Theos-Talk Archives (August 2006 Message tt00438)

DTB,

Thank you so very much for your input.

1. Animal Group Soul. I came across this in Annie Besant's "The Ancient Wisdom," p. 210, for instance. She refers to it as "monadic group soul."

2. Human [physical] Brain evolvement, Frontal Lobe. I understand you to say that essentially that as our physical frontal lobes are (for want of a better word) formed by the astral, that this [where the frontal lobe is situated] is where the skandhas congregate and since we can accumulate more as we progress then naturally they will need more space and so our frontal lobes increase in size on the physical plane. This is new to me and very interesting to me. I had had a general understand of the skandhas/karma but had never thought about where they would physically reside. [just in my mind :)]

In the back and forth discussion that I had it just came as a surprise to me that apparently present-day science sees humans and animals as the same except for the larger frontal lobe in humans. And so then I was curious if we knew what brought this about--and also if that is the only difference. 

As I said, from my theosophical studies I wasn't used to looking at [merely] the physical but rather the spiritual and intellectual. Where I had thought there was "physical overlap" was reference to the pituitary body and the pineal gland operation [and the old third eye mechanism].

Best Regards,
Scribe

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: W.Dallas TenBroeck 
  To: AA-BNStudy 
  Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 11:37 AM
  Subject: Theos-World RE: Difference between humans and animals?


  8/15/2006 6:59 AM

  Re: Difference between humans and animals?

  Dear Friends and "Scribe:":

  We are asked to study the "original teachings" of THEOSOPHY on the "Brain."
  And not another's opinions, which may NOT entirely encourage you to your own
  independent thought. 
  Further, how do those 'opinions' agree with that which THEOSOPHY teaches?
  As a preliminary we have to be sure we know what THEOSOPHY teaches as facts:
  [see S D I 157-8; II 596, study KEY TO THEOSOPHY (HPB) and OCEAN OF
  THEOSOPHY. ]

  As a student, THEOSOPHY teaches one ought to be continually asked to verify
  by independent research and thought and statement made. Make no snap or
  hurried judgments, and accept no "authority that might keep one ignorant of
  the underlying sources and logic that gives cause and reason for any
  statement or inquiry. And ought not to accept or seek for an incomplete
  solution to the problem. There are no "quick fixes." True THEOSOPHY has
  only one answer for every specific query or tenet..

  I would say: Your "trust and faith" have to be built on your own study and
  understanding - thus our personal Kama-Manas is self-transformed into our
  "BUDDHI-MANAS or Higher Manas. Uncertainty thus becomes the WISDOM of a
  knowledge confirmed universally and impersonally, and is purified of any
  "personal" element.

  I believe we are asked to remember that THEOSOPHY is a record of very
  ancient research 
  [S D I 272-3]. And all statements it makes have to dovetail with all
  others logically. They cannot remain as enigmas or doctrines to be adopted
  without further deep examination.

  The reason we live many lives is that the whole of Evolution is more that
  one life, but involves, as a learning process, many lives under he laws of
  Karma and Reincarnation. We are always given the option of selecting the
  rate of our learning, and developing the care and persistence with which we
  do that. 

  It is given as "a granted," that our desire (Kamic) nature may protest these
  fresh restrictions and seek to restore a care-free (apparently) -- to it, a
  pleasant state of irresponsible bliss ! -- but that is NOT the Universe's
  or Nature's "Way," or the Path to true Initiation along the commonly
  travelled pilgrimage called by some: to Supreme Perfection. 

  In this Kama-Manas (Lower Manas) is found to be transforming itself by its
  own efforts into BUDDHI-MANAS, (or the WISE, INDIVIDUAL HIGHER MIND. 

  Wisdom is not owned by any one persona or any one group. It cannot be
  bought, nor can it be enforced. For those who desire to discover for
  themselves the MIDDLE PATH that leads to ultimate TRUTH -- it has been
  suggested we study the VOICE OF THE SILENCE (HPB), then, PATANJALI'S YOGA
  SUTRAS (one of the most valuable and complete studies of psychology), and,
  the BHAGAVAD GITA (Krishna) . These three small books are most profound
  and useful and, I would say: they have to be frequently reviewed. 

  -------------------------------

  1

  Example:

  What forms the "frontal brain lobes?" Name those "lobes" for accuracy.

  Is not the astral brain made up of electro-magnetic forces the source of the
  physical as also of the entire physical body and all that relates to it?

  Is not the same astral brain constituted of "life atoms" (or MONADS) which
  cluster around my individuality and have through that attraction become "my"
  responsibility morally at the moment of any choice ? Those are colored and
  become "skandhas." They are memory records, imperishably inscribed and are
  the carriers of our "good and bad Karma." 

