Theos-Talk Archives (October 2008 Message tt00238)

Dear Cass

You tell me if I am not plagarising a whole lot of other persons
by saying "When we know, we know. When we believe we believe." ?



What I am not doing is: 
I am not promoting a doctrine, which make people think that I am Spiritist. Van Praaagh seem to have this problem. Try to read H. P. Blavatsky in The Key to Theosophy and elsewhere about Spiritism.


About chelaship: 
Sure if you talk about the ordinary physical TS. A more Non-physical or Half-physical method is always an option.
There are books withih the TS teachings and libraries, which might lead the members towards the Path of true Chelaship.

Why so negative about this?
The Masters and their friends are always ready.
What TS is not good is promoting the - genuine theosophical teachings - cause in public and among its members.

- - - 
I suggest: Learn about the Atma-Vidya doctrine and Walk the path. And be patient about it.


M. Sufilight



  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Cass Silva 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, October 10, 2008 3:17 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?


  Morten
  You quoted his favourite saying and one that he finishes every show with.  
  Either you are plagarising Van Praagh or he is plagarising you when you state
  When we know, we know. When we believe we believe.

  I think that one may be inspired but in verbal communication - I think not - imo - chelaship can no longer be attained through the TS

  Cass

  ----- Original Message ----
  From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@stofanet.dk>
  To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Friday, 10 October, 2008 3:16:00 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Dear Cass

  Van praagh is not a theosophist. He is a Spiritist medium.
  There is enough info on the Intertnet to tell you this.

  Do you think H. P. Blavatsky and Damodar are dead and not in touch with T. S. and even Theos-talk?
  I think they are in touch. There is the Law of Karma to consider.

  As far as I am concerned they are at least in touch with me.

  Do you really doubt that they have left us all?

  - - - - 

  COMMENT ON âTHE HIMALAYAN BROTHERSâDO THEY EXIST?â

  [The Theosophist, Vol. V, No. 3(51), December, 1883, pp. 83-86] 
  H. P. B.âs Comment on the article by Mohini M. Chatterji is as follows.âCompiler.] 

  EDITORâS NOTE.âSecondary evidence is no longer necessary. On November the 20th at 10 A.M. two telegrams were received by us, dated Lahore, one from Colonel Olcott, who notified us that he had been visited in person by Mahatma âK. H.â on the preceding night; and the otherâfrom Mr. W. T. Brown, F.T.S. of the âLondon Lodge,â Theosophical Society, in these words: âVisited early this morning by Mahatma K. H. who left me a silk handkerchief as a memorial, etc.!â and today 22nd having telegraphed to both those gentlemen for permission to announce the long expected event in The Theosophist, we received an answer that not only could âMasterâs visit be mentioned,â but that our President, Mr. Brown, and Mr. Damodar âhad another call last night near their tent, the Master being accompanied in flesh and body by brother Djual Khool.â Unless Mr. W. T. Brown, to complete the trio, be classed by our Spiritualistic friends also among the
  âOccidental Humourists,â the question as to real existence of the Mahatma, is pretty well settled now. One witness may be mistaken as to facts, and even a doubt may be cast upon the evidence of two witnesses. But when it comes to the testimony of three or more witnesses speaking to a fact that occurred in their presence doubt would become absurd even in a Court of Justice. We have not yet received the particulars, but since we have been notified that Mahatma K. H. on his way to Siam would most likely pass via Madras in a week or so, we have every reason to suppose that our President and Mr. Brown saw the real, living body, not merely as beforeâthe astral form of the Master.
  http://www.katinkah esselink. net/blavatsky/ articles/ v6/y1883_ 169.htm

  I have been suggested to make myself a careful study of The Key to Theosophy and to recommend it to other Seekers (who have the spiritual need for it), so they might know the real H. P. Blavatsky much better, and why she disliked the Orthodox Christian teachings so very much. And when you have finished studying it carefully, I personally think that you will realise what kind of T. S. there is needed today. And also what kind of T.S. we do not need.

