>The Egyptian episcope ("overseer"; our English word "episcopal" is derived from the name of this ancient pagan stargazer) discovered that in the morning, shortly before sunrise, in June, he could see in the east the brightest fixed star in the heavens, and immediately after thus seeing the star the Nile would overflow. Having witnessed the phenomenon for many successive years, he laid it down as an axiom that this star indicated the overflow of the Nile, no one thinking of disputing him; for the cause should be traced to the melting of the snow in the mountains of Africa. Now, suppose someone - a sceptic - had heard of this idea of a star causing the Nile to overflow, what an opportunity it would have afforded for heaping scorn and ridicule upon the poor episcope! Yet the episcope would have continued to observe the same phenomena year after year; and being called "moon-struck," a "fool," etc., would not have changed his opinion in the least. Now all
 the hubbub on this point would arise from ignorance on the part of the sceptic just as nine-tenths of all the disputes and quarrels arise. Teach the man that the appearance of that star at a particular time and place in the heavens indicated, not caused the overflow of the Nile, and he would have ceased to call the episcope an idiot and liar.
>>>The intelligent reader must now see the point at which we aim - namely, that in astrology the stars do not cause our good or bad luck, but simply indicate the same. A man must be a psychologist and a philosopher before he can become a perfect astrologer, and understand correctly the great Law of Universal Sympathy. Not only astrology but magnetism, theosophy and every occult science, especially that of attraction and repulsion, depend upon this law for their existence. Without having thoroughly studied the latter, astrology becomes a superstition. (BCW vol iii)



>________________________________
>From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@Fv25fjAyufbkkQBuMrTzdVhSzF8hxPhQCO3nwM2bXSlG0PoDgSVgytxQt7MM2jewyFFivEqDCCEHUUjwAMe7pjqknMk-lg.yahoo.invalid>
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>Sent: Thursday, 30 June 2011 4:47 PM
>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>
>
>Â 
>Dear Cass and friends
>
>My views are:
>
>Perhaps. But in the previous post you wrote:
>
>"----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Cass Silva 
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
>Sent: Monday, June 27, 2011 2:03 AM
>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>
>If you guys aren't aware of the disturbing and changing weather patterns that are occuring at the moment you must be residing in Plato's cave. Things are changing, Blavatsky was right, Japan, as she predicted, would be under water. Whether it is coincidence that these events are occuring as we approach the Mayan 2012 calendar or if this is another minor cycle we can only guess at, but what cannot be disregarded is the fact that mother nature is addressing an imbalance."
>
>M. Sufilight says:
>Now you tell me, that you are only referring to astronomy and not astrology in the above?
>The above from you might be viewed as astronomy - but it is as I read it clearly Astrological in content.
>
>I am aware of that you later in the next posts were referring to astronomy, but I also dealt with that in my posts to you.
>When I am not rejecting the science of Astrology, I will of course not reject the science on Astronomy.
>
>But let is just talk about astronomy while we talk about predicting events like 2012 and full-moon events, if that is better to you. Okay?
>
>- - -
>Cass wrote:
>"Perhaps you should ask yourself why did the Egyptians and why did the Mayans place so much energy into mapping the stars?"
>
>M. Sufilight says:
>Becase they knew about astronomy and astrology to a certain extend. I will refer to my previous e-mail. Because it seem to me that you did not read it carefully enough.
>
>The big question to me is why you seem to reject the Law of Karma, while you talk about the influences the stars have on humanity?
>Are you rejecting that the Law of Karma is closely related to astronomical influences from the Stars, and generate a psychological impact in humans, and thereby is related to Astrology?
>
>M. Sufilight
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: Cass Silva 
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
>Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 2:23 AM
>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>
>Morten,
>I am not talking about Astrology I am talking about Astronomy.  The stars and planets effect us on a daily basis, their alignments bring about certain events in the world, all of which we are not as yet sure about.  Certainly data is available to suggest that full moon events increase crime rates.   Events in the stars present opportune times for the particular staging of world events.  Perhaps you should ask yourself why did the Egyptians and why did the Mayans place so much energy into mapping the stars?
>
>Cass
>
>>________________________________
>>From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@Fv25fjAyufbkkQBuMrTzdVhSzF8hxPhQCO3nwM2bXSlG0PoDgSVgytxQt7MM2jewyFFivEqDCCEHUUjwAMe7pjqknMk-lg.yahoo.invalid>
>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>>Sent: Wednesday, 29 June 2011 4:55 PM
>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>
>>
>> 
>>Dear Cass and friends
>>
>>My views are:
>>
>>I think you misunderstood my questions, because I did not explain enough.
>>
>>Again ask yourself the following question:
>>Why should any particular moment in the whole Universe be of more importance than another?
>>
>>And then consider the esoteric role you would like Astrology to have.
>>
>>I am not rejecting the science of astrology. I am merely saying that most soothsayers and astrologists are mistaken. And because many are saying that 2012 is important, it most likely is not in the sense they say it is. We have experienced this many times, and I sought to show this in the links I gave in one of the previous posts in this thread.
