Theos-Talk Archives (November 2006 Message tt00792)

-I have no quest book , but the original from TPH Adyar
Other question:
If we read the conqueror stories of that Red Indians,Spains and so 
on who conquered South America,are they good civilized people?
Also the whites are not always, the only thing I can say Leadbeater 
better could not write is that the blank is the superior race.
That is not at all.
Christina











-- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "'Cuervo'" <Kensmall@...> wrote:
>
> Carlos - Christina et al -
> 
> The publishing policy at Quest Books initiated by Helen Zahara 
when 
> she came around 1970 was to edit out all negative racial and 
ethnic 
> comments, especially in the writings of Leadbeater, though I think 
> also in Jinarajadasa's introductory book on Theosophy. There are 
> examples in most of CWL's writings, but it is difficult to find 
the 
> originals of some to compare with.
> 
> Ken
> 
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "carlosaveline" 
> <carlosaveline@> wrote:
> >
> > Christina,
> > 
> > Please look at the  pages 167 and 168 of your "The Perfume of 
> Egypt", TPH 1978 edition, and you will find these quotations which 
I 
> comment below:
> > 
> > 
> > ooooooooo
> > 
> > Leadbeater says about "red indians": 
> > 
> > "Of these many tribes had adopted a kind of squalid 
civilization, 
> but many others were still savages untamed and untamable ? men who 
> regarded work of any kind as the deepest degradation ? who hated 
the 
> white man with a traditional, unrelenting hatred, and (strange as 
it 
> may seen) more than reciprocated the boundless contempt of the 
blue-
> blooded hidalgo of Spain. It will be no doubt incomprehensible to 
> many of us that a half-naked savage can entertain any other 
feeling 
> than envy for our superior civilization, however much he may 
dislike 
> us; but I can only say that the quite genuine and unaffected 
feeling 
> of the Red Indian towards the white man is pure and unmitigated 
> contempt." 
> > 
> > But CWL proceeds (p. 168) to develop his unbrotherly view of 
human 
> beings: 
> > 
> > "Then came the negro race ? no inconsiderable portion of the 
> populations, and chiefly in a state of slavery, though the 
> Government was doing all in its power to remove that curse from 
its 
> territories; and last and worst came what were called the half-
> breeds or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed, as mixed races 
> sometimes do, to combine all the worst qualities of both its 
parent 
> stocks. Indians, Spaniards, and Negro alike despised them; and 
they 
> in turn regarded all alike with a virulent hatred." 
> > 
> > We can see in these words some strong `pioneer elements' for the 
> future ideologies of Nazism and Fascism, and ultimately for the 
mass-
> murder attemtps of "ethnic cleansing". Look at it again: 
> > 
> > " (...) and last and worst came what were called the half-breeds 
> or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed (...) to combine all 
the 
> worst qualities of both its parent stocks." 
> > 
> > This is Leadbeater. 
> > 
> > Brazil has been from the very beginning a miscigenation people 
and 
> indigenous people here never present resintence or hated the white 
> people. Their culture was too primitive for that, say. We have 
never 
> had important racial tensions or hatred in Brazil, aas such, 
though 
> there was social violence. 
> > 
> > Miscigenation is part of the preparation for the next sub-race, 
as 
> HPB writes in the "Secret Doctrine".  
> > 
> > Regards,  Carlos. 
> > 
> > De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > 
> > Para:"theos-talk" theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > 
> > Cópia:"carlosaveline" carlosaveline@
> > 
> > Data:Mon, 13 Nov 2006 11:00:40 -0300
> > 
> > Assunto:[Spam] Theos-World CWL AGAINST BLACK AND INDIGENOUS 
PEOPLES
> > 
> > > Dear Friends, 
> > > 
> > > This is about Bishop Leadbeater and his imaginary adventures 
in 
> South America. 
> > > 
> > > C. Jinarajadasa believed he was there with Leadbeater in a 
> previous body, and that he was his biological younger brother, who 
> was allegedly killed and 'rediscovered' by CWL in Ceylon. 
> > > 
> > > In fact, in a footnote to his autobiographical Postface in the 
> book "The Seven Veils of Consciousness", C. Jinarajadasa states 
that 
> that the true story of his own "previous (and glorious) death in 
> Brazil" is narrated in the chapter "Saved by a Ghost", of the 
> book "The Perfume of Egypt" (2). 
> > > 
> > > C.J. believed everything CWL said, and he also writes in the 
> note that the same old silver crucifix which is mentioned in that 
> story was in his possession, as he wrote "The Seven Veils of 
> Consciousness". 
> > > 
> > > As to Leadbeater, in the preface of his 'The Perfume of 
Egypt", 
> he makes a solemn statement: 
> > > 
> > > "The stories in this book happen to be true." 
> > > 
> > > Along "Saved By a Ghost", the longest story of the volume, 
> Leadbeater proudly describes how he killed numerous black people 
and 
> indigenous people in South America during his youth. 
> > > 
> > > Of course, common sense says that the story is as illusory as 
> the visits Leabeater made to physical plane civilizations in Mars 
> and Mercury. 
> > > 
> > > But even if it were presented as a `short novel' pure and 
> simple, and not as an autobiographical narration, the content of 
the 
> text reveals too much of racism and disrespect against black 
people, 
> indigenous people and their right to live. Leadbeater also uses 
the 
> term "race" not in its theosophical meaning, but in the 
> nationalistic way, as if each country had its own 'race', 
> anticipating what Adolf Hitler would do decades later. 