  Therefore you shall know a Tree on its Fruits, no matter what Tree or Fruit.

  Let me put it like this: When your house is on fire, I am sure you know what to do. You run towards the window. But in this case you find three fire-escape- ladders instead of one. Each ladder have its own colour. Which Path to choose?
  There is not much to time contemplate. Here action is required.

  I suggest the original one.

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Cass Silva 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, October 09, 2008 2:02 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Yes - I would question their validity even if they appeared to me. Van praagh may know it and believe it - but until I know it then-yes-I would query it. I am still not convinced that Van praagh isn't reading the aura's of the sitters rather than communicating with their loved ones. Although it seems that those he contacts are those that have suffered either through accidents or suicide and as HPB said they are closer to the earth then the possibility exists that Van Praagh is accessing the mid levels of the Astral. Would really like some input into this subject as I think I am not too far away from mid level existence myself! lol

  Cass

  ----- Original Message ----
  From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
  Sent: Wednesday, 8 October, 2008 3:05:12 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Dear Cass

  I can see that you actually know that I saw them. And I take it, that you are in doubt about who they were.
  Is it so?

  Before I answer, I will have to ask: Is it according to you possible to know anything?
  I say: When we know, we know. When we believe we believe.

  - - - - - - -

  Damodar K. Mavalankar is a good example.

  On another occasion, in Bombay, Damodar was helped by his master to project his astral body (mÃyÃvi-rÃpa). He found himself at 

  "the upper end of Cashmere at the foot of the HimÃlayas. . . . [T]here were only two houses just opposite to each other and no other sign of habitation. From one of these came out [KH] . . . It was his house. Opposite him stops [M]. Brother Kâ ordered me to follow him. After going a short distance of about half a mile we came to a natural subterranean passage which is under the HimÃlayas. [This] is a natural causeway on the River Indus which flows underneath in all its fury. Only one person can walk on it at a time and one false step seals the fate of the traveller. . . . After walking a considerable distance through this subterranean passage we came into an open plain in Lââk [Ladakh]. There is a large massive building . . . This is the Chief Central Place where all those of our Section who are found deserving of Initiation into Mysteries have to go for their final ceremony and stay there the requisite period. I went up with my Guru to the Great
  Hall. The grandeur and serenity of the place is enough to strike anyone with awe."[8] 

  "Both Blavatsky and Subba Row received letters from Damodar after his arrival in Tibet, though none of them have been preserved [29]. In one of them, Damodar informed Blavatsky that the masters' influence at Adyar was steadily weakening. Blavatsky also said she had seen Damodar astrally, and that the masters had dictated to him several passages for The Secret Doctrine, which Sinnett had mistaken for Dharbagiri Nath's writing [30]. "

  [8] Ibid., pp. 60-1; see Sylvia Cranston & Carey Williams, H.P.B.: The Extraordinary Life & Influence of Helena Blavatsky, Tarcher/Putnam, 1993, pp. 99-101.

  [29.] H.P. Blavatsky Collected Writings, TPH, 1980, 12:163; DÃmodar, p. 18; Blavatsky Collected Writings, 1950, 6:272.
  [30.] The Letters of H.P. Blavatsky to A.P. Sinnett, pp. 157, 248-9.
  http://ourworld. compuserve. com/homepages/ dp5/damodar. htm

  Memorandum from Damodar K. Mavalankar (The Coulomb case)
  http://www.blavatsk yarchives. com/mavalankarsp r1884.htm