>>
>>What we are dealing with here is in a sense the old parable by Aesop: "The Wolf is coming". And it did not, and the boy laughed at the villagers. But then it suddenly came.
>>And nobody laughed.
>>
>>So sometimes we all might get "lucky". But why waste time on something like that?
>>
>>To actually know, and to be wise as a true Astrological Mage, and be able to read the signs among the stars and the karmic patterns is a good thing. But to go and claim that this can be done without any knowledge about the karmic patterns is a stupid and foolish attempt upon the law of karma and humanity. There is no true Astrological knowledge without the ability to read karmic patterns - of the incarnations of humanity.
>>And since most Astrologers are not dealing with this but with - Dead-Letter - interpretations, more or less, -- of anicent stone-carvings they are bound to fail.
>>
>>And no wise Astrologer invent and install fear in peoples minds, if this is not what they spiritually need - even - if they claim that this is what they want.
>>
>>Why invent and install fear in people, which is not already there?
>>
>>Now is the time. Not tomorrow, not next year, but right now, and always now. Past, present and future is experienced in the now, in the present moment.
>>
>>So Compassion is to tell people what is needed spiritually, in a given moment in time, and not always what we could tell them, even if it might be the truth.
>>
>>Let me reformulate and ask:
>>Why, do you think, that we not are experiencing that the Masters come and tell everyone what will happen the next hundred years, down to the dot?
>>Why did they not inform us all about terrorist events and various invasions, and environment disasters?
>>
>>Because, there is something called the Law of Karma.
>>
>>I do hope that this helped.
>>
>>M. Sufilight
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: Cass Silva 
>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
>>Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 3:26 AM
>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>
>>We could start with the Pyramids, Stonehenge, etc.
>>Cass
>>
>>>________________________________
>>>From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@Fv25fjAyufbkkQBuMrTzdVhSzF8hxPhQCO3nwM2bXSlG0PoDgSVgytxQt7MM2jewyFFivEqDCCEHUUjwAMe7pjqknMk-lg.yahoo.invalid>
>>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>>>Sent: Tuesday, 28 June 2011 3:52 PM
>>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>Dear Cass and friends
>>>
>>>My views are:
>>>
>>>I will ask...:
>>>What kind of ancient astronomy are you referring to?
>>>And what value aught it to be given and why?
>>>
>>>M. Sufilight
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: Cass Silva 
>>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
>>>Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 3:31 AM
>>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>
>>>You are discounting ancient astronomy which was used to predict events.
>>>Cass
>>>
>>>>________________________________
>>>>From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@Fv25fjAyufbkkQBuMrTzdVhSzF8hxPhQCO3nwM2bXSlG0PoDgSVgytxQt7MM2jewyFFivEqDCCEHUUjwAMe7pjqknMk-lg.yahoo.invalid>
>>>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>>>>Sent: Monday, 27 June 2011 5:21 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>>Dear Cass and friends
>>>>
>>>>My views are:
>>>>
>>>>Try this...and scroll down to year 1914 (Jehovahâs Witnesses), 1953 (David Davidson), 1982 (even NASA predicts), 1987 (Harmonic Convergence), 1996 (Sheldon Nidle) or so.
>>>>
>>>>Prediction Addiction Versus Prophecy: False Apocalyptic Dates
>>>>http://appleofgodseye.wordpress.com/2009/03/26/prediction-addiction-versus-prophecy-false-apocalyptic-dates/
>>>>
>>>>Library of Date Setters of
>>>>The End of the World!!!
>>>>Over 200 predictions and counting!
>>>>http://www.bible.ca/pre-date-setters.htm
>>>>
>>>>Also but not mentioned in the above:
>>>>Giant Rock with George Van Tassel and the Ashtar Command, and also Yvonne Cole
>>>>"The Giant Rock Spacecraft Convention "
>>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Van_Tassel
>>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashtar_%28extraterrestrial_being%29
>>>>
>>>>The above links are in various respects the origin to the present day 2012 myths.
>>>>People discovered that money could be earned and fame gained by pulling a stunt like this.
>>>>
>>>>My views are:
>>>>To spend a huge amount of time on something like a prophecy - about what is called - "special events", is a waste of spiritual time. When you know, you know. When you make poems you make poems. When you seek to sell books, you seek to sell books. When you seek to earn money by this, you seek to earn money by it. When you seek fame or power by this, you seek fame or power by it. 
>>>>
>>>>Yet some persons on this planet are like our wellknown Fox Mulder with his poster saying: "I Want to Believe!"
>>>>http://www.whispermag.co.uk/siteimage/scale/0/0/28994.gif
>>>>
>>>>Smile.
>>>>
>>>>Just because a great number of persons buy the Christian Bible, it does not imply that the Bible primarily is good and healty for people to read. Does it?
>>>>And just because most books (or almost) among the New Age groups these days have nervous break-down about the year 2012, it does not imply that they are right, does it?
