Theos-Talk Archives (May 2006 Message tt00934)

That is indeed CURIOUS, Cass.

Viracocha, the white, beared man:
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Vault/9054/viraco.html

The more if you read with the Old High German key:
vera cota = the true god.

It will be more clear if you use the sentence 
before your quote as a key.

OHG Quez al coto = all knowing god.

Quezalcoto/Viracocha/Verakotscha/Wotan/Vatan is 
the same OHG deitic creation emanation.

Bla vat sky = the angelic messenger knew this and 
was the creator of a new age.

It is stated in the Book of Dzyan.

Dzyan is the 
Teutan/teut-ahn/teut-anu/teut/teot/deus/teotl/theos/thot/zeus/zion, 
the highest god of the old Germans in the 
Mecklenburg area.

Frank


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cass Silva" <silva_cass@yahoo.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 4:16 AM
Subject: Re: Theos-World CASS, SOCRATES AND 
VIRACHOCHA


You might like to educate me Carlos.   Vishnu, 
Dagon (Logos or Parabrahman). "It is curious that 
Viracocha, the Supreme Being in Peru, means, 
literally translated, "foam of the sea."  IUP259
Cass

carlosaveline <carlosaveline@terra.com.br> wrote: 
Cass,

You know nothing about my library.

Try discuss Virachocha and you will see.

Carlos.


De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com

Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com

C�pia:

Data:Mon, 29 May 2006 21:58:00 -0700 (PDT)

