Theos-Talk Archives (January 2011 Message tt00170)

Thanks.
That in fact helped me.


I will allow my self throw a few quotes and a comment to your words MKR with the hope that some readers might be helped by it. (Let us keep the diagrams by Blavatsky and Master KH in mind.)


Blavatsky wrote bout the Great Breath:
"   The appearance and disappearance of the Universe are pictured as an outbreathing and inbreathing of "the Great Breath," which is eternal, and which, being Motion, is one of the three aspects of the Absolute â Abstract Space and Duration being the other two. When the "Great Breath" is projected, it is called the Divine Breath, and is regarded as the breathing of the Unknowable Deity â the One Existence â which breathes out a thought, as it were, which becomes the Kosmos. (See "Isis Unveiled.") So also is it when the Divine Breath is inspired again the Universe disappears into the bosom of "the Great Mother," who then sleeps "wrapped in her invisible robes."

 (c) By "that which is and yet is not" is meant the Great Breath itself, which we can only speak of as absolute existence, but cannot picture to our imagination as any form of existence that we can distinguish from Non-existence. The three periods â the Present, the Past, and the Future â are in the esoteric philosophy a compound time; for the three are a composite number only in relation to the phenomenal plane, but in the realm of noumena have no abstract validity. As said in the Scriptures: "The Past time is the Present time, as also the Future, which, though it has not come into existence, still is"; according to a precept in the Prasanga Madhyamika teaching, whose dogmas have been known ever since it broke away from the purely esoteric schools.* Our ideas, in short, on duration and time are all derived from our"
.......
"sensations according to the laws of Association. Inextricably bound up with the relativity of human knowledge, they nevertheless can have no existence except in the experience of the individual ego, and perish when its evolutionary march dispels the Maya of phenomenal existence. What is Time, for instance, but the panoramic succession of our states of consciousness? In the words of a Master, "I feel irritated at having to use these three clumsy words â Past, Present, and Future â miserable concepts of the objective phases of the subjective whole, they are about as ill-adapted for the purpose as an axe for fine carving." One has to acquire ParamÃrtha lest one should become too easy a prey to Samvritiâis a philosophical axiom.*"
.......
"* In clearer words: "One has to acquire true Self-Consciousness in order to understand Samvriti, or the 'origin of delusion.'" ParamÃrtha is the synonym of the Sanskrit term Svasam-vedana, or "the reflection which analyses itself." There is a difference in the interpretation of the meaning of "ParamÃrtha" between the YogÃchÃryas and the Madhyamikas, neither of whom, however, explain the real and true esoteric sense of the expression. See further, sloka No. 9."
(The Secret Doctrine vol. I. p. 43)


And Blavatsky called the "Great Mother" for Mulaprakriti:
" Thus, the "Robes" stand for the noumenon of undifferentiated Cosmic Matter. It is not matter as we know it, but the spiritual essence of matter, and is co-eternal and even one with Space in its abstract sense. Root-nature is also the source of the subtile invisible properties in visible matter. It is the Soul, so to say, of the ONE infinite Spirit. The Hindus call it Mulaprakriti, and say that it is the primordial substance, which is the basis of the Upadhi or vehicle of every phenomenon, whether physical, mental or psychic. It is the source from which AkÃsa radiates."
(The Secret Doctrine vol. I. p. 35)

Blavatsky wrote on Time and duration:
"Time is only an illusion produced by the succession of our states of consciousness as we travel through eternal duration, and it does not exist where no consciousness exists in which the illusion can be produced; but "lies asleep." The present is only a mathematical line which divides that part of eternal duration which we call the future, from that part which we call the past. Nothing on earth has real duration, for nothing remains without change â or the same â for the billionth part of a second; and the sensation we have of the actuality of the division of "time" known as the present, comes from the blurring of that momentary glimpse, or succession of glimpses, of things that our senses give us, as those things pass from the region of ideals which we call the future, to the region of memories that we name the past. In the same way we experience a sensation of duration in the case of the instantaneous electric spark, by reason of the blurred and continuing impression on the retina. The real person or thing does not consist solely of what is seen at any particular moment, but is composed of the sum of all its various and changing conditions from its appearance in the material form to its disappearance from the earth. It is these "sum-totals" that exist from eternity in the "future," and pass by degrees through matter, to exist for eternity in the "past." No one could say that a bar of metal dropped into the sea came into existence as it left the air, and ceased to exist as it entered the water, and that the bar itself consisted only of that cross-section thereof which at any given moment coincided with the mathematical plane that separates, and, at the same time, joins, the atmosphere and the ocean. Even so of persons and things, which, dropping out of the to-be into the has-been, out of the future into the past â present momentarily to our senses a cross-section, as it were, of their total selves, as they pass through time and space (as matter) on their way from one eternity to another: and these two constitute that "duration" in which alone anything has true existence, were our senses but able to cognize it there."