> > > 
> > > At p. 167 of the Adyar edition, one starts to read his 
> description of Brazilian people: 
> > > 
> > > "First came the descendants of Spanish and Portuguese 
> conquerors ? a haughty, indolent race; a race courtly and 
> hospitable, by no means without its good qualities, but yet one 
> whose strongest characteristic was an immeasurable contempt (or 
the 
> affectation of it) for all other races whatsoever". 
> > > 
> > > The amount of illusions-per-line is outstanding here. 
> > > 
> > > First, Spanish people were never `conquerors' in Brazil. The 
> country was `discovered' and made a colony by Portugal. Second, 
> Portuguese people are not a race; and they cannot be easily 
> described as `indolent'. Third, Portuguese people generaly did not 
> show `contempt' for other `races', and it is for this reason that 
> miscigenation ? intermarriage ? was from the first the main 
> anthropological characteristic of the emerging Brazilian nation. 
> Portuguese people easily created strong personal links with black 
> people and indigenous people. (Of course, colonization was also 
> violent.)
> > > 
> > > In the next paragraph, "bishop" Leadbeater is even more 
> surprising: 
> > > 
> > > "Next came red indians". 
> > > 
> > > Well, there are no `red indians' in Brazil, although the term 
is 
> very common in old North American Far West bang-bang stories, in 
> which hundreds of "bad" Indians get typically killed by a few 
white 
> men usually presented as brave heros. 
> > > 
> > > Leadbeater says about "red indians": 
> > > 
> > > "Of these many tribes had adopted a kind of squalid 
> civilization, but many others were still savages untamed and 
> untamable ? men who regarded work of any kind as the deepest 
> degradation ? who hated the white man with a traditional, 
> unrelenting hatred, and (strange as it may seen) more than 
> reciprocated the boundless contempt of the blue-blooded hidalgo of 
> Spain. It will be no doubt incomprehensible to many of us that a 
> half-naked savage can entertain any other feeling than envy for 
our 
> superior civilization, however much he may dislike us; but I can 
> only say that the quite genuine and unaffected feeling of the Red 
> Indian towards the white man is pure and unmitigated contempt." 
> > > 
> > > What are the problems in these few lines? First, again comes 
the 
> Spanish `hidalgo' (nobleman) apparently ruling Brazil, a country 
> which was independent from Portugal (not Spain), since 1822, and 
was 
> never under any "Spanish' ruling class. Second, the `red Indian' 
> again. Third, indigenous people and did not express hate against 
> white people, and never actively resisted the domination of 
European 
> rulers in Brazil. These two paragraphs simply can't refer to any 
> South American country. 
> > > 
> > > But CWL proceeds (p. 168) to develop his unbrotherly view of 
> human beings: 
> > > 
> > > "Then came the negro race ? no inconsiderable portion of the 
> populations, and chiefly in a state of slavery, though the 
> Government was doing all in its power to remove that curse from 
its 
> territories; and last and worst came what were called the half-
> breeds or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed, as mixed races 
> sometimes do, to combine all the worst qualities of both its 
parent 
> stocks. Indians, Spaniards, and Negro alike despised them; and 
they 
> in turn regarded all alike with a virulent hatred." 
> > > 
> > > We can see in these words some strong `pioneer elements' for 
the 
> future ideologies of Nazism and Fascism, and ultimately for the 
mass-
> murder attemtps of "ethnic cleansing". Look at it again: 
> > > 
> > > " (...) and last and worst came what were called the half-
breeds 
> or half-castes ? a mixed race which seemed (...) to combine all 
the 
> worst qualities of both its parent stocks." 
> > > 
> > > This is Leadbeater. 
> > > 
> > > But -- what about Theosophy? What does esoteric philosophy 
> really say about the relations between rich and poor nations and 
> among all different ethnical groups, with their varied kinds of 
> colours in the skin? In the "Letters from the Masters", the famous 
> letter known as coming from the "Great Master" says: 
> > > 
> > > "To achieve the proposed object, a greater, a wiser, and 
> especially a more benevolent intermingling of the high and the 
low, 
> of the Alpha and the Omega of Society, was determined upon. The 
> white race must be the first to stretch out the hand of fellowship 
> to the dark nations, to call the poor despised `nigger' brother. 
> This prospect may not smile to all, but he is no Theosophist who 
> objects to his principle" (2) 
> > > 
> > > One can only conclude, then, that in writing that paragraph 
> Leadbeater was "no theosophist". 
> > > 
> > > In fact, Leadbeater's vision of human beings as presented in 
> that long story is not only ethically and culturally unacceptable. 
> It is also legally criminal, for racism and stimulation of hatred 
> among people of different skin-colours has been defined as crime 
in 
> Brazil a few years ago. 
> > > 
> > > One can understand why the Brazilian edition of "Saved By a 
> Ghost" cannot be found in Brazilian bookshops any longer. Yet it 
is 
> still for sale at Adyar, it seems. 
> > > 
> > > ( In another posting, I should refer to Leadbeater's proudly 
> alleged acts of violence leading to death, which, even if seen as 
> fictional, are profoundly untheosophical. ) 
> > > 
> > > Best regards, Carlos. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > NOTE:
> > > 
> > > (1) "The Perfume of Egypt", by C. W. Leadbeater, whose sixth 
> edition (TPH Adyar, 265 pp.) is dated 1978. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > (2) "Letters From the Masters of the Wisdom", compiled by C. 
> Jinarajadasa, Adyar TPH, first series, Letter number one, known 
> as `the Maha-Chohan Letter' or "the Great Master Letter'. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
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