Assunto:[Spam] Re: Theos-World CASS and the NOUS

> Carlos,
> With respect, I am convinced that you spent your 
> past lifetime at the feet of Socrates as no 
> amount of evidence will budge you. So be it.
>
> Cass
>
> carlosaveline wrote: Cass,
>
> NOUS is the higher self, and Socrates's Daimon 
> was basically his own NOUS.
>
> I have been quoting HPB to try to tell you that 
> for a few weeks now.
>
>
> Regards, Carlos.
>
> De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>
> Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>
> C�pia:
>
> Data:Sun, 28 May 2006 20:51:00 -0700 (PDT)
>
> Assunto:[Spam] Re: Theos-World Dallas, Socrates 
> & Subba Row
>
> > I thought Nous, was translated as "good at 
> > being a man"? Pure and mixed suggests the 
> > duality of higher and lower mind.
> >
> > Galileo retracted and wasn't persecuted. 
> > Apollonious was not persecuted, he simply 
> > vanished.
> > Cass
> >
> > carlosaveline wrote: Dear Dallas,
> >
> > You quote me: "You ask in conclusion: " So 
> > Socrates� Daimon was his own higher self, 
> > Monad, Atma-Buddhi."
> >
> > Not quite, Dallas.
> >
> > Better then me, let's see, please, H. P. B.'s 
> > words:
> >
> > �The daemonium of Socrates was his nous [in 
> > Greek in the original], mind,
> > spirit, or understanding of the divine in it. 
> > �The nous [in Greek in the
> > original] of Socrates�, says Plutarch, 
> > �was pure and mixed itself with the
> > body no more than necessity required.... (...) 
> > The part that is plunged into
> > the body is called soul. But the incorruptible 
> > part is called the nous and
> > the vulgar think it is within them, as they 
> > likewise imagine the image from
> > a glass [ that is, a mirror ] to be in that 
> > glass. But the more intelligent,
> > who know it to be without, call it a Daemon� 
> > (a god, a Spirit).�
> >
> > (�Isis Unveiled�, H. P. Blavatsky, T.U.P., 
> > Pasadena, CA, USA, 1988, Volume II, 284-285.)
> >
> > Please read "Aplogy of Socrates" and you will 
> > see whether Socrates, Plato'sx master, was 
> > above his time "Mystery Schools", in Ethics 
> > and in Ethics.
> >
> > And remember that persecution is the common 
> > lot of sages in all time -- Seneca, Bruno, 
> > Galilei, Appolonyus, so many others...
> >
> > The story of Subba Row is quite different.
> >
> > Subba Row died at 34 " et pour cause", as the 
> > French saying goes.
> >
> > There were reasons for that.
> >
> > No advanced disciple could do what he did with 
> > regard to HPB and the Master's work. Loyal in 
> > his heart, he lost his body. OK.
> >
> > Best regards, Carlos.
> >
> > De:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >
> > C�pia:
> >
> > Data:Sun, 28 May 2006 07:25:16 -0700
> >
> > Assunto:[Spam] Theos-World RE: Socrates' 
> > Higher Self or "Nous" The E S
> >
> > > 5/28/2006 6:18 AM
> > >
> > > Dear Carlos:
> > >
> > > You ask in conclusion:
> > >
> > > " So Socrates� Daimon was his own higher 
> > > self, Monad, Atma-Buddhi.
> > > "
> > >
> > > Let me offer the following thoughts: It 
> > > seems to me in this case that the
> > > personality we know of historically as 
> > > Socrates had not undergone the
> > > process of Lower-Self [Kama-Manas] 
> > > purification which the "Mystery schools"
> > > in Plato's time still made available.
> > >
> > > I believe he was called "mediumistic" and 
> > > was not therefore in full
> > > Buddhi-Manasic control of the highest aspect 
> > > of his personality
> > > (Kama-Manas).
> > >
> > > Under the rules then in force in Plato's 
> > > time (those of the Mystery Schools)
> > > he had violated (unknowingly to himself) 
> > > these by offering openly some items
> > > that where still most secret.
> > >
> > > Looking for another and more recent example 
> > > of this we can find how shocked
> > > Subba Row was when he was asked by HPB to 
> > > review and edit the first pages of
> > > the SECRET DOCTRINE -- copied by C. 
> > > Wachtmeister and sent to him in Mss. at
> > > Adyar.
> > >
> > > He (I conclude) must have found himself in 
> > > conflict with his own pledges of
> > > secrecy as a Brahman. Yet it is said he had 
> > > the same Guru as HPB.
> > > Apparently even such advanced chelas as SR 
> > > have to develop and exert their
> > > independent Intuition over such matters .
> > >
> > > [ In any case, we are told that HPB had 
