Theos-Talk Archives (February 2008 Message tt00281)

Dear Cass

Thank you for your interesting response?as usual!

You write, "when these new messages are compared 
to the 'tone' and 'sound logic' of the
Mahatma Letters I see no correlation."

This word "tone" is interesting to me, one with 
which I resonate :) Sorry!

The tone I get from the Mahatmas, whilst sometimes 
"directive" towards Mr Sinnett and Hume for example, 
engenders in me a sense of empowerment and respect, 
whereas the tone in most of the later putative 
"masters" seems to encourage a mindset of bended 
knee of worship and requirement for personal 
acknowledgement. 

>From experience, this difference I perceive is not 
often recognised by others, even by those whom I 
would consider to be of high intelligence. 
This of course makes it neither right nor wrong, as 
it is perhaps only a matter of perception, which 
may have something of a cultural, nature/nurture, 
skandha basis.

This sense of feeling from their writings is 
important to my understanding of their works and 
efforts, together of course with the "sound logic" 
you mention.

Kind regards
Nigel



--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Cass Silva <silva_cass@...> wrote:
>
> Thanks Nigel, I wasn't aware of Gerald's affiliations until now.  
My dialogue with Gerald was concerning his theory of the I-Not I 
Monad which I found interesting and which seemed to rely on the works 
of HPB.
>    
>   I have visited some of the sites Gerald links to in relation to 
HPB's Adepts, and when these new messages are compared to the 'tone' 
and 'sound logic' of the Mahatma Letters I see no correlation.
>    
>   I do not believe 'tone' (at their level) never changes.  For me 
it is not the same voice.
>    
>   Cheers
>   Cass
> 
> nhcareyta <nhcareyta@...> wrote:
>           Dear Cass
> 
> Thank you for your response and question.
> 
> Please forgive my reiteration of certain points below. 
> They are obviously not intended for you but for those 
> who may have recently joined this forum.
> 
> I cannot comment on Gerald Scheuller's honesty or 
> integrity but I will trust your assessment. 
> 
> My only reference to him was viewing his website 
> a few years ago where Mr Bill Keidan attempted a 
> valiant defence of Reverend Geoffrey Hodson. 
> I also read a comment by Leslie Price in a speech 
> at the Theosophical History Conference in 2003 on 
> "Madame Blavatsky, Buddhism and Tibet" where he 
> said, "Scheuler considers that Theosophy and 
> Mahayana Buddhism are identical in their core, 
> though differing in emphasis, and (at face value 
> only) conflicting at certain points. He believes 
> that HPB was initiated into Mahayana and into 
> Dzogchen, a form of once secret practice found 
> chiefly in the Nyingma school."
> 
> Mr Schuller (Scheuler) writes in his article `
> The Masters and Their Emissaries:
> From H.P.B. to Guru Ma and Beyond', "Besides its 
> three official objects, the mission of the 
> Theosophical Society was to prepare the world 
> for the coming of a great spiritual teacher, 
> expected in the last quarter of the 20th century."
> 
> I don't accept this premise to be correct and 
> don't accept his quote from the Key to Theosophy 
> as validation of this. Their "mission" or rather, 
> their "forlorn hope" was to assist in the 
> alleviating of suffering through the release of 
> a body of teachings. 
> 
> He writes, "Annie Besant, Blavatsky's successor 
> as leader of the Theosophical Society?"
> 
> Madame Blavatsky was never leader of the Theosophical 
> Society and Dr Besant was therefore not her successor. 
> This is a mistake which is quite extraordinary unless 
> he has information to the contrary.
> 
> He continues, "?and Charles Webster Leadbeater, 
> mediator between the Adepts and the Theosophical 
> Society?"
> 
> I do not accept this as true for the reasons I have 
> stated in this forum many times.
> Bishop Leadbeater and Dr Besant's version of theosophy 
> manifestly contradicted that of Madame Blavatsky and 
> her teachers, despite their supposedly being in direct 
> contact with the same Adepts. 
> I refer those other than yourself to the following link:
> http://www.blavatskyarchives.com/thomas/index.htm
> 
> He finishes his sentence, "?were directed to implement 
> this project fifty years in advance."
> 
> Where is his evidence for this statement? Does he rely 
> on the thoroughly discredited words of Dr Besant and 
> Bishop Leadbeater? If so, I do not accept his inference.
> 
> I will spare you and the group from endless more quotes 
> and my counter claims. Mr Schuller seems to accept the 
> writings and claims of Dr Besant and Bishop Leadbeater 
> as valid. 
> My position is that they have lied and been discredited 
> too many times on too many occasions to have the trust 
> of sincere seekers after truth.
> 
> This brings me to your question, "What are your ideas 
> on the Masters continual communication through various 
> emissaries over the past 100 years."
> 
> If by Masters you are referring to the teachers of 
> Madame Blavatsky and those from their tradition, I 
> haven't read or heard anything from those persons 
> mentioned in Mr Schuller's article which concurs in 
> large part with their teachings and mindset.