>>>>
>>>>Ask yourself the following question:
>>>>Why should any particular moment in the whole Universe be of more importance than another?
>>>>
>>>>I suggest that the 2012 prophets, Think carefully about this question.
>>>>
>>>>When you seek to - primarily - make people believe and not know, you seek to do just that. And I am one of those who will not bargin about this.
>>>>I seek to help people to actually know based on actual facts, and, not through pseudo-scientific observations producing fear in peoples minds.
>>>>
>>>>Just a few views of mine.
>>>>
>>>>M. Sufilight
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: Cass Silva 
>>>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
>>>>Sent: Monday, June 27, 2011 2:03 AM
>>>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>>
>>>>If you guys aren't aware of the disturbing and changing weather patterns that are occuring at the moment you must be residing in Plato's cave. Things are changing, Blavatsky was right, Japan, as she predicted, would be under water. Whether it is coincidence that these events are occuring as we approach the Mayan 2012 calendar or if this is another minor cycle we can only guess at, but what cannot be disregarded is the fact that mother nature is addressing an imbalance.
>>>>
>>>>Cass
>>>>
>>>>>________________________________
>>>>>From: M. Sufilight <global-theosophy@Fv25fjAyufbkkQBuMrTzdVhSzF8hxPhQCO3nwM2bXSlG0PoDgSVgytxQt7MM2jewyFFivEqDCCEHUUjwAMe7pjqknMk-lg.yahoo.invalid>
>>>>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>>>>>Sent: Sunday, 26 June 2011 12:24 AM
>>>>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>>A view:
>>>>>Too little emphasis on the difference between Mind Control, secterian and non-secterian, as well as dogmatic versus non-docmatic --- and the actual difference between those terms as given in various dictionaries, wikipedia, and the ignorance about those terms and their actual differences among New Age seekers and even theosophical seekers.
>>>>>
>>>>>One could suggest that the purely scientific theories and hypothesises given by Tavistock Clinic (and similar) and the theories on "Flooding" (Pavlov's dogs) and the Manchurian Candidate, hypnosis theories (as given today), and also Mind Control (subtle persuasion techniques used by Leaders in Sects) could be compared with theosophical views and teachings on the same.
>>>>>
>>>>>M. Sufilight
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: Drpsionic@o0JUKPMWCkWXdBn3FCHfI2V50tH6Chx-rGGh1qZHejZR7j7oKs4slWgEGbIEGX8S7cHSWeG7nN-nCjE.yahoo.invalid 
>>>>>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
>>>>>Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 5:14 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: theos-talk Fw: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>>>
>>>>>Balderdash and flapdoodle!
>>>>>
>>>>>Chuck the Heretic
>>>>>
>>>>>In a message dated 6/23/2011 8:42:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
>>>>>silva_cass@Q8EME8mfXhw8i0Gt6F5GObDDU9uSXtPQj6XczvcyxVgHsvCimAkwqzVsW0l1Q16SXvOACUTr0NA1Fy-dV28.yahoo.invalid writes:
>>>>>
>>>>>Any comments?
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Forwarded Message -----
>>>>>>From: GT Eleven <_GT11@BH1NXXVWBA956UDzwniFIi3YqXPC2hPlmRM-r8BIoQPV6-4jQ_xnxGKzV7fGbItxSUuAprDtZzc.yahoo.invalid_ (mailto:GT11@-26FHQTSL6PfZKYDQT1tJ1oJuk8f9Sx7k3Z2qrLXFYH45wKP4_2Sw029mH-hDw5aQZ6zB5XCSA.yahoo.invalid) >
>>>>>>To: _cosmiccookies@yahoogroups.com_ (mailto:cosmiccookies@yahoogroups.com) 
>>>>>>Sent: Friday, 24 June 2011 12:13 AM
>>>>>>Subject: [CosmicCookies] 110623
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cookie Break...
>>>>>>Cosmic Cookie
>>>>>>228
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The Solar System and her Earth
>>>>>>are rapidly approaching
>>>>>>the End of a great Cosmic Cycle.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The Matter oriented Human Race
>>>>>>will terminate its Third Density Existence
>>>>>>and a New Race of Mankind will prevail.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The New Age Man and Woman
>>>>>>will be detached from Material Possessions
>>>>>>and will be involved
>>>>>>in nurturing and living at peace with the Earth
>>>>>>after a possible Pole Shift.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>New Land masses would arise
>>>>>>and existing ones will disappear.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Mankind on Earth will meet their Sky Brothers
>>>>>>of which not all are Friendly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Some will arrive and try to dominate the World of Man.
>>>>>>The present New World Order is preparing their arrival.
>>>>>>Mother Earth will be a Fourth/Fifth Density Planet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>THIRD DENSITY PEOPLE WILL INCARNATE ELSEWHERE
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cosmic Cookies are loved world-wide since 1996/12/01
>>>>>>You may share them with any List or Party.
>>>>>>_http://www.soulwise.net_ (http://www.soulwise.net/) 
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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