> > > "special permission" granted to her
> > > to reveal facts that had hitherto been kept 
> > > ESOTERIC -- see ISIS UNVEILED,
> > > Vol. II, p. 307 top ]
> > >
> > > I will offer an opinion on what happened:
> > >
> > > There is a hint given by HPB, as she says 
> > > that starting with the E S (1888)
> > > a change was given to the direction of 
> > > exoteric theosophical work [The
> > > THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY in Adyar and Olcott 
> > > swayed by the Council, had rejected
> > > her (1885) and the Masters directions and 
> > > methods.] -- and she stated later
> > > that she would be solely responsible for the 
> > > consequences of the changes she
> > > would make, and yet, retain fraternal 
> > > relations with the many sections and
> > > branches of the THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY every 
> > > one of which she declared to be
> > > independent, and united under Col. Olcott, 
> > > as President for Life.
> > >
> > > She lived for 3 years thereafter, and 
> > > designated Judge (with 13 years of
> > > successful chelaship embodied in him) to 
> > > carry on and direct the Esoteric
> > > Section after her passing. His ability and 
> > > power in America caused the
> > > THEOSOPHICAL SOCIETY to expand rapidly and 
> > > spread to some extent Europe and
> > > Australia. Yet he (WQJ) was an ill person 
> > > and had no desire to usurp Olcott,
> > > or to go to Adyar.
> > >
> > > Col. Olcott, though given a charter for the 
> > > Esoteric Section in the East,
> > > chose to have nothing to do with it. A B in 
> > > England and Europe, chose at
> > > first to fully assist judge, but then fell 
> > > (under one of the 'tests' of
> > > chelaship, under a Brahman's dark psychic 
> > > influence, and the psychic
> > > phenomena he produced, and the hints he 
> > > advanced stating that she ought to
> > > begin to doubt HPB's Masters and Judge's 
> > > direct connections to Them, and
> > > their sincerity. More confusion. A B 
> > > discovered Olcott had the same kind
> > > of doubts. They joined forces apparently, to 
> > > open the "Judge Case." .
> > >
> > > All the rest followed -- fired by the single 
> > > fact that never can the
> > > "esoteric" be proved or demonstrated by the 
> > > exoteric.
> > >
> > > No one can PROVE the esoteric to anyone 
> > > else.
> > >
> > > Each has to discover it IN HIMSELF: 
> > > ATMA-BUDDHI the IMMORTAL HIGHER SELF.
> > >
> > > The BUDDHI-MANAS is the MORAL INDIVIDUAL the 
> > > ETERNAL Monad in incarnation.
> > >
> > > All the virtues have to be lived openly and 
> > > observed practically.
> > >
> > > No personal claims have any value.
> > >
> > > I write the above, it being only my opinion 
> > > of the matters based on facts
> > > adduced.
> > >
> > > Best wishes,
> > >
> > > Dallas
> > >
> > > ==========================================================
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: carlosaveline
> > > Sent: Friday, May 26, 2006 8:19 AM
> > > To:
> > > Subject: Socrates' Higher Self or "Nous"
> > >
> > >
> > > Dallas, Friends,
> > >
> > >
> > > H. P. Blavatsky writes in "Isis Unveiled":
> > >
> > > �The daemonium of Socrates was his nous 
> > > [in Greek in the original], mind,
> > > spirit, or understanding of the divine in 
> > > it. �The nous [in Greek in the
> > > original] of Socrates�, says Plutarch, 
> > > �was pure and mixed itself with the
> > > body no more than necessity required.... 
> > > (...) The part that is plunged into
> > > the body is called soul. But the 
> > > incorruptible part is called the nous and
> > > the vulgar think it is within them, as they 
> > > likewise imagine the image from
> > > a glass [ that is, a mirror ] to be in that 
> > > glass. But the more intelligent,
> > > who know it to be without, call it a 
> > > Daemon� (a god, a Spirit).� (1)
> > >
> > > And in the �Mahatma Letters�, this 
> > > statement is confirmed. Writing about
> > > the seventh and sixth principles of human 
> > > consciousness, which form one�s
> > > Monad or higher self, an Adept-Teachers 
> > > explains:
> > >
> > > �Neither Atma or Buddhi ever were within 
> > > man, a little metaphisical axiom
> > > that you can study with advantage in 
> > > Plutarch and Anaxagoras. The latter
> > > made his [ Greek words for �nous� ] the 