> 
> However, some of the translated and published teachings 
> and writings emerging from Tibetan Buddhism and Tibetan 
> Buddhist Lamas are certainly congruous with Madame 
> Blavatsky's teachers' tradition. Much of this has come 
> to light in the West since the Dalai Lama's first visit 
> to the West in 1973.
> 
> It is also entirely probable the Masters have 
> communicated with others over the past century, 
> although it would appear to me not in the manner 
> in which 
> they did during the time of Madame Blavatsky.
> 
> Kind regards
> Nigel 
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Cass Silva <silva_cass@> wrote:
> >
> > Dear Nigel,
> > I did a quick scan of Gerald's site and found some interesting 
> information. I have had personal 'forum' discussions with Gerald 
and 
> found him to be a man of integrity and honesty. I personally have a 
> blockage when it comes to the Masters contacting these groups such 
as 
> the Temple of the Presence. The language used in their recent 
> correspondence doesn't have the same ring of authority to it as 
> written in The Mahatma Letters.
> > 
> > I don't think the references came through with the article, but I 
> found these to be more valuable in terms of comparing HPB and 
> Krishnamurti. I can see now where Morten was coming from, although 
> the Messiah Project was not so much the issue, as the issue of a 
non-
> self, thereby hampering the evolution of many who take on board 
this 
> teaching.
> > 
> > What are your ideas on the Masters continual communication 
> through various emissaries over the past 100 years. Also found out 
> that the difference between an Ascended Master and a Master is in 
the 
> use of which vehicle is used! According to the Temple site, Morya 
> and KH have taken another initiation and are now ascended masters. 
> My intuition tells me that the Masters have been silent for over 
100 
> years, probably knowing from past experience that 'fools rush in - 
> where wise men fear to tread"
> > 
> > Cass
> > 
> > 
> > Dear Cass
> > 
> > Good grief! We have so much work to do, even if only exposing 
> > ordinary and verifiable truths and lies.
> > 
> > Kind regards
> > Nigel
> > 
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Cass Silva <silva_cass@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I have just read an article which sheds new light on the 
> > Krishnamurt-Theosophical debate. This is from the Alpheas Web 
Site -
> 
> > Gerald Schueller
> > > Cass
> > > The Masters and Their Emissaries:
> > > From H.P.B. to Guru Ma and Beyond By Govert Schuller 
> > Stand beneath the waterfall and receive unreservedly the flow of 
> the 
> > hierarchy of Aquarius that comes through our embodied messengers. 
> > When the waterfall ceases to flow, move on, for hierarchy will 
not 
> be 
> > stopped. We will open another stream and prepare a channel for 
the 
> > crystal-clear waters of life
> > > --Kuthumi
> > > 
> > > On September 7, 1875, Helena Petrovna Blavatsky and Henry Steel 
> > Olcott founded the Theosophical Society. They were directed to do 
> so 
> > by two eastern Adepts or Masters, Morya and Koot Hoomi.(1) 
Besides 
> > its three official objects (1a), the mission of the Theosophical 
> > Society was to prepare the world for the coming of a great 
> spiritual 
> > teacher, expected in the last quarter of the 20th century.(2) 
> > > Annie Besant, Blavatsky's successor as leader of the 
Theosophical 
> > Society, and Charles Webster Leadbeater, mediator between the 
> Adepts 
> > and the Theosophical Society, were directed to implement this 
> project 
> > fifty years in advance.(3) The young Jiddu Krishnamurti was 
chosen 
> > and trained to be the vehicle through whom the World Teacher Lord 
> > Maitreya would reveal himself.(4) The Order of the Star in the 
East 
> > was the worldwide organization to draw together all those who 
> > expected the coming of this great teacher. Krishnamurti became 
its 
> > Head. Not all Theosophists were in agreement with these 
> developments.
> > (5) Until about 1927 all went relatively well(6) and starting on 
> > December 28, 1925 Krishnamurti was overshadowed a few times by 
Lord 
> > Maitreya.(7) Krishnamurti and other Theosophists declared the 
> project 
> > successful,(8) others were of the opposite opinion.(9) From about 
> > 1927 on Krishnamurti decided to go his own way and irrevocably 
> > dissociated himself from the project by
> > > dissolving the Order of the Star on August 3, 1929. 
> > > Through Theosophists Cyril Scott and David Anrias, the Adepts 
> > communicated their evaluation of the project and declared it an 
> > almost complete failure.(10) Krishnamurti caused so much 
confusion 
> > in the ranks of the Theosophists, that the Theosophical Society 
was 
> > disqualified as the spearhead of the work of the Adepts. 
> > Nevertheless, some Theosophists, such as C. Jinarajadasa and 
> Geoffrey 
> > Hodson, were still in contact with the Adepts(11), and They kept 
a 
> > continuing interest in the affairs of the Theosophical Society.
(12) 
> > Furthermore the Adepts worked also with Alice Bailey, which was 
not 
> > successful (13), and with Nicholas and Helena Roerich, which was.
