Theos-Talk Archives (November 2006 Message tt01274)

Carl,

I don't know who writes for "Wikipedia" on this issue and takes this illusory vision.   Do you know?  

You have a correct version on the birth of the ULT from Dallas Tenbroeck's
text "Biographical Notes on Robert Crosbie". Let me know if you don't have it. 

Anyway, that which unites Hargrove's  students and Crosbie's , and Purucker's, and Point Loma's, and Pasadena students is far more important, these days, that that which is different in them. 

All of them recognize HPB/Masters as their source, and as time passes the common "Ocean of Theosophy" will unite them all among them, and also to Adyar TS students of classical Theosophy. 


Regards,  Carlos.


 
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Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com

Cópia:

Data:Tue, 28 Nov 2006 04:43:07 -0000

Assunto:Theos-World The origin of ULT?

> The origin of ULT?
> 
> Yesterday I fund this on Wikipedia:
> 
> "In 1906 or 1907 the Theosophical Society in America (Hargrove) gave 
> Robert Crosbie a deed of foundation to found a lodge in Los Angeles. 
> Hargrove can thus be seen as an obstetrician to the United Lodge of 
> Theosophists."
> 
> See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theosophical_Society_in_America_%
> 28Hargrove%29
> 
> Have anyone here any information concerning this? If it's right or 
> not, I do not know, but if it is correct this could very well 
> explain way the ULT in their two "history" books is very negative 
> about Mr. Hargrove and this work. So there must have been a conflict 
> between Crosbie and Hargrove them somewhere around 1908, if this is 
> true. The reason for that Crosbie left Lomaland was contra 
> production, and it would not surprise me if this was the later 
> reason to.
> 
> Two talking examples of how the ULT-people wrote about Mr. Hargrove 
> are:
> 
> "BEFORE PASSING to other phases of twentieth-century Theosophical 
> history, some attention should be given to the general aftermath of 
> the Tingley succession. The claims for Mrs. Tingley's high status 
> rested, as we have seen, upon alleged "written instructions" from 
> Mr. Judge and upon "psychic" impressions or communications received 
> by the eight prominent members, headed by E. T. Hargrove, who 
> arranged and participated in the E.S.T. meeting in New York of March 
> 29, 1896. Of these eight, Hargrove was the first to reverse himself 
> and to repudiate Mrs. Tingley as Judge's successor. In his E.S. 
> pamphlet of May 17, 1896, "An Occultist's Life," he had by 
> implication elevated Mrs. Tingley above even H.P.B. and Judge in 
> respect to her "training and preparation." He was, he 
> explains, "directed" to make these statements concerning Mrs. 
> Tingley. But two years later he is again "directed," this time to 
> reject Mrs. Tingley and to "expose" her. His authority in both cases 
> was "the Master."
> 
> (The Theosophical Movement 1875-1950, chapter XIX, p. 279)
> 
> Isn't this strange? The ULT-"historians" are attacking and 
> criticising Mr. Hargrove for exactly the same thing as Mr. Crosbie 
> did, namely first following K.T. (and publicly announced her as 
> the "Agent of the Master"), and later founded a new society (the ULT 
> is a society, what ever they may claming), and claming that 
> the "authority in both cases was "the Master."
> 
> And:
> 
> "That Mr. Hargrove, as well as Mrs. Tingley, had "high and rare 
> mediumistic and psychic gifts" is indicated throughout his letters, 
> for he tells Mrs. Tingley: "It is by Master's order that I write 
> you"; "by order of the Master you have ceased to be the Outer Head 
> of the E.S.T. in the interior and true sense"; "The Outer Head to 
> follow you has already been appointed by the Master." The 
> circulation of Mr. Hargrove's pamphlet, the legal proceedings begun 
> by him and his associates to test the validity of the action of the 
> Chicago Convention, and the revival of the old Theosophical Forum; 
> with its first number dated February, 1898, containing an account of 
> the Chicago proceedings and the efforts of the "bolters" to continue 
> on the old lines - all these were met by vigorous efforts on the 
> part of the pro-Tingley majority. By the middle of April the first 
> number of The Searchlight; to which we have referred, was out with 
> forty large pages of fine print in an endeavor to counteract the 
> feared effects of the Hargrove revelations. The combined matter of 
> both sides, when sifted and related to the proceedings made public 
> immediately after the death of Mr. Judge in the circulars of March 
> 29 and April 3, 1896, establishes beyond all question that Mrs. 
> Tingley's "successorship" was due, and due only, to the "messages" 
> obtained by virtue of the "high and rare mediumistic and psychic 
> gifts" of Mrs. Tingley, Mr. Hargrove, Mr. Wright, and others -
> "messages" from "Masters," from the dead H.P.B. and the dead W.Q. 
> Judge - not to any "appointment" made by the living William Q. Judge 
> in his own physical handwriting."
> 
> (The Theosophical Movement 1875-1925, pp 680-681)
> 
> And again they are attacking and criticising Mr. Hargrove (and 
> others) for exactly the same thing as Mr. Crosbie did, namely 
> claiming to have contact with "the dead H.P.B. and the dead W.Q. 
> Judge", and to have received "messages" from "Masters". So, was then 
> Mr. Crosbie a Medium too? As one can see here, he must have been! If 
> not, Mr. Crosbie laid. 
> 
> Carl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 
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