> > > spirit self-potent, the nous that
> > > alone recognized noumena whhile the former 
> > > taught on the authority of Plato
> > > and Pythagoras that the semomnius or this 
> > > nous always remained without the
> > > body; that it floated and overshadowed so to 
> > > say the extreme part of the
> > > man�s head, it is only the vulgar who 
> > > think it is within them.� (2)
> > >
> > > In the Christian tradition, the aureoles 
> > > above the heads of Saints, in
> > > their portraits, are unconscious references 
> > > to this fact. (3)
> > >
> > > So Socrates� Daimon was his own higher 
> > > self, Monad, Atma-Buddhi.
> > > Best regards, Carlos Cardoso Aveline
> > >
> > > NOTES:
> > >
> > > (1) �Isis Unveiled�, H. P. Blavatsky, 
> > > T.U.P., Pasadena, CA, USA, 1988,
> > > Volume II, 284-285.
> > >
> > > (2) �The Mahatma Letters to A. P. 
> > > Sinnett�, T.U.P., Letter CXXVII, p. 455
> > > (Letter 72 in the chronological edition, 
> > > TPH, Philippines).
> > >
> > > (3) About the aureoles, see �Mahatma 
> > > Letters�, T.U.P., Letter XXIII-B,
> > > item 9. (Letter 93-B, chronological 
> > > edition).
> > >
> > > ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
> > >
> > >
> > > De:"W.Dallas TenBroeck" 
> > > dalval14@earthlink.net
> > >
> > > Para:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > >
> > > C�pia:
> > >
> > > Data:Fri, 26 May 2006 07:59:59 -0700
> > >
> > > Assunto:[Spam] RE: Socrates
> > >
> > > > 5/26/2006 7:58 AM
> > > >
> > > > Dear Friends:
> > > >
> > > > Having appreciation for Ken's view (below)
> > > >
> > > > Could these ideas also be considered?
> > > >
> > > > INNER EGO.DOC
> > > > ===============
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > November 9, 2005
> > > >
> > > > There are a number of terms used here and 
> > > > one ought to go to the
> > > > THEOSOPHICAL GLOSSARY to secure more 
> > > > accurate description of them. That is
> > > > the starting base we all need. Next would 
> > > > be to go to the SECRET DOCTRINE
> > > > INDEX and look up all the references that 
> > > > throw light on this subject. It
> > > > is best that each student do this work for 
> > > > himself -- there are no
> > > > "short-cuts."
> > > >
> > > > Allow me to offer this to be checked out 
> > > > and considered:
> > > >
> > > > The SPIRIT (ATMA) which is universal (as 
> > > > MAHATMA) already exists as a
> > > basis
> > > > in every smallest aspect of Nature and 
> > > > also in Man, as the ATMA [a "Ray"
> > > of
> > > > the ABSOLUTE] is the base for the 6 + 3 
> > > > other principles which extend
> > > > between SPIRIT and the "MATTER." of which 
> > > > our physical body is a
> > > > representative.
> > > >
> > > > Our Consciousness is ONE. Yet it is said 
> > > > to pierce up and down the 7
> > > planes
> > > > of being and serves to uphold the memory 
> > > > of the Souls' experience on any
> > > > plane and in every state. The vehicle USED 
> > > > BY THIS One Consciousness on
> > > > any plane or any state of matter, depends 
> > > > on the effort made by the
> > > > Individual to refine and purify the matter 
> > > > that he uses there in each of
> > > > those states or planes.
> > > >
> > > > It seems that our personal life always 
> > > > shields and secretes the moral
> > > > Chooser who is the eternal PERCEIVER 
> > > > [ATMA-BUDDHI] that resides within. It
> > > > is the employer of the human Mind 
> > > > [BUDDHI-MANAS], the Psyche [KAMA-MANAS]
> > > > and Astral-Physical body as its 
> > > > amanuensis. [And these in turn are
> > > composed
> > > > of innumerable immortal Monads, each at 
> > > > its appropriate position in this
> > > > enormous and all encompassing evolutionary 
> > > > scheme [ see S D I 632 ] -- a
> > > > scheme that is based on an individual 
> > > > balance point of exactitude so
> > > > sensitive, that any and all deviations 
> > > > from harmony reverberate throughout
> > > > the vast whole and affect the advance of 
> > > > all the rest.
> > > >
> > > > If this is true, then nothing is 
> > > > unimportant. The "Moment of Choice" is
> > > > always Now, and is a moral imperative 
> > > > which no one can escape.
> > > >
> > > > This is the "magic" or, the WISDOM of the 
> > > > esoteric or that which is called
> > > > "occult wisdom," and, we may try to begin 