> (14)
> > > Three months after Krishnamurti had dissolved the Order of the 
> > Star, the crash on the New York Stock Exchange happened. This 
event 
> > was the starting point of an unprecedented disastrous sixteen-
year-
> > cycle of economic depression, militarism, fascism and war, 
> > culminating in the Holocaust and the use of the atomic bomb. This 
> > was no coincidence. One of its main causes was the earlier 
> mentioned 
> > confusion amongst many advanced souls. They were not able anymore 
> > to keep the forces of darkness at bay.(15) 
> > > In the summer of 1930, the Adept Saint Germain approached Guy 
> > Ballard, an American mining engineer with an interest in the 
> occult, 
> > with the request to become messenger for the Adepts. Ballard 
wrote 
> > Unveiled Mysteries under the name Godfre Ray King and founded 
> the "I 
> > AM" Movement.(16) Through Ballard the Adepts gave the revelations 
> > deemed necessary for the Age of Aquarius, which originally were 
> > intended to be given through Krishnamurti.(17) These revelations 
> > included original teachings about mantra yoga, the divine self or 
> the 
> > I AM Presence, and the initiation of the ascension.(18) In the 
> > 1930s the "I AM" Movement was very successful.(19) Because of Guy 
> > Ballard's passing in 1939, a string of lawsuits and bad 
publicity, 
> > the movement experienced a setback. Guy Ballard's wife, Edna 
> Ballard, 
> > succeeded him.
> > > In 1944 the Adept the Maha Chohan, the chief of El Morya and 
> > Kuthumi, contacted "I AM" member Geraldine Innocente.(20) In 
April 
> > 1952 she founded anonymously the Bridge to Freedom to spread some 
> > teachings by "Thomas Printz," pseudonym for El Morya.(21) 
> > > Mark Prophet, who was associated with the Bridge to Freedom, 
was 
> > contacted by El Morya in the early 1950s. The Adepts directed him 
> to 
> > found The Summit Lighthouse, which he did on August 8, 1958. This 
> > organization, now also known as Church Universal and Triumphant, 
> has 
> > been a very successful organization in spreading the revelations 
> for 
> > the New Age of Aquarius.(22) Its current head is Elizabeth Clare 
> > Prophet, who was contacted in the spring of 1961 by El Morya to 
> join 
> > The Summit Lighthouse in order to be trained as a messenger.(23) 
> She 
> > became its head in 1973 after the passing of Mark Prophet to whom 
> she 
> > was married.(24) Among her students she is also known as Guru Ma 
or 
> > just Mother. In 1997 the organization lost its protection from El 
> > Morya (24a) and unfortunately, in late 1998, Prophet was 
diagnosed 
> > with Alzheimer's disease and soon after stopped transmitting 
> messages 
> > from the Masters.
> > > Recent offshoots of Church Universal and Triumphant are The 
> > Temple of The Presence founded by Carolyn and Monroe Shearer; 
> Shangra-
> > la by Kim Michaels; New Wisdom University by Marsha Covington; 
and 
> > The Hearts Center by David Lewis. All were members of Prophet's 
> > organization and claim to be contacted by the Masters to 
inaugurate 
> > new Ascended Master organizations. (25) 
> > > The revelations given through the Ballards and the Prophets on 
> > one side, and the philosophy of Krishnamurti (and others) on the 
> > other side might both lead to either the beginning of a 
> > transformation of already existing civilizations like the Judeo-
> > Christian and the Indic, both of which might be stimulated to new 
> > levels of intellectual and spiritual development, or--and this 
> > probably being the case with Krishnamurti's teachings--to the 
birth 
> > of a completely new, though deeply flawed, religion and 
> civilization.
> > (26) 1. El Morya wrote in 1882: "So casting about 
> > we found in America the man [H.S. Olcott] to stand as leader... . 
> > With him we associated a woman [H.P. Blavatsky] of most 
exceptional 
> > and wonderful endowments... . We sent her to America, brought 
them 
> > together--and the trial began." Letter No.44, Morya to A.P. 
> Sinnett, 
> > February 1882, in A.T. Barker, compiler, The Mahatma Letters to 
> A.P. 
> > Sinnett (Adyar, India: Theosophical Publishing House, 1972), p.
> > > 259. And in 1975: "In 1876, Helena Petrovna Blavatsky was 
> > ordered by the Master Kuthumi and me, then known as the Masters 
> K.H. 
