Theos-Talk Archives (September 2008 Message tt00109)

My views are:

H. P. Blavatsky stated somewhere, that organisations comes and goes (appearntly The Theosophical Society as well), but theosophy stays.

What happens in the esoteric teachings is, that  you get the Kwhajagan Masters esoteric section, the Dzogchen masters section, the theosophical sections and a lot of other theosophical groups - and during time they all change into other -organisational - names and are guided by other Guru's or teacher or authors. To me Idries Shah was such a one commpared to the theosophical H. P. Blavatsky. One talk about that the Guardians of Knowledge form time to time appear to be of service to humanity.

What is important is to distinguish between the Real Ones (the initiated) and they Would-Be-Ones. As well as The pretending Successors versus The Innovators. The Ones with the Real Fruits and the ones with the Emotional Ones. The Ones with what the Egoistic human wants and craves - and - the Ones Giving what most humans do not want, but what many spiritually need. Etc. etc.


M. Sufilight

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: mkr777@gmail.com 
  To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com ; theos-l 
  Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 3:27 PM
  Subject: Theos-World TS -- Creed taking control?


  Jiddu Krishnamurti was a keen observer. Ernest Wood, who was one time his
  instructor, and a life long theosophist who gave prime of his life to TS and
  Theosophy, knew him very well. In Wood's book - "Is This Theosophy?", there
  is an interesting segment relating to his discussion with Krishnamurti
  regarding the future of TS. It is quoted below, followed by a few comments
  of mine.

  =======

  And here also was Krishnamurti, declared to be the World Teacher in person,
  stating that ceremonies were hindrances to a spiritual life, and even that
  explanations of life, such as those of reincarnation and karma were
  soporific, for only the aid of pure action in the present, making the most
  of the present, was consistent with spirituality, liberation, or the clean
  and self-fructifying operation of life itself. To hold a theory that we must
  work for the development or accumulation or acquisition of opportunities or
  powers to be attained at some future time was simply to spoil the living
  present.

  I saw much of Krishnamurti during his visit to New York and on subsequent
  occasions. I tried to grasp how life appeared and what it meant to him. That
  was difficult, because it did not mean anything at all. It stood for itself
  and required no interpretation. He said he had reached liberation; he was
  free, but he could not describe that freedom. Mind could no more grasp life
  than teeth could bite the air. Life was knowing itself direct in him, not
  through the veil of mind, with its clumsy categories of past, present and
  future.

  I could see clearly what he was driving at in describing so many things as
  hindrances, but I was not able to grasp the positive and superior life of
  which he spoke. After all, his position seemed to be that of the yoga school
  of India, which I knew well. It was simply that the mind (perception and
  reason) is not the instrument for knowing the positive element of being that
  is, life itself, but is concerned with the limited department of production
  and understanding of forms. Its enhancement could not lead to discovery of
  fundamental truth any more than could development of abnormal muscularity.
  On the other hand its suppression could not lead to it, any more than
  material suicide.

  We ought not, therefore, to picture our evolution into some godly or angelic
  type of being and stultify our present power by waiting or working for that.
  That would not be different from the way in which stupid devotees set aside
  their own judgment and waited for orders from above. Nor, on the other hand,
  should we discredit our present capacity by going backwards, as it were, to
  the peaceful animal state of mind. In short, the secret of the real is to
  click with the present, to be fully what we are. Consolation, hope, remorse,
  and any philosophy which softens the incidence of life upon us in the
  present stands in the way of life's realization of itself. The mind can help
  only by removing the obstacles, the errors created by itself. To think of
  life in its fullness is to make only a picture on canvas. Life is life, and
  cannot be known mentally by comparison with any object. You cannot put God
  in a box.

  Several times I discussed with Krishnamurti the function of the Theosophical
  Society. He said: "You cannot organize truth."

  I pointed out that the Society was intended to be only a business
  organization. It existed for the promotion of truth, but did not say what
  that truth was.

  "I am afraid you cannot have such a brotherhood," was his reply."Consider
  the weakness of human nature. Some creed will get control of the thing, or
  will be fighting for it and giving trouble all the time."

  I pointed out that the position is maintained in scientific and learned
  societies; the Chemical Society does not advocate the use of any particular
  brand of soap or matches. "People can be impersonal with reference to soap
  and matches," was the substance of his reply, "but your society proposes to
  deal with man himself, and you will find that people simply will not face
  the truth with reference to themselves."
  "Let us put it to the test of experience," said I. At any rate I am going to
  try to make the position clear, since there ought to be a society where
  people may meet to discuss and criticize their various efforts to find the
  truth.

  "Go ahead," was his conclusion. "I shall watch the effort with great
  interest, but I think there is little hope."

  ------------------------------

  ***

  MKR COMMENTS:

  Looking at the events that have taken place since last December, I am
  wondering if we are in the verge of "some creed" getting control of TS. If
  that were to happen, then we will have a Society totally different from what
  it was chartered for as it would not be attracting dedicated altruistic men
  and women who are really interested in search of Truth.
  MKR

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