> > > > to grasp some of its parameters.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > One might consider that the real "magic" 
> > > > is wisdom and is obtained from
> > > > within, shunning any exoteric practices or 
> > > > "selfish black-magic"
> > > whatsoever.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > By focusing on the Divine ATMA within, we 
> > > > allow the spirit-Life (Jiva) of
> > > > Divine Universal Compassion and Love to 
> > > > work in us and then we may diffuse
> > >
> > > > it amidst neighbours. kin and the rest of 
> > > > humankind. We may, without
> > > > personal expectations, serve the processes 
> > > > of the great Law of Karma.
> > > >
> > > > What is TRUTH for us the "embodied minds"? 
> > > > Is it an endless quest ?
> > > >
> > > > If one takes Karma and Reincarnation into 
> > > > account, and the concept that
> > > the
> > > > REAL MAN is an eternal Monad, the paradox 
> > > > unravels.
> > > >
> > > > An immortal being [Monad (Atma-Buddhi), 
> > > > such as we all are fundamentally
> > > > is not concerned with time -- as it uses 
> > > > many bodies in which to assist
> > > any
> > > > brother Monad (as a reference source) to 
> > > > "perfect" its own Wisdom. This
> > > for
> > > >
> > > > it, is true independence - without losing 
> > > > any of its own heard-earned
> > > wisdom
> > > > and responsibility, it seeks to make of 
> > > > its organism a useful helper in
> > > > Nature�s continual struggle to provide 
> > > > an equilibrated, harmonious flow of
> > > > existence, and assist
> > > > in the process of general evolution. This 
> > > > is brotherhood in action.
> > > >
> > > > It seems to be based on the free gift of 
> > > > mutual assistance and service. An
> > > > example of this kind of sublime SERVICE is 
> > > > offered to us to consider in
> > > > SECRET DOCTRINE, Vol. I, pp. 207-210. 
> > > > There the nature, function and
> > > > devotion of a Planetary Spirit is 
> > > > described.
> > > >
> > > > An impersonal channel of Karma is opened 
> > > > by acting for a just desire, when
> > > > that is seen in another Yogi�s mind. No 
> > > > personal benefit or acquisition is
> > > > expected.
> > > >
> > > > This effort marks the evolution and 
> > > > progress of Nature and the important
> > > > service that each human performs in this 
> > > > process.
> > > >
> > > > Consider the task as outlined in the 
> > > > SECRET DOCTRINE :
> > > >
> > > > It is the process of lifting the whole 
> > > > mass of "matter" up to the
> > > > condition, nature and stature of CONSCIOUS 
> > > > GOD-HOOD.
> > > >
> > > > It is the "gift of mind" passed on by the 
> > > > original and primordial Dhyanis
> > > > to the host of Monads that are "ready." 
> > > > Are they thus not encouraged to
> > > > assume again the true "Gods" that they 
> > > > were before they plunged
> > > > voluntarily again into the experiences of 
> > > > diversified material existence
> > > > (consisting of those Monads which are now 
> > > > entering the period and process
> > > of
> > > > a self-willed development of Manas) where 
> > > > the "maya" of illusion (desires,
> > > > feelings, passions - Kama makes all that 
> > > > is real appear evanescent and
> > > > seemingly incomprehensible.
> > > >
> > > > It appears, when presented with an event 
> > > > or a report, we ought to ask:
> > > "What
> > > > caused this ? What Laws are involved? Why 
> > > > am I involved? What should be
> > > > the ideal reaction?" -- In other words, we 
> > > > have to universalize and
> > > > impersonalize our concepts. One of the 
> > > > best guides will be fund in the
> > > > close study of PATANJALI'S YOGA SUTRAS 
> > > > translated by Mr. W. Q. Judge, and
> > > > The VOICE OF THE SILENCE by H P B . These 
> > > > cause us to delve into causes.
> > > >
> > > > Shall we say: One of the problems is now 
> > > > identified. How do we, as
> > > > embodied
> > > > Minds, forced to work in and use a brain 
> > > > of matter [living Monads], view
> > > the
> > > > period and
> > > > condition of our existence beyond the 
> > > > birth and death of the personality
> > > it
> > > > is now
> > > > living in.? It becomes clear that the 
> > > > Personality of this present
> > > existence
> > > > has limits to its memories and views, but 
> > > > no limits to its intuitive
> > > > potentials. These it derives from the 