> > and M., to write Isis Unveiled. Later she was given the 
> > responsibility of imparting The Secret Doctrine to the world."El 
> > Morya, The Chela and the Path (Corwin Springs MT: Summit 
University 
> > Press, 1975), p. 122. [Quotes in notes 1, 12, 13, 14, 17, 18, 23 
> and 
> > 24 were reprinted with permission from the publisher. Copyright © 
> > 1975, 1976, 1979, 1980, 1994, Summit University Press, P.O. Box 
> 5000, 
> > Corwin Springs, Montana 59030-5000. (406) 848-9500. Web site: 
> > http://www.tsl.org]. Both Masters took their fifth initiation, 
the 
> > Ascension, at the close of the last century, thereby becoming 
> > incorporeal Ascended Masters. And as Blavatsky has written--
> referring 
> > to other saints, that, when "unburthened of their terrestrial 
> > tabernacles, their freed souls, henceforth united forever with 
> their 
> > spirits, rejoin the whole shining host, which is bound together in
> > > one spiritual solidarity of thought and deed, and called 
> > the `anointed,' "--the same glad tidings could be told, not only 
> > about these two illustrious Masters, but also about many other 
> brave 
> > souls who followed them. [H.P. Blavatsky, Isis Unveiled (Pasadena 
> CA: 
> > Theosophical University Press, 1976 [1877]), II, p. 159].For 
> > practical purposes the difference between an Unascended Master 
and 
> an 
> > Ascended one is not very great. Both can work in the physical as 
> well 
> > as in the spiritual realm and both have a wide array of occult 
> powers 
> > at their command to guide Their pupils and help mankind. The 
> > difference is that an Unascended Master has its base of 
operations 
> in 
> > a physical body and an Ascended Master in a spiritual body. To 
> > dismiss the latter as spooks, because They do not conform to 
one's 
> > idea of flesh-and-blood Masters, is to deny oneself the great 
> wisdom 
> > coming from the 'anointed' or Ascended Masters. [Blavatsky wrote 
> > about the concept of Nirmanakaya: "As a Nirmanakaya,
> > > however, the adept leaves behind him only his physical body, 
and 
> > retains every other "principle" save the Kamic, for he has 
crushed 
> > this out for ever from his nature during life, and it can never 
> > resurrect in his post-mortem state. Thus, instead of going into 
> > selfish bliss, he chooses a life of self-sacrifice, an existence 
> > which ends only with the life-cycle, in order to be enabled to 
help 
> > mankind in an invisible, yet most effective, manner." The Key to 
> > Theosophy (London: Theosophical Publishing Co., 1889), pp. 353-
> > 354] Return to Text 1a. The objects of the Theosophical 
> > Society are the following: 
> > > To form a nucleus of the universal brotherhood of humanity, 
> > without distinction of race, creed, sex, caste, or color. 
> > > To encourage the comparative study of religion, philosophy, 
> > and science. 
> > > To investigate unexplained laws of nature and the powers 
> > latent in humanity. 
> > > Return to text 2. Blavatsky wrote in 
> > 1889: "If the present attempt, in the form of our Society, 
succeeds 
> > better than its predecessors have done, then it will be in 
> existence 
> > as an organized, living and healthy body when the time comes for 
> the 
> > effort of the XXth century. The general condition of men's minds 
> and 
> > hearts will have been improved and purified by the spread of its 
> > teachings, and, as I have said, their prejudices and dogmatic 
> > illusions will have been, to some extent at least, removed. Not 
> only 
> > so, but besides a large and accessible literature ready to men's 
> > hands, the next impulse will find a numerous and united body of 
> > people ready to welcome the new torch-bearer of Truth. He will 
find 
> > the minds of men prepared for his message, a language ready for 
him 
> > in which to clothe the new truths he brings, an organization 
> awaiting 
> > his arrival, which will remove the merely mechanical, material 
> > obstacles and difficulties from his path. Think how much
> > > one, to whom such an opportunity is given, could accomplish. 
> > Measure it by comparison with what the Theosophical Society 
> actually 
> > has achieved in the last fourteen years, with out any of these 
> > advantages and surrounded by hosts of hindrances which would not 
> > hamper the new leader. Consider all this, and then tell me 
whether 
> I 
> > am too sanguine when I say that if the Theosophical Society 
> survives 
> > and lives true to its mission, to its original impulses through 
the 
> > next hundred years--tell me, I say, if I go too far in asserting 
> that 
> > earth will be a heaven in the twenty-first century in comparison 
> with 
> > what it is now!" H.P. Blavatsky, The Key to Theosophy (London: 
> > Theosophical Publishing Co., 1889), pp. 306-307. Return to 
> > Text 3. Annie Besant wrote in 1912: "It may interest members 
> > to recall the fact that Mme. H.P. Blavatsky, one of the founders 
of 
> > the T.S., regarded it as the mission of the T.S. to prepare the 
> world 
> > for the coming of the next great Teacher, though
> > > she put that event perhaps half a century later than I do. 
Which 
> > of us is right as to date, only time can show. I do not say that 
> she 
> > was necessarily right in making this its mission, but as she 
> > proclaimed this view in the supposedly `uncolored' days, under 
`the 
> > old régime,' the repetition of the statement by myself does not 
> imply 
> > any change of policy. She wrote: `The next impulse will find a 
> > numerous and united body of people ready to welcome the new torch-
> > bearer of Truth. He will find the minds of men prepared for his 
> > message, a language ready for him in which to clothe the new 
truths 
> > he brings, an organization awaiting his arrival, which will 
remove 
> > the merely mechanical, material obstacles and difficulties from 
his 
> > path.' That was the view of one of our Founders--really of both--
as 
> > to `the future of the Theosophical Society,' and my crime is that 
I 
> > share it, and do what my poor powers permit in preparing the 
minds 
> of 
> > men for that coming." Annie Besant, "Freedom of
> > > Opinion in the T.S.," letter to The Vâhan 21\8 (March 1912), p. 