  - - - 
  "WHY I DO NOT RETURN TO INDIA" - Article by H. P. Blavatsky
  "In a letter received from Damodar in 1886, he notified me that the Masters' influence was becoming with every day weaker at Adyar; that They were daily represented as less than "second-rate Yogis," totally denied by some, while even those who believed in, and had remained loyal to Them, feared even to pronounce Their names. Finally, he urged me very strongly to return, saying that of course the Masters would see that my health should not suffer from it. I wrote to that effect to Colonel Olcott, imploring him to let me return, and promising that I would live at Pondicherry, if needed, should my presence not be desirable at Adyar. To this I received the ridiculous answer that no sooner should I return, than I should be sent to the Andaman Islands as a Russian spy, which of course Colonel Olcott subsequently found out to be absolutely untrue. The readiness with which such a futile pretext for keeping me from Adyar was seized upon, shows in clear colours
  the ingratitude of those to whom I had given my life and health. " (H. P. Blavatsky, 1890)
  http://www.blavatsk y.net/blavatsky/ arts/WhyIDoNotRe turnToIndia. htm

  H. P. Blavatsky wrote august 1889:
  "There is no longer a 'Parent Society;' it is abolished and replaced 
  by an aggregate body of Theosophical Societies, all 
  autonomous.. .such is the real state of things."
  http://www.blavatsk y.net/blavatsky/ arts/PuzzleFromA dyar.htm

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Cass Silva 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 1:47 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  With respect Morten, how do you know they were who they said they were?

  Cass

  ----- Original Message ----
  From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
  Sent: Tuesday, 7 October, 2008 2:51:20 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Allright here is my answer based on what I got from the encounter:

  Annie and Charlie is not the subject to discuss. It is not useful during the present circumstances.
  Try with Morya and KH: I was told, that they have been doing very good.
  The impression was that Olcott was doing well, but I am not quite sure about it.
  I did not hear about Damodar, I guess he is going through a more tough time, or else he is very busy.
  His visit at my home was very short some month further back.

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Cass Silva 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com 
  Sent: Monday, October 06, 2008 1:44 PM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  How's the old girl going Morten? Has she caught up with Annie and Charlie?

  Cass

  ----- Original Message ----
  From: Morten Nymann Olesen <global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk>
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com
  Sent: Monday, 6 October, 2008 2:13:38 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Aah. Now you are diverting the subject and talk about something else.
  :-)
  I suggest that you keep to the facts.

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Drpsionic@aol. com 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 4:46 PM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  You haven't seen the video of them trying to find their way home.

  Chuck the Heretic

  In a message dated 10/5/2008 1:02:58 A.M. Central Daylight Time, 
  global-theosophy@ stofanet. dk writes:

  I have talked with Blavatsky, and she told me:
  They say they are not!

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: _Drpsionic@aol. Drp_ (mailto:Drpsionic@ aol. com) 
  To: _theos-talk@ yahoogrotheos- t_ (mailto:theos- talk@yahoogro ups.com) 
  Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 4:49 AM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Because they are senile.

  Chuck the Heretic

  In a message dated 10/4/2008 1:05:59 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
  _global-theosophy@ global-thgl_ (mailto:global- theosophy@ stofanet. dk) writes:

  There are master who are past 500 years, why rule them out?

  M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Erica Letzerich" <__eletzerich@ _eletzeri_ 
  (mailto:_eletzerich @ yahoo.ele) _ 
  (mailto:_eletzerich @ yahoo.ele_ (mailto:eletzerich@ yahoo. com) ) >
  To: <_theos-talk@ _theos-talk@ <W_theos- talk_theos- talk@yahoogrothe os-t_ 
  (mailto:theos- talk@yahoogro ups.com) ) >
  Sent: Saturday, October 04, 2008 7:10 PM
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: Theosophical Spa?

  Dear friends,

  There is a
  blog entitled Theosophy Forward -
  Theosophy Moving in the 21st Century*, with commentaries of some
  General Secretaries about the International by-laws. Mrs. Susan Kaschula** 
  between some others issues
  wrote the following: "The International
  President should serve a fixed term with limitations on successive terms.
  Persons over the age of 80 years should be ineligible for nomination." ***

  It is
  necessary to be careful with our words. Words can hurt and cause unnecessary 
  pain.
  We have many theosophists who are active and above this age. This would be 
  discriminatory and unfair. Furthermore
  it's well known that age brings experience, maturity consequently as a 
  natural
  result wiser decisions many times are taken by those who are older than us. 
  They deserve our respect, consideration and not discrimination due to their
  age.