> > > > immortal and universal fund of
> > > > "wisdom"
> > > > BUDDHI. Buddhi-Manas is then the "link."
> > > >
> > > > We may well ask ourselves: "How did I 
> > > > derive the knowledge, character and
> > > > capacities I have surrounding me, the 
> > > > Perceiver and the Thinker, as my
> > > > abilities and disabilities? We can 
> > > > logically derive their source as having
> > > > been fashioned in previous lives.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Theoretically, may we consider: our 
> > > > INDIVIDUALITY (ATMA-BUDDHI-MANAS)
> > > > periodically illuminates (when appealed 
> > > > to) with its wisdom the
> > > Personality
> > > > -- when this latter seeks for DIVINE 
> > > > WISDOM. All true wisdom comes from
> > > > within. I (our INDIVIDUALITY) is one with 
> > > > the UNIVERSAL OCEAN of BUDDHIC
> > > > WISDOM which are manifesting through the 
> > > > great LAWS of KARMA, Evolution
> > > > and Eternal Life.
> > > >
> > > > Because our embodied mind is a spark of 
> > > > the UNIVERSAL MIND [or MAHAT] --
> > > > which is an attribute of the ABSOLUTE, 
> > > > there are no barriers that it
> > > cannot
> > > > traverse or planes that it may link to, as 
> > > > needed.
> > > >
> > > > We find it taught that the records of the 
> > > > great Buddha's teachings show us
> > > > that our present limitations and 
> > > > incapacities are explained by the concept
> > > > of "universal MAYA" -- when the UNIVERSE 
> > > > is in its temporary phase of
> > > > "manifestation." The "vestures" come and 
> > > > go as ages of experience pass by
> > > > and we work in and through them - the SELF 
> > > > is always stable and ONE with
> > > the
> > > > WHOLE. But why does this occur? Is not the 
> > > > concept of mutual assistance
> > > and
> > > > cooperation, bathed in the light of 
> > > > COMPASSION ABSOLUTE, a good basic
> > > > reason?
> > > >
> > > > The "maya" is dispersed by the (wisdom) 
> > > > innate to the BUDDHI principle
> > > (when
> > > > linked to MANAS). Every component of 
> > > > Nature (the UNIVERSE in
> > > manifestation)
> > > > has this as a part of its essential 
> > > > constitution.
> > > >
> > > > If we can consider using the designation 
> > > > Monad for these innumerable
> > > > constituents, and grasp the concept that 
> > > > they are of seven "grades" of
> > > > "primordial differentiation," [S D I 
> > > > 570-575] then the Monad that is in
> > > > the human stage (or grade), is at present 
> > > > undergoing the trials and
> > > > tribulations of self-mastery, 
> > > > self-knowledge and learning the unlimited
> > > > extent of its true responsibility.
> > > >
> > > > To consider that the UNIVERSE, as radiated 
> > > > from the ABSOLUTE operates
> > > under
> > > > universal, immutable and compassionate 
> > > > LAWS cannot be demeaning to any
> > > > Monad, since each is a radiation of the 
> > > > same qualities from that one
> > > single
> > > > source? Is it not, for itself, in its 
> > > > essence, an administrator of the
> > > same
> > > > universal impersonal and altruistic LAWS?
> > > >
> > > > Are we not also faced with a seeming 
> > > > paradox, as the material of which our
> > > > evanescent and mayavic forms are composed 
> > > > are themselves Monads each in
> > > its
> > > > own level and place of perfect need. How 
> > > > is this to be regulated in such
> > > an
> > > > incomprehensibly vast SPACE where 
> > > > incomprehensibly small units swarm? --
> > > > Unless each is both a mirror of the grand 
> > > > WHOLE, and in itself, is a
> > > > UNIVERSE to still more minute forms and 
> > > > aspects of LIFE ?
> > > >
> > > > It seems this ever existent balancing 
> > > > point of consciousness, intelligence
> > > > and progress synthesizes the actual work 
> > > > that a period of Manvantaric
> > > > evolution for the entire WHOLE demands. No 
> > > > wonder that a grasp and
> > > > comprehension of this as a pattern, a 
> > > > schema, a living WORK is startling
> > > and
> > > > almost incomprehensible as our present 
> > > > brain-mind equipment is very much
> > > > attached to our recent personalities and 
> > > > their very limited experience
> > > this
> > > > life around.
> > > >
> > > > It seems that what we (as human minds) are 
> > > > discovering this fact and

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