> > 153. Return to Text 4. "Shortly after meeting Krishna for 
> > the first time, Leadbeater revealed to [Theosophist Ernest] Wood 
> that 
> > the boy was to be the vehicle for the Lord Maitreya `unless 
> something 
> > went wrong' and that he, Leadbeater, had been directed to help 
> train 
> > him for that purpose." Mary Lutyens, Krishnamurti: The Years of 
> > Awakening, (New York: Farrar, Straus and Giroux, 1975), p. 21. 
> > Return to Text 5. In particular the German Section of the 
> > Theosophical Society, led by Rudolf Steiner, expressed its 
> > intolerance towards members of the Order of the Star, by stating 
> that 
> > membership of both organizations was mutually exclusive. This 
> policy 
> > was obviously contrary to the principle of freedom of thought and 
> > association, a cornerstone of the Theosophical Society. The 
defiant 
> > stand taken on this issue by the German Section led eventually to 
> the 
> > cancellation of their charter. Return to
> > > Text 6. During the Jubilee Convention of the Theosophical 
> > Society in 1925 a message originating from an Adept was read to 
the 
> > participants. This happened a few days before December 28, when 
the 
> > first overshadowing of Krishnamurti by the Lord Maitreya 
occurred. 
> A 
> > part of the message reads: "A second half-century of fine promise 
> > lies before you. We say to you: You have the power to do more in 
> the 
> > immediate future than any other body of men and women has ever 
> > achieved before. We say to you: Within this next half century you 
> can 
> > make Brotherhood a living reality in the world. You can cause the 
> > warring classes, castes, and nations to cease their quarreling, 
the 
> > warring faiths to live once more in brotherhood, respect and 
> > understanding. Make Theosophy a living force in your lives, and 
> > through your example those class and caste distinctions, which 
for 
> so 
> > long have bred hatred and misery, shall at no distant time come 
to 
> be 
> > but distinctions of function in the common
> > > service of the nation-family and of the World-
> > Brotherhood... ." "It is the Law that Our Blessed Lord comes 
among 
> > you, be His welcome what it may, though even he may not outstay 
His 
> > welcome. And only at long intervals, so far, has He been able to 
> > bestow upon you the priceless benediction of His immediate 
presence 
> > in your midst. We have to wait. So be it. Yet, if His welcome 
> lasts, 
> > perchance grows, He may dwell long with you, and the doors thus 
be 
> > flung wide open between Our world and your, and between other 
> worlds 
> > and yours, that they may become one world, Ourselves restored to 
> Our 
> > natural place among Our younger comrades, and Devas and mankind 
be 
> > once more together in happy comradeship." Anonymous Master, "A 
> > Message to the Members of the Theosophical Society from an Elder 
> > Brother," The Theosophist 47\4 (January 1926), supplement, pp. 3 
> and 
> > 4. And what did Krishnamurti do? Instead of opening, he slammed 
the 
> > door in Their face. Return to Text 7. Geoffrey
> > > Hodson wrote in 1927: "As he [Krishnamurti] speaks, the spirit 
> > of the Christ descends, as a great collective inspiration, into 
the 
> > hearts and minds of all. It draws nearer and nearer in a great 
ring-
> > shaped cloud of golden light. It hovers over our heads, descends 
> > still lower, slowly and gently, like a warm summer rain, till all 
> are 
> > enwrapped in its beauty, its peace and all-compelling love... . 
> Night 
> > after night, as he ceases to speak, a miracle occurs. Two 
thousand 
> > sevenhundred people remain perfectly still. In that silence the 
> > splendor of splendors is revealed to the inner eyes. The figure 
of 
> > the Lord appears above the head of Krishnaji. The silence 
deepens. 
> We 
> > are enfolded in His embrace, filled with tenderness and 
compassion 
> as 
> > he draws near." Geoffrey Hodson, Thus Have I Heard (Adyar, India: 
> > Theosophical Publishing House, 1929), pp. 107-108. Leadbeater 
wrote 
> > in 1930: "This is He who should come, and there is no need to 
look 
> > elsewhere; as I have said, I know
> > > that the World-Teacher often speaks through Krishnaji, but I 
also 
> > know that there are occasions when He does not." C.W. 
> > Leadbeater, "Art Thou He That Should Come?" The Theosophist 51\9 
> > (June 1930), p. 472. Return to Text 8. Krishnamurti wrote 
> > in 1927: "I know my destiny and my work. I know with certainty 
and 
> > knowledge of my own, that I am blending into the consciousness of 
> the 
> > one Teacher and that He will completely fill me." Letter from 
> > Krishnamurti to Leadbeater February 9, 1927, quoted in Lutyens, 
> > Krishnamurti: The Years of Awakening, p. 241. "I never said: I am 
> > the World Teacher; but now that I feel I am one with my Beloved, 
I 
> > say it." Talk by Krishnamurti, August 2, 1927, quoted in Lutyens, 
> p. 