Blavatsky wrote:
"Bear in mind that Fohat, the constructive Force of Cosmic Electricity, is said, metaphorically, to have sprung like Rudra from Brahmà "from the brain of the Father and the bosom of the Mother," and then to have metamorphosed himself into a male and a female, i.e., polarity, into positive and negative electricity."
(The Secret Doctrine vol. I. p. 145)


Blavatsky wrote:
"That is outside the province of legitimate speculation. Parabrahm is not a cause, neither is there any cause that can compel it to emanate or create. Strictly speaking, Parabrahm is not even the Absolute but Absoluteness. Parabrahm is not the cause, but the causality, or the propelling but not volitional power, in every manifesting Cause. We may have some hazy idea that there is such a thing as this eternal Causeless Cause or Causality. But to define it is impossible. In the "Lectures on the Bhagavat GÃta," by Mr. Subba Row, it is stated that logically even the First Logos cannot cognize Parabrahm, but only Mulaprakriti, its veil. When, therefore, we have yet no clear idea of Mulaprakriti, the first basic aspect of Parabrahm, what can we know of that Supreme Total which is veiled by Mulaprakriti (the root of nature or Prakriti) even to the Logos? "
http://www.phx-ult-lodge.org/Transactions.htm



M. Sufilight says:
My views is thereofre, that Fohat as the Light of the Unmanifested Logos, the reflection so to speak from Mulaprakriti, and the link between them. It is the Greath Breath (and therefore Sound it self) and its "Light", but also self-existence, - ie. "duration" as such beyond time and change - Yet, parabrahm is neither existence, nor non-existence, and yet both. And Fohat runs through all the lower planes as the electric essence and vitalisze them as LIFE, Occult Visdom, intelligence, heartflow, and kundalini fire etc. etc. - Yet All is in All.  But I cannot call Parabhram (viewed by Logos and even humans as Parabrahm + Mulaprakriti) by the name Fohat, because Parabrahm is without attributes (As HPB wrote: "For, as the lecturer premised by saying, Parabraham is not this or that, it is not even consciousness, as it cannot be related to matter or anything conditioned. It is not Ego nor is it Non-ego, not even Atma, but verily the one source of all manifestations and modes of existence.", SD, vol. I, p. 130) . - Those who go to that most highest unmanifested abode called Parabrahm - where no change and no time is; - beyond thought, they never return (they reach full precognition - they do not act or "act", ie. no-one beyond time act in their essence,  - and are karmically liberated) as it is said in several versions of the Bhagavad Gita.

_________


TWO IMPORTANT DIAGRAMS on HPB's Dzyan Stanzas teachings:

Se the overview Diagrams by H. P. Blavatsky and Master K.H. here.
Master KH's diagram should be connected with Blavatsky at the "Unmanifested Logos".
( Have a look at the two IMPORTANT diagrams in the links provided here:
Master KH's diagram: http://www.blavatskyarchives.com/images/est2.jpg
HPB's diagram p. 524:
http://www.katinkahesselink.net/blavatsky/articles/v12/y1890_053.htm )

These diagrams might be helpful to understand the Secret Doctrine more easily.


All the above are however as always just my views...




M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: MKR 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, January 17, 2011 4:42 PM
  Subject: Re: theos-talk Re: FOHAT


    
  Here is what I found in the SD Commentaries which was published last year
  and I am hoping that the copyright holders will make it available for free
  to theosophists soon. (Let us all pray, meditate or whatever???)

  âMme. Blavatsky: You call it Sabbath, it is no fault of mine. Well, then, we
  will go on. Moreover, you have to learn. the etymology of the word Fohat.
  There is where it becomes difficult to understand. It is a Turanian compound
  word. "Pho" is the word. "Pho" was once and is derived from the Sanskrit
  "bhu," meaning existence, or rather the essence of existence. Now,
  "Swayambhu" is Brahma and man at the same time. "Swayambhu" means
  self-existence and self-existing; it means also Manvantara. It means many,
  many things according to the sense in which you take it, and one must know
  exactly whether the accent is on the "m" or on the "u", or where it is, for
  therein lies the difference. Take "bhu." It means earth, our earth. Take
  "Swayambhu." It means divine breath, self-existence, that which is
  everlasting, the eternal breath. To this day in China, Buddha is called
  "Pho."

  A Lady: Is not the first meaning, breath?

  Mme. Blavatsky: It is not. It is self-essence. It is very difficult for me
  to translate it to you. Look at the Sanskrit dictionaries. They will give
  you 100 etymologies, and they won't know what it is. It is existence, it is
  self-evolution, it is earth, it is spirit, everything you like. It depends
  on the accent, and how it is placed. That is a very difficult thing. In this
  sense, certainly it comes from bhu and sva.â

  MKR

  On Sun, Jan 16, 2011 at 6:41 PM, email2cal <email2cal@-VaHvQghEty7Q9ZTmvCHo1ikKTU32DdWlOyTGwChYv4fzrQr9uWqHsQ25ccMVY1iiCKIYzFj8rh-H3Y_lQ.yahoo.invalid> wrote:

  >
  >
  > >Dear friends My views are: A bit more info about FOHAT could be
  > >important. I will quote from Blavatsky and insert a few comments
  > >of my own based on my own...
  >
  > Thanks for the quotes, they are helpful to understand what Fohat is. On the
  > other hand, it's not that important to know the etymology of this term.
  >
  > Max
  >
  > 
  >

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]