Theos-Talk Archives (March 2007 Message tt00220)

Dear Anton,
Thank-you for your encouragement and your very kind offer, I would 
love to see the TS develop along these lines.

However I think this would have to be initiated at a high level 
within the organisation.

As I am not a member any more I can only hope that progress in that 
direction comes about internally.

Kind Regards

Perry

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Anton Rozman" <anton_rozman@...> 
wrote:
>
> Hi Perry,
> 
> You wrote:
> 
> >What I personally would like to see developed in the TS is more 
> scholarly freedom within the publications for all the reasons I 
have 
> discussed here at theos talk.
> 
> Perhaps a journal that allows more penetrating examination of 
> different theosophical ideas much along the lines of Lucifer.
> 
> This is not everyone's cup of tea I realize however there is a 
> definite need for it in my opinion.<
> 
> Then go ahead and start to materialize your idea. It will not be 
for 
> sure an easy job, but I can offer you some of my time, and there 
will 
> be possibly others, more skilled and experienced, who will join the 
> effort.
> 
> Warmest regards,
> Anton
> 
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "plcoles1" <plcoles1@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Anton,
> > You wrote :
> > "I believe that the Theosophical Society was founded with the 
> purpose
> > to spread the knowledge of Theosophy in the world and that the
> > Objects of the Society are the necessary means to accomplish that
> > purpose. In other words, that the "inner" work of the lodge
> > (individual study, lodge meetings and so on) is the preparation 
for
> > its "outer" work, for the interaction with the community."
> > 
> > I agree and I think that really most of the structures are there 
> > within the society to help fulfill those goals.
> > For example the Theosophical Order of Service (TOS) in an avenue 
> with 
> > which people can help promote active altruism, or they can join 
> > institutions already established exclusively along those lines.
> > 
> > Amnesty International is one I was involved with for a short 
period.
> > 
> > As each person will have a different approach to theosophy 
everyone 
> > will resonate more strongly in one area than another.
> > Some are more predisposed to meditation for example; some are 
more 
> > intellectual in their approach, some more artistic ?.
> > 
> > What I personally would like to see developed in the TS is more 
> > scholarly freedom within the publications for all the reasons I 
> have 
> > discussed here at theos talk.
> > 
> > Perhaps a journal that allows more penetrating examination of 
> > different theosophical ideas much along the lines of Lucifer.
> > 
> > This is not everyone's cup of tea I realize however there is a 
> > definite need for it in my opinion.
> > 
> > People should not feel that they are `heretics' because they hold 
> to 
> > certain views either about past teachers (be that HPB, CWL or 
> > whomever), the teachings, historical issues or because of a 
> personal 
> > opinion of what they may feel is wrong with the society as it is, 
> > this surely is something no member should feel threatened by in a 
> > theosophical society.
> > 
> > You wrote :
> > "Nicholas Roerich said something like this: With the creative 
> process
> > there comes the quality of tolerance we need so much. If we 
include
> > the tolerance only conventionally and superficially we create
> > hypocrisy. Only with the noble creative process, with constant
> > realization, comes that wonderful guest: the tolerance."
> > 
> > Great quotation and very apt.
> > 
> > Best Wishes
> > 
> > Perry
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Anton Rozman" <anton_rozman@> 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Perry,
> > > 
> > > Thank you for your thoughts. Let me address the problem you 
> defined 
> > > as the conflict between expansiveness and traditionalism from 
> > another 
> > > perspective.
> > > 
> > > I believe that the Theosophical Society was founded with the 
> > purpose 
> > > to spread the knowledge of Theosophy in the world and that the 
> > > Objects of the Society are the necessary means to accomplish 
that 
> > > purpose. In other words, that the "inner" work of the lodge 
> > > (individual study, lodge meetings and so on) is the preparation 
> for 
> > > its "outer" work, for the interaction with the community. If 
the 
> > > lodge limits itself to the "inner" work then the mentioned 
> problems 
> > > becomes immanent. If instead it opens itself to the community 
it 
> > > necessarily involves itself in some creative process which 
> absorbs 
> > > and directs all the energies towards the ends which transcends 
> > > personal interests of its members.
> > > 
> > > Nicholas Roerich said something like this: With the creative 
> > process 
> > > there comes the quality of tolerance we need so much. If we 
> include 
> > > the tolerance only conventionally and superficially we create 
> > > hypocrisy. Only with the noble creative process, with constant 
> > > realization, comes that wonderful guest: the tolerance.
> > > 
> > > Warmest regards,
> > > Anton
> > > 
> > > 
> > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "plcoles1" <plcoles1@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Thanks Anton, I know that the ES is a point of contention for 
> > some 
> > > > within the TS.
> > > > 
> > > > I personally have not felt that the problems in the TS come 
> > > > specifically from the ES.
> > > > However there is I am sure much I don't know about it.
> > > > 
> > > > I'll try and briefly explain where I feel some of the 
conflicts 
> > > come 
> > > > from, leaving aside the Leadbeater issue.
> > > > 
> > > > One of the problems I think that continues to play itself is 
> that 
> > > > when some new people join the society they feel it is a kind 
of 
> > > > platform for anything and everything.
> > > > 
> > > > When the TS doesn't live up to their expectations of what 
they 
> > > think 
> > > > it should be they can cause quite a bit of turbulence within 
> the 
> > > > branch especially if they have joined with a preexisting 
> agenda, 
> > > like 
> > > > promoting some particular hobbyhorse they may be on at the 
time.
> > > > 
> > > > Then you get those who have been involved with the society 
for 
> > some 
> > > > years, read a lot of the traditional literature of the 
> > > society?.they 
> > > > may appear to newcomers as being stuck in the past or not 
> > > > progressive. 
> > > > 
> > > > On the one side there maybe what seems to be a force of 
> > > expansiveness 
> > > > and on the other traditionalism.
> > > > 
> > > > Expansiveness and traditionalism have this constant grappling 
> > with 
> > > > each other.
> > > > 
> > > > I would suggest both have a place, however both need to use 
> > wisdom, 
> > > > otherwise what you get is either lack of direction and 
purpose 
> on 
> > > the 
> > > > one hand or stagnation and mindless rigidity on the other.
> > > > 
> > > > Sometimes we need to drop some aspects that may no longer be 
> > > > appropriate.
> > > > 
> > > > For example in our branch the speaker used to stand on a 
stage 
> > > > towering above the audience and the president used to sit in 
a 
> > big 
> > > > chair on the stage like a king on a throne.
> > > > 
> > > > This thankfully was changed so that the president sat with 
> > everyone 
> > > > else and the speaker stood on the level with rest of the 
> audience.
> > > > 
> > > > This was a break from the old hierarchical mindset of 
> superiority 
> > > and 
> > > > a movement towards equality and brotherhood at least in 
> symbolic 
> > > > terms as to how the lodge was setup.
> > > > 
> > > > Also the invocation was changed to a more gender sensitive 
and 
> > > > inclusive form, once again a symbol of inclusiveness and 
> equality.
> > > > 
> > > > The other side of the coin is when people want to overturn 
> > > everything 
> > > > simply because its old.
> > > > 
> > > > When we are at a theosophical society set up to study the 
> ANCIENT 
> > > > Wisdom this could be problematic however.
> > > > 
> > > > Theosophy does speak of a spiritual path although I know 
> > > Krishnamurti 
> > > > spoke very eloquently about moving beyond rigid and 
> superstitious 
> > > > ideas about it.
> > > > Just a few thoughts 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Cheers
> > > > 
> > > > Perry
> > >
> >
>