  I just hope others in the future will not suggest the International
  President should weight a certain amount of pounds and have no wrinkles;
  otherwise we will end up organizing a theosophical spa and contacting the
  clinic of Dr. Ivo Pitanguy.

  Erica
  * Theosophy Forward - Theosophy Moving in the
  21st Century link: __http://www.theosoph http://www. thehttp:/ _ 
  (http://www.theosoph http://wwhttp: //www_) 
  (_http://www.theosoph http://wwhttp: //www_ 
  (http://www.theosoph yforward. com/about/) ) 

  **Susan Kaschula, General Secretary of
  the Theosophical Society in South Africa.

  ***See Theosophy Forward - Theosophy Moving
  in the 21st Century, Issues on Elections, 28 August, 2008.

  --- On Sat, 10/4/08, MKR <__mkr777@gmail. _mk_ (mailto:_mkr777@ gmail. mkr) _ 
  (mailto:_mkr777@ gmail. mkr_ (mailto:mkr777@ gmail. com) ) > 
  wrote:
  From: MKR <__mkr777@gmail. _mk_ (mailto:_mkr777@ gmail. mkr) _ 
  (mailto:_mkr777@ gmail. mkr_ (mailto:mkr777@ gmail. com) ) >
  Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: TS - Disenfranchisement Plans
  To: _theos-talk@ To: _theosTo: _th_theos-talk@ yahoogrotheos- t_ 
  (mailto:theos- talk@yahoogro ups.com) ) 
  Date: Saturday, October 4, 2008, 12:32 PM

  Hi, Katinka

  I thought you set up the blog since it is from Netherlands. when you say

  your general council, are you saying it is Dutch General Council?

  mkr

  On 10/4/08, Katinka Hesselink <mail@katinkahessel mail@kat> wrote:

  >

  > Hi,

  >

  > I've become aware our general council is not as passive as it may

  > seem. See my post about some new blogs I've become aware of recently.

  >

  > I'm amazed we didn't find out about them sooner though. John

  > apparently started blogging in July.

  >

  >

  > __http://theosophical h_ (http://theosophical _/) (_http://theosophical h_ 
  (http://theosophical /) ) society.wordpres s.com/2008/ 
  10/04/blogs- 
  > ts-organisationa l-issues/

  >

  > or if that doesn't work:

  > __http://theosophical h_ (http://theosophical _/) (_http://theosophical h_ 
  (http://theosophical /) ) society.wordpres s.com/

  >

  > Katinka Hesselink

  > --- In theos-talk@yahoogro ups.com <theos-talk% 40yahoogroups. com>, MKR

  > <mkr777@...> wrote:

  > >

  > > We all are having such a number of exchange of messages and opinions

  > on the

  > > drastic changes proposed to the TS Rules including disenfranchising

  > members

  > > from directly voting for the International President.

  > >

  > > The secrecy with which the proposals were developed and speed with

  > which it

  > > was sought to be implemented before members could find out is simply

  > > astounding. In addition to keeping this information secret from the

  > members

  > > they are supposed to represent, even after they became know publicly, no

  > > attempt has been made to tell the members what they are trying to

  > do, why

  > > they sought to keep them very secret, and why there is a need for such

  > > speed.

  > >

  > > All the leaders are hunkering down and silent. I hope they are not

  > dreaming

  > > that by keeping quiet, all this commotion will die down and they can

  > have

  > > their own way and grab control of TS all the while professing they

  > are doing

  > > it for the welfare of TS and yours and mine.

  > >

  > > With the rapid decline of membership, if these change plans are

  > implemented

  > > by hook or crook, then we will see the end of TS as we all have

  > known all

  > > these years. It is time for us all to speak up to convey what we

  > feel about

  > > the secret plans.

  > >

  > > MKR

  > >

  > >

  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

  > >

  >

  >

  >

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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