> > 250. Annie Besant declared in 1927: "The Divine Spirit has 
> > descended once more on a man, Krishnamurti, one who in his life 
is 
> > literally perfect, as those who know him can testify... . The 
World 
> > Teacher is here. "Annie Besant, "The Way of Sorrows and the Way
> > > of Happiness: The New Message" The Theosophist 48/7 (April 
1927), 
> > p. 6d. Return to Text 9. "I had a talk with [Theosophist] 
> > Jinarajadasa, who staggered me by saying that the gathering at 
> Eerde 
> > [in August 1927] had been a tragedy and a failure and had almost 
> > wrecked the Plan of the Brotherhood." Lady Emily Lutyens, Candles 
> > in the Sun (London: Rupert Hart-Davis, 1957), p. 163. "C.W.L. 
> > declared privately when in Adyar in 1927 that `The Coming had 
gone 
> > wrong.'" Adrian G. Vreede, "An Attack on Bishop Leadbeater," The 
> > Liberal Catholic 34\7 (February 1964), p. 150. Return to 
> > Text 10. "[His mission was] a success while still 
> > overshadowed by the world-Teacher,.. a failure afterwards." An 
> > English Master, "Sir Thomas" in His Pupil [Cyril Scott], The 
> Initiate 
> > in the Dark Cycle (London: Routledge, 1932), p. 141. "It became 
all 
> > but impossible for him to be used any longer as my medium. "Lord 
> > Maitreya in David Anrias [Brian Ross], Through the Eyes of the
> > > Masters: Meditations and Portraits (London: Routledge, 1932), 
p. 
> > 66. For a metaphysical critique of Krishnamurti's teachings see 
> > Krishnamurti: An Esoteric View of his Teachings. Return to 
> > Text 11. "State how... you received the information from 
> > Brother Jinarajadasa--Our Agent at that time--affirming that he 
had 
> > passed the Initiation during the night that preceded your 
> experience 
> > on waking, at Mt Maunganui." Message from Master Polidorus 
> > Isurenus, June 30, 1975, to Geoffrey Hodson in Sandra Hodson 
> (Comp.), 
> > Light of the Sanctuary: The Occult Diary of Geoffrey Hodson 
> (Manila, 
> > Philippines: The Theosophical Publisher, 1988), p. 265. Return to 
> > Text 12. "The Master M. [El Morya] and K.H. [Kuthumi] 
> > together with the Maha Sahib [the Maha Chohan] will renew the 
> hundred-
> > year cycle of their service through the chelas at Adyar [the 
> > international headquarters of the Theosophical Society]." Goddess 
> > of Liberty, "The Mutable Soul is Entrusted with the
> > > Immutable Spirit," Pearls of Wisdom 23/12 (March 23, 1980), p. 
> > 66. But the backing does not come without critical 
> > evaluation: "Look at those who have had the dispensation of the 
> > Ascended Masters in the Theosophical Society, the Rosicrucian 
> Order, 
> > the Agni Yoga Society, the I AM movement and other forward 
> movements 
> > that have begun to unveil the presence and teachings of great 
> adepts 
> > in the earth. Look at the members of these organizations, 
beloved. 
> > Some have almost become intellectual snobs, for they do not use 
the 
> > teachings to challenge the forces of Darkness in the earth but 
only 
> > to elevate themselves as the wise ones, for they have such and 
such 
> > teaching that other earthlings do not have. This was never the 
> > Brotherhood's intent in the founding of esoteric organizations." 
> > Mighty Victory, "Becoming more of God Day by Day," Pearls of 
Wisdom 
> > 37/32 (August 7, 1994), pp. 376-377. Return to Text 13. 
> > Kuthumi wrote in 1975: "In the past we have had to withdraw
> > > our support from those who were given the opportunity to 
> represent 
> > us. The one who for a time had the opportunity of representing 
the 
> > master Djwal Kul soon lost that authority through intellectual 
> pride 
> > and the brittleness of the lower mental body, which can never be 
> the 
> > channel of the mind of God. Thus I expose to you the false 
> teachings 
> > subtly woven into the work of Alice Bailey, whose failure to 
> > surrender totally rendered her unfit as an instrument of the 
> Tibetan 
> > Master." Kuthumi, "An Exposé of False Teachings" Pearls of Wisdom 
> > 19/5 (February 1, 1976), p. 28. (Relevant Paragraphs) Return to 
> > Text 14. "The Roerichs set forth the word of Morya destined 
> > to reach both the Russian and the American people with the energy 
> and 
> > the enlightenment that should deter the red dragon of World 
> > Communism." El Morya, The Chela and the Path, p. 122. (Relevant 
> > Paragraphs) Return to Text 15. Thus the stage was left 
> > for all kinds of black magicians and their ilk to
> > > play out their nefarious plots. Chief amongst them were the 
> German 
> > Nazis, whose involvement in the occult and borrowing from 
Theosophy 
> > has been well documented. See for example Nicholas Goodrick 
Clarke, 
> > The Occult Roots of Nazism (New York: New York University Press, 
> > 1985); Dusty Sklar, The Nazis and the Occult (New York: Dorset 
> Press, 
> > 1977); and the more speculative, but from an esoteric point of 
view 
> > more interesting, The Spear of Destiny (New York: Putnam, 1973) 
by 
> > Trevor Ravenscroft. The contrast between the expectations for 
> > humankind as presented in endnotes 2 and 6, and what actually 
> > happened indicates that we have to face up to a tragedy of 
immense 
> > proportions. Return to Text 16. For a basic overview of 
> > the history and teachings of the "I AM" Movement see Charles S. 
