Theos-Talk Archives (February 2008 Message tt00117)

Persona means mask, unmask everyone!



--- MKR <mkr777@gmail.com> wrote:

> Thanks for your msg.
> 
> I understand where you are coming from.  When there
> is cross membership in
> organizations at various levels including leadership
> levels, there is bound
> to be very subtle actions and unspoken pressures
> that one may not see aimed
> at conformity with policies.
> 
> I am glad that you have been around TS, Adyar and
> TSA and we all appreciate
> the work you have done for theosophy. As you know,
> in many organizations, if
> you want to move up and have nice titles, given
> opportunities to talk to its
> members etc. on cannot rock the boat. Also it is
> very easy for a few to put
> impediments for one's upward movement and this
> prevents anyone who is wants
> to move up not to rock the boat. When you have time,
> I suggest you may want
> to google the archives of this and other
> theosophical maillists which are
> not moderated or controlled by any organization and
> you will find very
> interesting eye opening issues and facts.
> 
> I am also very glad to know there is a member over
> there who is a priest in
> LCC. It is a good news and I hope we will soon have
> a Woman Popess in LCC..
> 
> By the way, the other organization which has no
> official relationship with
> theosophical organizations is the Co-Masons.  Couple
> of years ago, there was
> an interesting litigation in Colorado, and the
> plaintiffs in the case are
> well known theosophists and the defendents are
> lesser known theosophists.
> You can read the entire final judgement of the US
> Appeals Court by googling
> on the Internet.
> 
> Having said all the above, basic theosophy has
> nothing to do with
> personalities since what finally counts is what
> theosophy has done for us
> personally. Organizations and persons come and go.
> Personally what is very
> important to me is how theosophical writings have
> helped me to deal with
> myself and the world.
> 
> mkr
> 
> 
> On 2/14/08, Pablo Sender <pasender@yahoo.com.ar>
> wrote:
> >
> >   Dear mkr
> >
> > I think what you say is not true. It is only
> prejudice. I'm not a
> > member of the LCC and I've written articles, given
> lectures, conducted
> > workshops and courses, in Enlgish and Spanish, in
> different countries.
> > I've been working at Adyar (the international
> headquarter) for a
> > couple of years and now I'm working at Wheaton
> (the American
> > headquarter). There was never any interference of
> the LCC.
> > On the other hand, what happens in the LCC is not
> a TS matter (but, by
> > the way, in the staff here there is a woman
> priest).
> > So I'm afraid it is again the same. Ungrounded
> statements.
> >
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> <theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com>, MKR
> > <mkr777@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > It is well-known that "officially' there is no
> connection between TS
> > > and LCC and Co-masonry. But, many in leadership
> position in one have
> > > held the leadership position in the other. Also,
> for a newbee, it is
> > > very difficult to reconcile the first object of
> TS and the hierarchy
> > > of LCC. How many women bishops or priests are
> there in LCC? Answer is
> > > none. Also it was an invention after the time of
> HPB. Are there any
> > > mention in HPB's writings or that of MLs
> > > about the future establishment of a Church? Also
> when one is a member of
> > > multiple organization with cross memberships and
> leaderships, it
> > produces
> > > all kinds of subtle strong pressures to conform
> and not to rock the
> > boat if
> > > one wants to move up with titles and get favors
> like
> > > being provided opportunity to be lecturers etc.
> > >
> > > All one needs to do is google the past
> discussions on the theosophical
> > > maillists to get a gist of the varied opinions
> on various
> > > organizational issues and some of it will be
> revealing and as well as
> > > surprising.
> > >
> > > My 0.02.
> > >
> > > mkr
> > >
> > >
> > > On 2/13/08, Pablo Sender <pasender@...> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On what grounds do you say that "It was Besant
> who (with Leadbeater's
> > > > input) turned Theosophy into a religious
> organization through the
> > > > LCC"? In this circle it is fashionable to
> criticize Besant and
> > > > Leadbeater for whatever they did, and most of
> the times the statements
> > > > are unsupported.
> > > > What is the influence of the LCC upon the TS
> today? NONE. That is the
> > > > truth. But, as result of that endeavor in the
> past, there is today in
> > > > the world a Christian church that has a
> theosophical foundation. What
> > > > could be better than that? Since the
> traditional Christianity is
> > > > dying, the LCC could be a wonderful bridge
> between Christianity and
> > > > Theosophy in the future. We cannot expect all
> the Egos with their
> > > > different states of evolution to be interested
> in Theosophy. But the
> > > > LCC might be a very good tool in taking that
> step from Christianity to
> > > > Theosophy. The Mahatmas make their plans in
> terms of hundred of years,
> > > > so we don't know what could the future role of
> the LCC be.
> > > > Anyway, apart from that, the LCC doesn't
> affect the TS at all. The
> > > > over-reactions through the years proved to be
> groundless and based
> > > > only in one thing (as every fundamentalist
> thinking is): Fear.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>
<theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com><theos-talk%40yahoogroups.com>,
> Cass
> >
> > > > Silva <silva_cass@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I can see your point, I think. Have you
> considered that every great
> > > > teacher will have a following. Jesus did not
> start out to set up
> > > > Christianity but to reintroduce the ancient
> wisdom. HPB had her
> > > > advaitees too. It was Besant who (with
> Leadbeater's input) turned
> > > > Theosophy into a religious organization
> through the LCC and the belief
> > > > that a saviour was to return to save mankind.
> He was supposedly
> > > > coming into Sydney Harbour!
> > > > >
> > > > > I agree that many people who follow
> Krishnamurti have an
> > > > intellectual mind set but one cannot blame the
> teacher if the
> > > > followers misunderstand the message. Yes
> organizations were set up
> > > > around him, but did he personally benefit from
> the establishment of
> > > > these organizations? I never saw any trappings
> of wealth around him,
> > > > all I saw, was a man who devoted his life to
> spreading the teaching of
> > > > advaita.
> > > > >
> > > > > I guess we are just going to disagree on
> Krishnamurti as I don't
> > > > place him in the same pot as Besant and
> Leadbeater. Yes, he had
> 
=== message truncated ===



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