  ----------------------------------------

  2 You ask:

  "And, if it's true that animals have A GROUP SOUL and when they die 
  they morph back into that group soul? (Just sounds kind of sad, 
  that's all.)"

  I have not found HPB or Masters writing about a "group soul." Or have they?
  What does that mean? A "tendency ?" Or a level of general intelligence and
  consciousness ? 

  Or is a phrase intended to distinguish the lack of Individual
  Self-Consciousness from the stage or plane of pure, irresponsible Kamic
  intelligence (as found in the animals), vis-a-vis the Manasic stage of
  development signalized in humankind by the "Lighting up of Manas" 
  [ S D I 75-8, 203, 233, 234 fn, 247, 609; S D II 254-5, 69, 92, 150,
  189, 660, 272; 
  HPB Articles II 140 -- ELEMENTALS, ]

  It is said: "Once a Man, always a Man." There is no return to an oblivion
  of the responsibilities of the Manasic (mind) stage of educative progress.
  We are now in a stage that will lead us to study ever more carefully the
  impact (moral and ethical) of our choices - and all choices have some
  degree of attention from a living, active mind. 

  We are reminded of the statement to be found in S D II 167 :

  "We now come to an important point with regard to the double evolution of
  the human race. , or the spiritual Dhyanis, had become "intellectual"
  through their contact with matter, because they had already reached, during
  previous cycles of incarnation, that degree of intellect which enabled them
  to become independent and self-conscious entities, on this plane of matter.
  They were reborn only by reason of Karmic effects. 

  They entered those who were "ready," and became the Arhats, or sages,
  alluded to above. This needs explanation. 

  It does not mean that Monads entered forms in which other Monads already
  were. They were "Essences," "Intelligences," and conscious spirits; entities
  seeking to become still more conscious by uniting with more developed
  matter. Their essence was too pure to be distinct from the universal
  essence; but their "Egos," or Manas (since they are called Manasaputra, born
  of "Mahat," or Brahma) had to pass through earthly human experiences to
  become all-wise, and be able to start on the returning ascending cycle. 

  The Monads are not discrete principles, limited or conditioned, but rays
  from that one universal absolute Principle. The entrance into a dark room
  through the same aperture of one ray of sunlight following another will not
  constitute two rays, but one ray intensified. It is not in the course of
  natural law that man should become a perfect septenary being, before the
  seventh race in the seventh Round. Yet he has all these principles latent in
  him from his birth. Nor is it part of the evolutionary law that the Fifth
  principle (Manas), should receive its complete development before the Fifth
  Round. 

  All such prematurely developed intellects (on the spiritual plane) in our
  Race are abnormal; they are those whom we call the "Fifth-Rounders." Even in
  the coming seventh Race, at the close of this Fourth Round, while our four
  lower principles will be fully developed, that of Manas will be only
  proportionately so. This limitation, however, refers solely to the spiritual
  development. The intellectual, on the physical plane, was reached during the
  Fourth Root-Race. Thus, those who were "half ready," who received "but a
  spark," constitute the average humanity which has to acquire its
  intellectuality during the present Manvantaric evolution, after which they
  will be ready in the next for the full reception of the "Sons of Wisdom." 
  S D II 167-8

  ------------------------------------------------

  I hope this may be of help,

  DTB

  =====================

  -----Original Message-----
  From: 
  On Behalf Of scribe_rs
  Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 2:09 PM

  Subject: Difference between humans and animals?

  Hello, friends,

  On another forum I got involved in the old "Darwinism vs. 
  Creationism" debate by simply saying that I thought ID ("intelligent 
  design") should be looked at seriously and scientifically because I 
  thought it made sense, that everywhere there's design and order, 
  etc. I didn't want to go into it deeper but of course I was attacked 
  viciously by the Darwinist / 'Science' acolytes and it became a Big 
  Deal, you know how that goes.

  I won't go into the usual litany they threw at me but I do want to 
  share with you one point that was brought up that stuck in my mind 
  and ask if anybody here can throw some more light on it.

  The other side said that the only difference between animal and man 
  is man's large frontal lobe.

  Now my studies are predominately through the spiritual aspects and 
  I'm not used to looking at the physical evolutionary side. I went to 
  my library of HPB, Besant and Purucker for references to "brain" and 
  came away with the impression that that statement might be pretty 
  close, or at least as far as any physical difference is concerned, 
  between man and animal. 

  Also, in that investigation, I was reminded that animals have a 
  group soul whereas man has an individual soul.

  I'm asking if you know of more physical differences between animal 
  and man besides the enlarged frontal lobe? (They were very adamant 
  about that; apparently that is what is being taught in science class 
  nowadays.)

  And, if it's true that animals have a group soul and when they die 
  they morph back into that group soul? (Just sounds kind of sad, 
  that's all.)

  thanks,
  scribe
  .



   

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