> > Braden, These Also Believe: A Study of Modern American Cults and 
> > Minority Religious Movements (New York: Macmillan, 1949), pp. 257-
> > 307. Return to Text 17. This is the pivotal
> > > statement connecting on one side the story of the Adepts' 
> > involvement with the Theosophical Society and Krishnamurti from 
> 1875 
> > till 1929, and on the other side the story of Their involvement 
> with 
> > the Ballards, Innocente and the Prophets from 1930 till the 
> present. 
> > The rationale of the Masters' changing allegiance to their 
embodied 
> > representatives is as follows: "The Ascended Masters are the 
> > authority of the true teacher and the true messenger. We release 
> the 
> > energy, the light, the teaching, the initiations, and the 
> discipline 
> > to and through our representatives. If at any time the teacher or 
> the 
> > messenger who has surrendered his human will to the divine will 
> > should elect to take back that human will, our dispensation will 
> > terminate. The light...would be withdrawn and the trained 
disciple 
> > would receive the certain sign of hierarchy that the instrument 
had 
> > become a dry reed, hollow and without the authentic vibration and 
> > backing of the entire Spirit of the Great White
> > > Brotherhood... . Stand beneath the waterfall and receive 
> > unreservedly the flow of the hierarchy of Aquarius that comes 
> through 
> > our embodied messengers. When the waterfall ceases to flow, move 
> on, 
> > for hierarchy will not be stopped. We will open another stream 
and 
> > prepare a channel for the crystal-clear waters of life." 
> > Kuthumi, "An Exposé of False Teachings," Pearls of Wisdom 19/5 
> > (February 1, 1976), p. 29. (Relevant Paragraphs) Return to 
> > Text 18. "In the 1930s came the twin flames Guy W. Ballard 
> > and Edna Ballard imparting the sacred mystery of the law of the I 
> AM, 
> > further knowledge of hierarchy, the invocation of the sacred 
fire, 
> > and the path of the ascension." El Morya, The Chela and the Path, 
> > p. 122. (Relevant Paragraphs) Return to Text 19. "At its 
> > apex in the late thirties, it must have represented the greatest 
> > popular diffusion Theosophical concepts ever attained... . One 
> cannot 
> > but admire the effectiveness with which Ballard presented in a
> > > truly popular and American manner the basic teaching and sense 
of 
> > wonder which underlies Theosophy." Robert S. Ellwood, Jr., 
> > Religious and Spiritual Groups in Modern America (Englewood 
Cliffs: 
> > Prentice Hall, 1973), p. 121. Return to Text 20. J. 
> > Gordon Melton, "The Church Universal and Triumphant: Its Heritage 
> and 
> > Thoughtworld," in Church Universal and Triumphant In Scholarly 
> > Perspective, edited by. J.R. Lewis and J. Gordon Melton 
(Stanford: 
> > Center for Academic Publication, 1994), pp. 13-14. Return to 
> > Text 21. El Morya wrote in 1954: "The condition of the 
> > consciousness of seekers after Truth warranted the opportunity to 
> > find peace in the comradeship of the Masters, without homage to 
> > personality. It was my thought to give such opportunity, letting 
> the 
> > balm of the Presence, the joy of the Masters' friendship and the 
> > freedom of conscience which such an Open Door would allow, to 
flow 
> > freely to all life, without requiring allegiance to any human 
form."
> > > Thomas Printz (El Morya), The First Ray (Mount Shasta, CA: 
> > Ascended Master Teaching Foundation, 1986: originally published 
by 
> > the Bridge to Freedom in 1954), p.31. Return to Text 22. 
> > In an academic study, conducted by a group of religious scholars, 
> > some notable conclusions regarding Elizabeth Clare Prophet and 
> Church 
> > Universal and Triumphant were presented. In the introduction one 
> can 
> > read that "many of the contributions to the present volume are 
> shaped 
> > by, or at least address, the various accusations that have been 
> > leveled against Church Universal and Triumphant over the years. 
> Some 
> > of us, and perhaps most of us who participated in the study, 
> brought 
> > certain negative stereotypes along with us on our first trip to 
> > Montana [where the Church has its headquarters]. Yet, once there, 
> our 
> > preconceptions quickly evaporated in the encounter with a group 
of 
> > generally very likable, intelligent, flesh-and-blood human 
> > beings. ... Beyond simple positive intentions, I
> > > think they have managed to establish one of the most 
> intrinsically 
> > interesting religious communities to come into being in this 
> century. 
> > The range and complexity of their worldview, just to mention one 
> > facet of the Church, deserves a half-dozen studies of the length 
we 
> > have undertaken in the present volume." J.R. 
Lewis, "Introduction," 
> > in Church Universal and Triumphant In Scholarly Perspective, pp. 
> xii-
> > xiii. Return to Text 23. Elizabeth Clare Prophet said in 
> > 1979: "Within a matter of a few weeks [after having met Mark 
> > Prophet], I was crossing a park to Boston University to one of my 
> > courses. And there crossed my path a being of Light that I had 
> never 
> > heard of or seen before. But the moment I saw him, I knew him. It 
> was 
> > the Ascended Master El Morya... . Morya said to me `I have need 
of 
> a 
> > female messenger. Go to Washington and I will train you through 
> Mark 
> > Prophet. If you pass your initiations, Saint Germain will come 
and 
> > anoint you as messenger for the
> > > Ascended Masters.'" Elizabeth Clare Prophet, "I'm Stumping for 
> > the Coming Revolution in Higher Consciousness," Audio-tape no. 
> A7945, 
> > (Corwin Springs MT: The Summit Lighthouse, 1979). Return to 
> > Text 24. The History of the Summit Lighthouse (Livingston MT: 
> > Church Universal and Triumphant, 1994), p. 4. Return to Text 
> > 24a. El Morya said: "I, El Morya Khan, Chief of the Darjeeling 
> > Council, hereby announce the removal of the thread that 
originates 
> > from my mantle to the heart of the messenger to your hearts for 
the 
> > holding of the balance of your lifestreams. The dispensation of 
> this 
> > thread, which is a thread of protection, was made possible 
because 
> of 
> > the codes of conduct established and sponsored by me in the past. 
> > Your merit for intercession will now be based upon your own 
decree 
> > momentum, your devotion to your God Presence and your service to 
> > mankind. May you pass every test!" Read by Elizabeth Clare 
Prophet 
> > at a staff meeting on May 13, 1997.
> > > [Last sentence added in 2001] Return to text 25. For 
> > some more background information about these post-Prophet 
> > organizations see "Beyond Guru Ma." [This paragraph was added in 
> 2001 
> > and revised in 2005] Return to Text 26. For a 
> > philosophical-historical discussion of the relationship between 
> > religion and civilization, see Arnold J. Toynbee, Universal 
> Churches, 
> > vol. 7B, A Study of History (London: Oxford University Press, 
> 1954), 
> > pp. 381-544. Return to Text or HOME
> > > 
> > > 
> > > MKR <mkr777@> wrote:
> > > What can you do with people with closed mind? Only time 
> > will open it up.
> > > 
> > > mkr
> > > 
> > > On 2/18/08, Cass Silva <silva_cass@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Isn't it a bit hypocritical that some theosophists feel that 
JK 
> > abandoned
> > > > theosophy, when it was categorically stated in the SD and the 
> > Mahatma
> > > > Letters that organized religion is the root of all evil? Once 
> you 
> > bring in a
> > > > Messiah you are talking about an organized religion.
> > > > Cass
> > > >
> > > > MKR <mkr777@ <mkr777%40gmail.com>> wrote:
> > > > It is the day when Col Olcott died long time ago. It is a 
> > coincidence that
> > > > K
> > > > also died on that day. There is a lot of people who still 
feel 
> > that K
> > > > abandoned the TS and ungrateful and would be opposed to name 
> > anything
> > > > connected with
> > > > K. I was aware of an instance when those in charge of purse 
> > strings
> > > > diplomatically
> > > > refused to fund the travel expenses of a first rate
> > > > lecturer who came to a group of branches to speak about K's
> > > > philosophy. Some times you need to look at the actions to 
read 
> the
> > > > motivation of people.
> > > >
> > > > mkr
> > > >
> > > > On 2/17/08, Cass Silva <silva_cass@ <silva_cass%40yahoo.com>>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks MKR, no wonder he has been on our minds. Just 
> wondering 
> > why TS
> > > > > Adyar would choose K's death date for their annual 
> celebration?
> > > > > Cass
> > > > >
> > > > > MKR <mkr777@ <mkr777%40gmail.com> <mkr777%40gmail.com>> 
> > wrote:
> > > > > Today, February 17 is known as Adyar Day in many parts of 
the 
> > world. It
> > > > is
> > > > > also the day when Krishnamurti passed away. Let us remember 
> all 
> > the
> > > > > theosophists past and present who have sacrificed for the 
> cause.
> > > > >
> > > > > mkr
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------
> > > > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with 
> > Yahoo!
> > > > Search.
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------
> > > > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > >
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > ---------------------------------
> > > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! 
> Mobile. 
> > Try it now.
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ---------------------------------
> > Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! 
Mobile. 
> Try it now.
> > 
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> 
> 
> 
>                          
> 
>        
> ---------------------------------
> Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>